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Mycotopia Web Archive Archive Botanicals AYAHUASCA Preparation and use of Ayahuasca (B. caapi + P. viridis) Previous Next

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Topic Author Last Poster Posts Pages Last Post
Attn LeprachaunRedmonkBlodwen_19 1 09-27-03  02:52 pm
Archive through May 20, 2003LeprachaunHippie320 1 05-20-03  01:23 am
Archive through May 31, 2003ArahantLeprachaun20 1 05-31-03  12:33 am
Archive through June 19, 2003RedmonkHippie320 1 06-19-03  12:34 am

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Leprachaun (Leprachaun)
Posted on Thursday, June 19, 2003 - 01:04 am:Edit Post Quote Text Delete Post Print Post Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

I didn't really have a proper purge at all, despite the heavy sediment. There doesn't seem to be any sweat-free way to break up that vine! I can't wait to get my dreams written up next. I'm dying to know what you all think.
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Natura (Natura)
Posted on Thursday, June 19, 2003 - 07:53 am:Edit Post Quote Text Delete Post Print Post Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

I guess "maya.yage.net" should have seasonble fresh vine some time. Try to get Maurice at this shop. This ll help You to get better MAOI juice.

N+
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Leprachaun (Leprachaun)
Posted on Friday, June 20, 2003 - 01:15 am:Edit Post Quote Text Delete Post Print Post Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

a
"White Caapi" (1kg), P. viridis (250g). Vine pieces are about 1 to 1 3/8" thick, 31-32" long, about 300g each. Small piece at the front is 6" long, 75g. Viridis is in 50g bags. All from Maya Ethnobotanicals, Netherlands.
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Leprachaun (Leprachaun)
Posted on Friday, June 20, 2003 - 01:19 am:Edit Post Quote Text Delete Post Print Post Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

b
Close-up of caapi bark.
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Leprachaun (Leprachaun)
Posted on Friday, June 20, 2003 - 01:22 am:Edit Post Quote Text Delete Post Print Post Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

c
Ends of caapi vines.
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Leprachaun (Leprachaun)
Posted on Friday, June 20, 2003 - 01:24 am:Edit Post Quote Text Delete Post Print Post Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

d
Shredded P. viridis.
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Leprachaun (Leprachaun)
Posted on Friday, June 20, 2003 - 01:26 am:Edit Post Quote Text Delete Post Print Post Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

e
Cutting the vine into discs with a plasterboard saw.
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Leprachaun (Leprachaun)
Posted on Friday, June 20, 2003 - 01:28 am:Edit Post Quote Text Delete Post Print Post Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

f
Finely chopped caapi.
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Hippie3 (Admin)
Posted on Friday, June 20, 2003 - 01:30 am:Edit Post Quote Text Delete Post Print Post Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

that's some good looking vine.
nice pix.
glad this is already archive material
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Leprachaun (Leprachaun)
Posted on Friday, June 20, 2003 - 01:32 am:Edit Post Quote Text Delete Post Print Post Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

g
Viridis on left, caapi on right, after soaking overnight in purified water.
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Leprachaun (Leprachaun)
Posted on Friday, June 20, 2003 - 01:36 am:Edit Post Quote Text Delete Post Print Post Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

h
"White salts" under sediment of caapi extraction, looking from underneath at base of clear glass coffee pot.
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Leprachaun (Leprachaun)
Posted on Friday, June 20, 2003 - 01:46 am:Edit Post Quote Text Delete Post Print Post Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

I had the following dream:


EROTICA (Dream #1)

Saturday 14th June 2003

11.30pm Started drinking the extract of 25g White Caapi (about 100ml) which I had just made. Tastes quite bitter but not too bad. Drinking very slowly in teaspoonfuls, stirring brew each time to get an even amount of sediment and salts in each teaspoon. Last ate at midday. Didn't drink much water since then.

12.40am Finished caapi. Feel like I might be starting to trip. Feel a little sick in my stomach. My pupils are dilated!!!

