  
Hippie3 (Admin)
| | Posted on Saturday, June 28, 2003 - 10:26 pm: | 
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Topic: Problems with phosphoric prep
purgatory
Group: Members
Posts: 57
Joined: Aug. 2002
Posted: June 25 2003,01:54
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Hello dear members,
Let me relate to you what happened to my friend 3 days ago. He brewed a very powerful potion over many days, slowly cooking down, multiple extractions. He had purchased - by advice form this forum - some phosphoric acid (pure) from a beermaker's supply house. He added 2 teaspoons of acid to each gallon of distilled water. Probably used 10-12 gallons overall. In any case the pH was about 4.5 before cooking. He thought it was rather strange that the brew was almost black when it was finally done - he had 2 cups left from 250 grams each b. caapi (cielo) and pv. He drank one-eighth cup at 9:30 p.m., then, as the brew kicked in, half again as much. So, about 3/16 cup overall. Taste was very acidic but otherwise nowhere near as bad as the lemon brew. Yes a very powerful dream it was too. Incredible in fact. HOWEVER, he had serious physical problems with the acid levels in the brew. And I mean serious to the point of major shakes and light-headedness after the dream had subsided. His veins felt like they were filled with acid. He thought he was going to die. Made out his last will and teastament. His girlfriend came over, convinced him he was not going to die since his pulse was alright. Talked him out of a trip to the hospital. It took 2 full days for his body pH to return to normal, with the help of bicarbonate of soda and lecithin. The following morning he still felt shakey so he thought to measure his urine pH. It was about 5.0 which is in the 'mild danger' catgeory. God only knows what it measured the night of his dream. He measured the pH of his brew. It was 1.5. What happened? Did he measure the pH wrong in the first place or did the cooking add to the acid levels? This was a serious brush with death, at least he felt so. He hopes no permanent bodily damage. He thinks not. Please everyone, take this as a warning. BE CAREFUL WITH THE ACID LEVELS OF YOUR PREP! He is wondering if even acidifying is necessary, having read somewhere that someone here dispenses with that step. He also wonders if there is any way to salvage the brew, like by adding bicarbonate of soda perhaps? Thanks for any insights good people.
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thevine
Group: Members
Posts: 299
Joined: Sep. 2001
Posted: June 25 2003,04:25
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purgatory,
Whatever amount of acid put in is going to be the same as final product.
So if you used 10 gallons of water x 2 tsp. you'll have 20 tsp of acid in your final product.
When using strong acid you need to fully evaporate to fully dry powder. With HCL extraction i've ended up with extremely acid final product just from moisture in a slighly moist, tacky final product....ran into simular problems-had no idea a little tackiness and goo could result in such concentration.
What you need to do (HCL anyway) is smell the final powder, i've literally had powder state that still burnt my nose when smelled and needed further drying.
Its tricky to adjust with bi-carb or simular and not get something with insta-purge effects.
Yes you can salvage by either adding bicarb or full evaporation....evaporate-boil down to a small amount then find a glass plate/pie plate that will fit on top a pan of water and slowly evaporate fully.
Bi-carb-warm mixture and add small pinch at a time keep track of ph.
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LilMerlin
Group: Members
Posts: 204
Joined: Oct. 2002
Posted: June 25 2003,10:53
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Use a few drops of vinegar... nothing more is needed. It's safe, efficient, tasty
LilMerlin. |
Leprachaun (Leprachaun)
| | Posted on Sunday, June 29, 2003 - 12:56 am: |
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The phosphoric acid must have become more and more concentrated as the brew reduced, driving up the ph. I don't know how the hell he drank the brew with a ph of 1.5, that is around the ph of stomach acid! |
Leprachaun (Leprachaun)
| | Posted on Sunday, June 29, 2003 - 12:48 pm: |
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Driving up the ACIDITY, I meant to say. Doh! He could have incorrectly used his ph meter too, or maybe he used a cheap one that was inaccurate anyway. They are tricky to use properly from what I have read. It just goes to show how dangerous it can be using these strong acids. |
Hippie3 (Admin)
| | Posted on Sunday, June 29, 2003 - 01:23 pm: |
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very true, another good reason to favor lemon juice or vinegar.
all he did was concentrate the acid.
phosphoric's pretty mild as acids go but blood ph is tricky stuff, death is possible. |
Mod Maliki (Maliki)
| | Posted on Monday, June 30, 2003 - 09:25 pm: |
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There is a solotion to this problem . Use hydrochloric acid in place of phosphoric acid. Evaporate to complete dryness . HCI acid bonds to water when the watter is removed it becomes HCI gas wich in turns evaporates completly. I will post my write up on the method. |
Hippie3 (Admin)
| | Posted on Monday, June 30, 2003 - 11:14 pm: |
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that would also work, mal, with phosphoric,
evaporating it all to dryness.
that was his big mistake,
he didn't, instead he merely concentrated it.
he needed to go the rest of the way to dry. |
Leprachaun (Leprachaun)
| | Posted on Thursday, July 03, 2003 - 01:03 am: |
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andy
Web Wizard
Group: Super Administrators
Posts: 43
Joined: Aug. 1999
Posted: June 29 2003,11:55
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LilMerlin is right. A few drops of vinegar, or lemon are all thats required if even that. I don't bother acidifying any more and always get what I need from the plants.
(This post is from the same thread. Makes me more confident about using no acidification.) |
Hippie3 (Admin)
| | Posted on Thursday, July 03, 2003 - 02:18 am: |
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agreed, andy knows his vine. |
Mod Maliki (Maliki)
| | Posted on Thursday, July 03, 2003 - 08:54 pm: |
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These methods greatly reduce the time it takes to do a brew . It took me 1.5 hours to brew my batch and 1 hour to dry.
The traditional way works as well . But not as fast.
Also there was zero body load from the HCI method.
Nothing at all other then the simple taste of the mix .
Ive tried the HCI method now I should try the ancient method and see how it works out . Brew all day long that is..
This is still new ground for me as far as hands on goes but ill be damned if I havent read every pice of material I have found on the subject. |
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