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bil and ted (Billted)
Member
Username: Billted

Post Number: 29
Registered: 09-2003
Posted on Wednesday, January 28, 2004 - 10:15 pm:Edit Post Quote Text Delete Post Print Post Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

I was just wondering everyone recommends using lime, but everytime i have tried it the straw and whatever else with it seems to well... "go to sh!t".

I was wondering if I can just sprinkle some lime on top of the verm casing on the basket.

Does the lime HAVE to be mixed up in the straw?

How much should be used in a bushel basket?

Will it hurt the myc when it pops through the casing if just left on top and watered?

I know lime is good and want to use it, I am just tired of losing tins/baskets because of it. And yes it is horticultural lime.

Also last ahh comment/q: I have been putting verm and cow manure on the bottom of the baskets, I figured this is a good idea since it will hopefully soak up the extra water, but i have not read that it is nessary. Does it clog up the holes on the bottom, thus preventing drainage? What do you guys do?

Sorry about the bunch of q's i just started my first few baskets (corn/straw/cow manure). And just wanted to get some specifics down.
what is this...

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Yogi (Yogi)
Senior Member
Username: Yogi

Post Number: 193
Registered: 01-2003
Posted on Wednesday, January 28, 2004 - 10:53 pm:Edit Post Quote Text Delete Post Print Post Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

The type of lime is very important. you want "hydrated lime" or "pickling lime" Hoffmans makes a good brand and can be found at true value hardware amoung other places. Dolomite lime is bad and should not be used.
Visions recommended adding 4 heapins tablespoons to the pasteurization bath that then gets drained off prior to spawning. You can also add it to the manure that is being pasteurized in a similar proportion by volume (you do the math).I am sure you could sprinkle some lime on the surface to retard mold but I have no idea as to the proportions.
I would also suggest using horse manure as it seems to work beter than cow. as far as lining the bottom with cow manure it seems to me that it might very well obstruct drainage as cow manure is dense and earthy compared to horse manure being more fibrous.you want lots of holes and very good drainage for baskets since you are misting heavily every day as opposed to say a tray or log tek that is not getting as much watering.
I also hope you don't case with straight verm on top. I would suggest a 50/50 verm/horse manure casing on top for ideal growth and mix in some spawn with that layer to get top fruiting.

(Message edited by Yogi on January 28, 2004)
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bil and ted (Billted)
Member
Username: Billted

Post Number: 30
Registered: 09-2003
Posted on Wednesday, January 28, 2004 - 11:48 pm:Edit Post Quote Text Delete Post Print Post Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Well actually I am keeping the baskets in a grow room, kept around 75% humidity. Not too much not too little with a fan blowing all the time. So i am not doing a crazy heavy watering just yet, to not "over water". If I find they are drying out I will do the heavy pouring as posted by visions.

I will check out my lime and see if its the right stuff. I coulda swore it was, but checking will not hurt.

Does anyone else do baskets in a semi humid room?

thanks for the info,
bill
what is this...

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skrewloose (Skrewloose)
Member
Username: Skrewloose

Post Number: 30
Registered: 01-2004
Posted on Thursday, January 29, 2004 - 12:35 am:Edit Post Quote Text Delete Post Print Post Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

How are you using the lime? From your post it sounds as if you may be mixing it in with the straw? If so, I suggest using it in your pasturization bath water. You did pasturize everything correctly right? What method do you use?

As for the manure, if this basket "goes to shit" I would not use it in the next. Go back to the basic tek known to work.

Yes you can lightly sprinkle some lime on top of the casing without harm.

And no disrespect to Yogi but I would not use manure in your top casing layer. Maybe when you get your problems solved but for now this will IMO just complicate the situation and give contams an easy target.

Hope this helps! Good luck!
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Yogi (Yogi)
Senior Member
Username: Yogi

Post Number: 194
Registered: 01-2003
Posted on Thursday, January 29, 2004 - 06:53 am:Edit Post Quote Text Delete Post Print Post Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Baskets may be a bit large to use a humidified chamber.I recall hippie having problems when he tried it that way. They are fairly dense and tend to grow a bit of a surface crust that protects them from contams.
As far as top casing layer, they always seem to yield best with pasteurized horse manure. Coir seems to produce small soggy fruits and actually can contam more. If you pasteurize the manure the same way as the straw with lime and bleach it works well.the lime soprinkling does sound like a good idea but i never knew how much is too much.