12.45am Starting to drink extract of 25g viridis (about 100ml). Tastes much more bitter than caapi.

1.05am Drank only a few teaspoons of viridis. It seems to make me more likely to puke. Feel like I might puke soon.

1.30am Pupils quite dilated.

1.53am Puked a bit after a teaspoon of viridis. Feel much better now.

2.25am Finished viridis at last. Fucking horrible. Feel sick. Minimal trip effects. Had 2 or 3 very small pukes and retching.

2.50am Stuck fingers down my throat to induce a good puke. Feel much better now. Drank some water to give the puke volume and make it come easier. Eyes still dilated a bit, I think.

3am Ate 2 slices of buttered toast and a banana. Noticed swirling patterns on kitchen floor. I think I'm coming up!!! [ Before this point I was quite disappointed, thinking the brew was a dud. I was merely getting something to eat before going to bed, with the weak hope that the food might induce a trip.]

3.10am Eating potato waffles and tomato sauce. Trip is getting stronger.

3.15am Feeling cold

3.18am Starting to trip strongly.

3.27am I'm getting occasional pins and needles in hands. Physically I feel light and "rubbery". I don't like bright lights. Feel sexually aroused.

3.32am Using candles. I think I have nystagmus. Feel cold.

3.55am I think I'm coming down.

4.20am Well down now. Wasted trip having sexual fantasies. Feel tired.


Sunday 15th June 2003

12pm Got to sleep about 5am and woke about 30 mins ago. Feel tired but my mood is fine.
The build-up to the peak was very similar to about 2g of mushrooms but had it's own subtle character. Eating the toast and waffles caused the trip to kick in. I got extremely horny when I peaked and became totally pre-occupied with sexual fantasies. My bedroom had an exotic aura, like a dream sequence from a Sinbad the Sailor film. It was in the vivid colours and the way things sparkled rather than actual hallucinations, very different from shrooms. The stronger I tripped, the less I could tolerate bright lights. I went from room light to desk lamp to candles and finally total darkness.

Nausea was minor, I had no diarrhoea, and puking was minimal despite drinking heavy sediment. The only decent sized puke I had was one I induced myself. Very strange. I think having a totally empty stomach to start with, being a bit dehydrated, and drinking a very small volume of brew minimised puking. It seems that the stomach needs to contain a certain volume of liquid in order to puke properly.

If the brews had been less bitter I would have been able to drink them quicker with less nausea. The caapi was probably wearing off by the time the toast caused the viridis to kick in. During the peak, my eyesight and especially my hearing seemed better. Also, when writing my trip notes during the peak, my hands occasionally looked like those of an old woman. At the time I disregarded this as silly, but in my next dream it turned out to have quite a profound meaning.
All other hallucinations were just regular geometric patterns, but subtly different from the usual forms that shroom patterns took. No jungle imagery at all.

3.50pm Felt like a pussy cat. I was chilling out in my garden, when I got the urge to walk along the top of a wall, about 4ft high, 4" wide. I felt very relaxed and natural doing this, like a cat would be. My feet and shins felt very relaxed. Walked along the top of a field gate, about 2" wide and rounded, 5ft high and wobbling. Fell off a few times and was unconcerned, like I was falling 1ft. Climbed an apple tree stealthily, hardly making it shake at all, and jumped off the top, about 6ft. Climbed onto the roof of my house intending to jump off the eaves, about 8ft. Felt I was starting to get reckless so I went to climb down safely. I climbed onto the roof of a flat shed on my way down, and with hardly a second thought I jumped off it onto the lawn, about 7ft. I had persistent cat-like feelings of calmness, relaxation, balance and fearlessness of heights. I got no pains in my shins like I normally would when jumping from such heights. I rarely do such acrobatics, especially not just for fun.

When I came in, I became fascinated with trying to walk down my very creaky hallway as stealthily as possible. I took off my shoes and jeans because they seemed to be making a terrible amount of noise. I wanted to run closely and stealthily along the wall like a little pussy cat would. After trying various methods, I found that walking very close to the wall was indeed the quietest way! This cat-like behaviour rose to a worrying level after my second dream. Has anyone noticed that the ends of the caapi vine look like cat's paws? I slept for about 2 hours from about 5-7pm, and felt refreshed afterwards.

This dream may not sound like a big deal, but for me it was a fascinating glimpse into a new exotic world which I never knew existed. My second dream was much more powerful and profound, and I got a proper taste of the Ayahuasca experience.
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Leprachaun (Leprachaun)
Posted on Friday, June 20, 2003 - 01:48 am:Edit Post Quote Text Delete Post Print Post Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Archive material, hooray!!!!

First dream posted at last! Two more to come. Pix came out fairly clear but a bit dark.
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Hippie3 (Admin)
Posted on Friday, June 20, 2003 - 01:49 am:Edit Post Quote Text Delete Post Print Post Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

maybe the panther is your totem...
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Leprachaun (Leprachaun)
Posted on Friday, June 20, 2003 - 01:56 am:Edit Post Quote Text Delete Post Print Post Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Panther, really? I thought you didn't believe in such supernatural things! Wait till you hear tomorrow what I got up to after my second dream. That's all I got for tonight, folks.
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Hippie3 (Admin)
Posted on Friday, June 20, 2003 - 02:14 am:Edit Post Quote Text Delete Post Print Post Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

i'm pretty open-minded, still exploring.
i think it's possible that 'spirits', for lack of a better word and whatever that really means,
can be encountered.
i met my very 1st one on my 2nd aya voyage,
i still don't really know exactly what is was,
yet the sensation, the recognition, seemed quite real.
perhaps it's jung's archetypes, or something far greater, but what really matters is what resonates in your soul, who really cares what the 'reality' is, if that word can even be applied to such a state of consciousness.
maybe the cat resonates because you used to be one.
or maybe, like our ancestors, the animal isn't so important as the symbolism, what a panther 'means', its' essence, so to speak. perhaps that essence resonates deep down in all of us, waiting for the right key to unlock it into our minds.
looking forward to more of your reports.

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Leprachaun (Leprachaun)
Posted on Saturday, June 21, 2003 - 12:53 am:Edit Post Quote Text Delete Post Print Post Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

I had the following dream:


Sunday 15th June 2003

OLD WOMAN OF THE JUNGLE

10pm Started drinking extract of 25g caapi I made the previous day. Last meal was at 5pm. Drank
very little water since then.

10.30pm Finished caapi. Rinsed tub with distilled water and drank. It was easier to drink than
last night because I was familiar with the taste now. [While drinking the caapi, I sweetened the
viridis extract with 3 heaped teaspoons of glucose.]

11pm Started drinking extract of 25g viridis. Tastes not too bad. I think my eyes are a bit
dilated. Feel very mild CNS stimulation.

11.30pm Starting to trip. Eyes quite dilated. Stomach a bit sick.

11.45pm Finished viridis. Quite hard to drink even when sweetened. Rinsing my mouth with a bit of
water reduced nausea by removing the taste from my mouth.

12.15am Was outside for the last half-hour getting fresh air. It reduced nausea. Burped a few
times and had some intestinal grumbles. Eyes look LESS dilated!!! Looking at swirling patterns on
carpets causes nausea.

12.35am Ate one slice of buttered toast.

12.45am Still minimal tripping.

1am Tripping much more strongly now. Had been trying to puke to reduce nausea, but couldn't.
Drank about 1 litre of water to give puke volume and stuck my fingers down my throat a few times,
but it wouldn't come. The large volume of water in my stomach feels quite uncomfortable now.

1.05am Don't like lights. Pins and needles in hands. Feel quite sick. Very cold.

1.26am Feel like I'm coming down. Trip has a warm Caribbean feel. Weird! Sickness gone!!!