(Message edited by Yogi on January 29, 2004)
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Highflyer (Highflyer)
Moderator
Username: Highflyer

Post Number: 1014
Registered: 12-2002
Posted on Thursday, January 29, 2004 - 07:31 am:Edit Post Quote Text Delete Post Print Post Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

they always seem to yield best with pasteurized horse manure

Yogin speaks the truth.

Coir seems to produce small soggy fruits

Ive not seen the same here. Coir works fine for me...but the poo is better.


"I hold it to be the inalienable right of anybody to go to hell in his own way." - Robert Frost
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skrewloose (Skrewloose)
Member
Username: Skrewloose

Post Number: 31
Registered: 01-2004
Posted on Thursday, January 29, 2004 - 08:14 pm:Edit Post Quote Text Delete Post Print Post Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

they always seem to yield best with pasteurized horse manure

Yogin speaks the truth.


I didn't say he was wrong or that I didn't agree, because I do. The point that I trying to get across was to make the tek as simple as possible until he works through his contam problems.
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Hippie3 (Admin)
Board Administrator
Username: Admin

Post Number: 12235
Registered: 02-2001
Posted on Sunday, February 01, 2004 - 03:06 pm:Edit Post Quote Text Delete Post Print Post Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

definitly stay away from cow manure in a casing layer.
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Visions (Visions)
Member
Username: Visions

Post Number: 30
Registered: 05-2002
Posted on Sunday, February 01, 2004 - 04:38 pm:Edit Post Quote Text Delete Post Print Post Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Put the lime with the bleach when you pasturize and drain,,,don't add more after or you may run the risk of burning the mycelia...

When you say it goes to shit,,,where are the contams?,,,On the inside of the basket or on the outside working it's way in?,,,,,,Don't add humidity you want the outside of the basket to naturally be dry like a bale of straw left outside exposed to the air and not covered,,,,If your contams are on the inside---do you add the bleach to the misting water? a pinch of lime in the water is ok too,,,,Don't mist the sides of the basket ONLY the Top...Are your grains completely colonized and clean,,,Don't clog the holes on the bottom of the basket,,,Make sure if you are going to use manure in the baskets that you pasturize just like the straw,,,,it's best to just use the manure on the top casing and nowhere else and it's a lot less mess,,,

Take a fresh look at the Laundry Basket Tek and write down each step in your own words and do it as is before you try to vary,,,Trust me I have tried many ways and the way the Laundry Basket Tek is written is the simplest with the best consistant results....Keep it Simple!

See 99% of the Shroom are growing on the top!...They are growing down from the Top casing,,,No mess and Simple! 6lbs wet Stropharia
Upload

Hawiian Basket---6lbs wet
Upload

Wish I had my new digital camera back then...
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Hippie3 (Admin)
Board Administrator
Username: Admin

Post Number: 12251
Registered: 02-2001
Posted on Sunday, February 01, 2004 - 05:30 pm:Edit Post Quote Text Delete Post Print Post Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

did you notice, Visions,
that your tek is now out front too ?
see http://archives.mycotopia.net/discussite/article.php?31.255
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Caudex (Caudex)
Member
Username: Caudex

Post Number: 43
Registered: 06-2003
Posted on Sunday, February 01, 2004 - 05:43 pm:Edit Post Quote Text Delete Post Print Post Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

WOW...I was always under the impression that you need to keep these things in a humidified grow chamber. You can just leave em out in the open?

Why would you want to avoid from misting the sides of the basket?
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Visions (Visions)
Member
Username: Visions

Post Number: 32
Registered: 05-2002
Posted on Sunday, February 01, 2004 - 06:45 pm:Edit Post Quote Text Delete Post Print Post Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

The straw on the sides dries to make a contam barrier,,,Without water contams won't grow,,,So you keep the water where the mycelium is not where the contams are,,,makes it much easier too,,,just water from the top and excess will drain out the bottom,,,the mycelium likes it moist not wet,,,

If you add humidity chances are the contams will grow on the outside of the straw where the mycelium hasn't colonized yet and the contams will work their way in where it's moist and less Oxygen,,,Most of the contams we fight are Anorobic---they like moist stagnet air,,,

Ever notice a loaf of bread rarely molds in the winter yet in the summer it's covered in a week?,,,Take a freshly baked loaf of bread(in the summer),,,suspend it--no sides touching---it will dry on the outside----wont get any contams yet the inside is still moist,,,,we are doing the same thing here


Look around---The answers are right infront of you---You only have to notice...
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bil and ted (Billted)
Member
Username: Billted

Post Number: 33
Registered: 09-2003
Posted on Sunday, February 01, 2004 - 07:53 pm:Edit Post Quote Text Delete Post Print Post Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

hey visions, thanks for the info. I have just made up 5 baskets with 5 quarts of corn in each. I like to over spawn i guess. Otherwise I am misting with a little bleach in water. If you said that sides should dry a bit, then mine seem to be on their way.