1.40am Tripping lightly but pleasantly. Just ate another slice of toast, thickly buttered. Feel
quite well. Washed down toast with a little bit of water. Sense of taste and saliva reduced. When
trip got strong, there were very intense geometric closed-eye visuals.

1.46am Feel like I might be coming back up.

1.55am Just ate another heavily buttered slice of toast and washed down with a bit of water.

1.58am I think I'm starting to get pins and needles in my hands again.

2.02am Trip is definitely getting stronger.

2.18am Coming back down. The MAOI effects are probably wearing off and the DMT is probably
running out.

2.33am Still getting weak pins and needles.

3.38am Almost fully down. Still vague pins and needles. Feel tired.

4.05am Going to bed

4.54am Feel quite hot. Had to remove duvet from bed. The same thing happened yesterday when
coming down.


Monday 16th June 2003

12pm Got up. Feel tired but in a good mood. Got to sleep about 5.30 to 6am.

When coming down from my previous trip, I became very regretful that I had wasted the peak
indulging in silly, futile sexual thoughts. For this trip, I was determined to make the most of
it.

After drinking the viridis, I got very nauseous. As the first peak kicked in rapidly, it rose to
an unbearable level. I lay on my bed under the duvet, freezing cold, sick as hell, and having
intensely vivid geometric hallucinations. They were like mushrooms and lsd in the sense that they
were geometric, but the patterns were different. Some were plated with vivid gold and silver,
something I don't remember ever seeing on shrooms. I could see the viridis brew with claws coming
out of it, like it was those claws which were gripping my stomach with nausea. I think the extra
bitterness of the viridis was the main cause of nausea. It tasted like sludge from the bottom of
a stagnant ditch. Despite the intense nausea, I didn't puke or get diarrhoea.

Soon the trip mellowed out into a "Caribbean Cruise" where the nausea left me totally. With my
mind's eye in my darkened bedroom, I could see a jungle coastline, looking out over a warm
tropical sea. I could feel the heat and humidity, but it was pleasant. I could get a wonderfully
vivid exotic spicy smell, which I now realise is the smell of the dried caapi vine. These
tropical hallucinations were much longer and more enjoyable that the geometric ones at the peak,
which were meaningless. I distinctly remember the appearance of the chest of drawers in my
bedroom. It is battered and cheap, dark brown with "gold" handles. When in the "tropical phase",
it looked like the top-quality travel chest of a 16th century explorer on expedition in the
Amazon basin or Africa. My bedroom looked like a quality hotel room in some tropical country. The
way things shone and glistened under lights was very distinct, in a clear, pure, and beautiful
way very different from shrooms.

Sometime before the first or second peak I was walking through the house, and with my mind's eye
I could see myself as an old woman, about 60-70. She had grey-white hair, was small and thin, yet
was quite fit. She seemed to have a very determined personality and a great sense of purpose.
During the mellower second peak, all this became clear, I think. The tropical visions
intensified, and I saw the old woman from behind, in the jungle. She slowly turned around and
showed me her face. I think she had brown eyes, and looked like she had been a very beautiful
woman in her younger days. She still had rugged good looks. She told me her name. She seemed to
be South American. I think she was an "Ayahuasquero". She told me I didn't need to use so much
lemon juice in my extractions. I think she was still alive in the 1960's. I think I was this
woman in a previous life. These communications were in the form of "thought impressions", not
audible speech.

I have had many profound spiritual experiences on mushrooms, but this has knocked the socks off
the lot of them. I feel an amazing affinity with the Vine. The tropical hallucinations had a
bluish red colour, and were hazy but fairly clear. They were the colours you would expect to see
in the jungle at twilight after a nice red sunset. When I first heard that Ayahuasca caused
jungle visions, I thought it was simply due to people expecting to see such things. My jungle
visions were too vivid and persistent for me to be able to hold that view now. The jungle is
built into the vine. When trying to get to sleep after the dream, the dawn chorus of birds
outside sounded like the birds in a jungle.