Also yogi pointed out my lime q. I was using the dolomite. Which is the bad kind. I picked up some pickling lime and started to use that. I expect everything will be fine.

I do have the baskets in a slightly humidified room, its around 60% percent. Should i even do that? The baskets seem to be doing fine in it.

ya one more thing, when your watering do you actually mist it or do you "pour" water on the casing... I know you said you were using like a quart of water per basket so i just wanted to figure out how your doing it. And for the record i havent seen any contams yet, crossing fingers.

damn it, make it two. About how long are you waiting for the baskets to colonize? I figured with 5 jars it should be about two weeks, figure right?

thanks for the comments, you guys save me a lot of "testing time".

-billted
what is this...

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Yogi (Yogi)
Senior Member
Username: Yogi

Post Number: 201
Registered: 01-2003
Posted on Sunday, February 01, 2004 - 08:30 pm:Edit Post Quote Text Delete Post Print Post Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

I feel that measure of a quart of water is pretty high unless you live in a very hot and dry climate. You will have to judge for yourself. I would expect pins around 3 weeks after spawning.A humidified room would not be a good idea with this tek though. When you place the plastic over the basket I would cut a few small holes in the bag for ventilation.
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Visions (Visions)
Member
Username: Visions

Post Number: 34
Registered: 05-2002
Posted on Monday, February 02, 2004 - 04:35 am:Edit Post Quote Text Delete Post Print Post Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

You want the water where the mycelium is,,,so extra humidity in the room isn't needed or really wanted,,,

I mist and pour,,,misting allows the straw to absorb more water,,,you don't have to be perfect,,,,mist or pour a little bit on at a time until it runs out the bottom,,,,,

When the mycelium colonizes the casing,,,scratch up the casing really good then only mist and don't let the casing dry but even if you make a mistake and let the casing dry,,,they will still grow,,,but where the casing was dried or compaced down due to watering too hard like by pouring on the water you will notice that it won't pin at that spot,,,,but they will just pop up somewhere else,,,at this point you wont stop them,,,,since you have watered good they will flush very well...putting the clear plastic loosely over the basket right when you know it's going to pin will help from keeping the mushrooms from drying as they grow,,,

Colonize aprox 2 weeks
Pin aprox 3 weeks
Finish 4 weeks almost to the day
Look around---The answers are right infront of you---You only have to notice...
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Highflyer (Highflyer)
Moderator
Username: Highflyer

Post Number: 1057
Registered: 12-2002
Posted on Monday, February 02, 2004 - 04:42 am:Edit Post Quote Text Delete Post Print Post Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Ive always used 1 quart of water per day. Usually misting 3 times using 1/3 quart with a spray bottle.

Scratching the casing surface at 2 weeks is the most important part of the tek that I have seen.

Ive also never used the plastic covering. It is nonessential from what i have seen. Tried using it one time, and all the pins aborted.
"I hold it to be the inalienable right of anybody to go to hell in his own way." - Robert Frost
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Magenta (Magenta)
Member
Username: Magenta

Post Number: 21
Registered: 08-2003
Posted on Monday, February 02, 2004 - 07:01 am:Edit Post Quote Text Delete Post Print Post Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Has anyone tried the basket with Coir and no Dung? Was the Coir sterilized? I hear that's not necesary.
Magenta
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Hippie3 (Admin)
Board Administrator
Username: Admin

Post Number: 12339
Registered: 02-2001
Posted on Monday, February 02, 2004 - 03:53 pm:Edit Post Quote Text Delete Post Print Post Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

i made several without dung.
worked fine too.
coir dries very fast by itself, we recommend mixing it with vermiculite to improve water retention
casing materials should not require sterilization ever, but some do benefit from pasturization.
you can omit that step but the risk is slightly higher.
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Hippie3 (Admin)
Board Administrator
Username: Admin

Post Number: 12340
Registered: 02-2001
Posted on Monday, February 02, 2004 - 03:54 pm:Edit Post Quote Text Delete Post Print Post Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

archive material to baskets tek.

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