Today I was a
bit absent-minded with fuzzy thinking and a low sex drive, like yesterday, but generally in a
good mood. At first I didn't seem
to have any more cat impulses, until I suddenly got the urge to lounge in a tree like a Jaguar.
I wanted to find a big tree with a very big thick near-horizontal branch which I could sleep on,
with my arms and legs dangling down either side. The thought of it was blissful. I quickly tried
to think of a tree near my house which would be suitable. I couldn't think of any and was too
tired to go out looking. I found that an ok substitute was to lie on my bed with one arm and leg
hanging off the side. I snoozed for an hour, partly in that way. I got up for a while and got
something to eat, but still had this strong tree-lounging urge. I ended up putting a one-person
bed on it's side, and folding a duvet in half and putting it over the top along with a pillow. I
climbed on top and snoozed there for 40mins, arms and legs dangling. It took a while to get
comfortable, but when I did it was lovely. I even found several different comfortable positions.
While snoozing, I imagined I had a Jaguar's muzzle and big whiskers. Help, I'm a Jaguar!!!
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Hippie3 (Admin)
Posted on Saturday, June 21, 2003 - 12:31 pm:Edit Post Quote Text Delete Post Print Post Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

pretty amazing, isn't it ?
what really blows me away is your mention of gold.
the spirit in my vision also mentioned gold, and some of the vision was centered on gold. even called itself the spirit of gold, which was/is pretty puzzling to me, i'm not a material kinda guy so i was left wondering why i dreamt of gold, now i see it permeates your vision too so it must be in the vine.
wild, eh ?
i was also told not to use so much lemon juice.
i agree wholeheartedly that the huasca vision is a whole league beyond shrooms/cid, much more powerful with less fear/anxiety, at least for me.
your dreams have re-invigorated me and i'm making some jurema-based brews now.
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Leprachaun (Leprachaun)
Posted on Saturday, June 21, 2003 - 11:53 pm:Edit Post Quote Text Delete Post Print Post Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Hippie3,
I'm still not 100% sure of the existence of spirits, but aya is being very persuasive.

The funny thing is that I have never liked cats much, yet now I seem to be turning into one!

The way things in a room shine and sparkle under light is so beautiful, like precious metals and jewellery. Maybe the gold is a characteristic feature of DMT hallucinations. What really hits me is that you were told to use less lemon juice too!!! That is so far out!!!

I would put aya in the same league as datura in terms of power, but aya is infinitely more friendly. Datura feels like it doesnt want you to eat it at all. I don't remember any fear on aya, regardless of what happened. The MAOIs must have had me chilled out. Strangely, I don't remember any fear on Datura either, probably because it renders you so delerious you don't really care what happens to you anymore.

I'm glad my reports have inspired you to dream again.
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Leprachaun (Leprachaun)
Posted on Saturday, June 21, 2003 - 11:59 pm:Edit Post Quote Text Delete Post Print Post Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

I had the following dream:

16th & 17th June 2003

ACID-FREE CAAPI EXTRACTION (Brew #2)

Generally followed same procedures as in last brew. Cut up 25g herbs, about 45 mins. Put in 500ml distilled water, no lemon juice. Let soak overnight.

Next day, cooked for 1.5hrs. Filtered, getting as much sediment in extract as possible. Extract didn't seem to contain as much salts as expected, even though herb used was cut from the same vine segment used for previous brew #1.

Did second extraction in 500ml distilled water, no lemon juice, 1.5hrs. This appeared to contain only about 10% of total salts in first extract. Reduced to about 130ml. Thin, oily film was noticed on brew surface during reduction.

I think I should have brewed for longer and used a little bit of lemon juice. The presence of white salts without lemon juice proves they are not citrate salts formed by the action of citric acid in lemon juice. However, some acidity may be useful to lower the surface tension of the water, making the herbs absorb moisture more easily, and let salts work their way out of the herbs. Also, the oily film suggests the caapi contains oils. These oils would stop the herbs absorbing moisture easily. A small amount of acidity would help to emulsify these oils off the herbs and make them more absorbant, in the same way that vinegar emulsifies oil in a salad dressing. The fact that a large amount of herbs are still floating on the water after an overnight soak show they are resisting the absorption of moisture to some degree.
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Leprachaun (Leprachaun)
Posted on Sunday, June 22, 2003 - 12:13 am:Edit Post Quote Text Delete Post Print Post Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

I had the following dream:


17th June 2003

UNPLEASANT SHROOMHUASCA (Trip #3)


9.10pm Started drinking acid-free extract of 25g caapi I made today. Tastes only slightly bitter.
Drinking slowly, stirring well before each teaspoonful to get even sediment.

9.30pm Finished drinking Vine. Rinsed jar with a little bit of distilled water and drank. I think
I feel the beginnings of CNS stimulation.

10pm Almost certain I have CNS stimulation but eyes don't look dilated.

10.05pm Started eating 1g dry shrooms.

10.10pm Finished eating shrooms. Chewed well and washed down with a bit of water.

10.25pm Definite CNS.

10.30pm Starting to trip.

10.40pm Feel cold.

11pm I think there is a strange synergy going on.

11.30pm CEV's are weak. They are the style of neither mushrooms nor Ayahuasca. They are more
chaotic. The trip itself is neither shrooms nor true Aya. It is like a very mellow version of
Aya. Objects lack the DMT brilliant shine. I can sense the presence of the vine but there is none
of the aya profundity.

1.05am Drank viridis extract. [This is something I tried to brew up quickly in desperation while tripping(!!!), using the spent 50g viridis from brew #1 which I had kept in a freezer. It was almost certainly a dud, unless there was some cross-tolerance with the shrooms.]

1.12am Trip at the moment is quite low level.

2.08am Ate 2 slices of heavily buttered toast.

2.13am Eyes extremely dilated. May have been like this all along though.

3am Still minor tripping and wide awake.

3.34am Eyes still quite dilated.

4.30am Very tired. Going to bed. Eyes still a bit dilated.


18th June 2003

Got up about 12.30pm. Feel quite tired with unpleasant mood. Glad I didn't take any more shrooms.


19th June 2003

Mood seems back to normal.


The trip was crap, especially with the previous true aya trip clear in my mind. The Vine needs
DMT to work it's magic. I felt that the vine had eaten the shrooms but was very dissatisfied. It
wanted DMT in order to express itself fully. I could have taken more shrooms, but the character
of the trip was basically unpleasant and I didn't want to intensify or prolong it. The vine
extract seemed weaker than brew #1, due to brewing methods, but it was still a distinct influence
on the trip.

I was depressed throughout most of the trip, a sharp contrast to the Aya. Even the alledged
anti-depressant effects of the MAOIs didn't protect me from the depressive effects of the low
dose of shrooms, and they didn't seem to potentiate the hallucinations much either, if at all. I
am now thinking that shrooms are not for me, with caapi or alone. Maybe they are the perfect
entheogen for other people, and I thought they were for me, but they always seem to give me a
depressed hangover, and depression during trips is unpleasantly frequent. I have a heap of
mushrooms which I harvested recently, my biggest crop yet, and I have almost totally lost
interest in eating them. I feel like giving up shroom cultivation and disposing of all my growing
equipment. I have seriously lost interest in shrooms.

On the up side, I am utterly fascinated with Aya. I consider it to be my new plant ally.
Unfortunately I won't have the privacy to brew or dream again for a few weeks, but when I do I'll
let you all know what happened.

Shroomhuasca may be of use to shroomers who would like to get a little taste of the vine effects
without going for the full brew. Despite the bad trip, I am glad I tried shroomhuasca. I really
wanted to know what it was like, and now I know never to try it again. It gave me a new clear
perspective of my relationship with shrooms, and I am choosing Ayahuasca instead.
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Leprachaun (Leprachaun)
Posted on Monday, June 23, 2003 - 10:39 pm:Edit Post Quote Text Delete Post Print Post Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Acidity of Amazon river water:

Link1

Link2

I think aya brewing is more common in the western Amazon basin, where the more acidic blackwater tributaries predominate.
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Leprachaun (Leprachaun)
Posted on Monday, June 23, 2003 - 11:22 pm:Edit Post Quote Text Delete Post Print Post Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

I have a theory why hard-boiled brews may fail. Although the water temp can never go above 100*C, the base of the pot is a different story. With the hob set to max, the pot base could be easily 200-300*C+ at a guess, maybe more. Hence water turning immediately to steam against the base of the pot, causing vigorous bubbling. Maybe the alkaloids evaporate or degrade by coming into contact with the hot pot base, or simply stick to it and get left behind. If this is the case, then it would mean that max heat should never be applied to the pot, not even when heating it up from stone cold.

Can anyone here vouch for the potency of brews simmered on low heat for a long time with the lid on, where the temp was known to be 95*C+? If yes, then that would suggest it is an excessively hot pot base that possibly causes duds, not the water temp.
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Hippie3 (Admin)
Posted on Tuesday, June 24, 2003 - 12:04 am:Edit Post Quote Text Delete Post Print Post Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

that's one reason i still prefer a crockpot.
not sure of the temp but the 'high' setting will get mine to a low boil, i.e. simmer.
'low' gives steam but no visible boiling.
i can attest to the potency even after several hours brewing.
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Leprachaun (Leprachaun)
Posted on Tuesday, June 24, 2003 - 01:06 am:Edit Post Quote Text Delete Post Print Post Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Great, Hippie3, that's something new cleared up for me. Phew!!!
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Hippie3 (Admin)
Posted on Tuesday, June 24, 2003 - 12:59 pm:Edit Post Quote Text Delete Post Print Post Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

i find a long slow brewing process most effective, i often take 2-3 days from start to finish in my crockpot.
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Leprachaun (Leprachaun)
Posted on Friday, June 27, 2003 - 01:35 am:Edit Post Quote Text Delete Post Print Post Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

I found out a few more interesting things.

In the above Amazon links, it says that the water acidity in blackwater rivers is caused by tannins. I have a little book on herbalism which says that excessive amounts of tannins in a decoction can cause severe gastro-intestinal upset. Maybe the purge in these Amazon areas is as much to do with the tannins already in the water as with the tannins already in the herbs.

I got more info from chemistry books. Tannins (also called tannic acids) form an acidic solution when dissolved in water. Their melting point is 210-215*C, so the aren't going to evaporate out of the brew, they simply get more and more concentrated as the brew reduces. They form a precipitate with alkaloids, meaning they form and insoluble compound which falls out of the solution. That is a good reason to drink the sediment. I presume these precipitates would be called tannate salts. There are plenty of tannins in the herbs themselves which would slightly acidify the brew without the help of lemon juice etc.

In my second brewing dream I used no acid yet the brew was quite active. I'm sure it would have been stronger if I had brewed for longer rather than added lemon juice. And the brew tasted distinctly bitter on it's own without acidification, like a strong cup of tea. Maybe the salts I saw in the sediment were formed by the tannin.

For my next dream, I'm going to stick my neck out. I'm not going to use any acidification at all for either plant material. I'm going to simmer the herbs on a hob overnight with the lids on, and add plenty of extra water beforehand to make up for evaporation. The next day I'll do a 3-hour 2nd extraction, and reduce. Say some Icaros for my success.

Has anyone else seen these white salts in the sediment? I invented some teks to make them more visible.
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Hippie3 (Admin)
Posted on Friday, June 27, 2003 - 12:11 pm:Edit Post Quote Text Delete Post Print Post Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

to be honest i never bothered to look closely at the sediment. but i will now that you've mentioned it.

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