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Pinning - 1
Stuck and Slow Jars - 1
Do BIRTHDAYS have to be clean?jaredjared11 2 12-10-01  01:10 am

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Some Body (Texasshroomer)
Posted on Tuesday, October 02, 2001 - 07:59 pm:Edit Post Quote Text Delete Post Print Post Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Hello all,

I have many many jars that have been fully colonized for over 2 weeks but have not pinned yet.

I intend to grow in the PF aquarium style method. Should I go ahead and birth them now, or wait? It's been a while. Also, I am using gulf coast strain.

Thanks,

TexasShroomer
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Cbee (Cbee)
Posted on Tuesday, October 02, 2001 - 09:06 pm:Edit Post Quote Text Delete Post Print Post Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

with the experience I have, id say birth them, do they look healthy? Maybe dunk when you birth them, before they start to pin to give em some more moisture to pin with, and try dropping the temp 5-10 degrees... also have you started to give them light? they need that to pin... Id birth and dunk for 12 hours, then put in aquarium
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Brettiejams (Brettiejams)
Posted on Tuesday, October 02, 2001 - 11:15 pm:Edit Post Quote Text Delete Post Print Post Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

good advice cbee.

good info.
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Cbee (Cbee)
Posted on Wednesday, October 03, 2001 - 12:08 am:Edit Post Quote Text Delete Post Print Post Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

thanks brettie =)
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Spot Smith (Spot)
Posted on Saturday, September 29, 2001 - 01:29 am:Edit Post Quote Text Delete Post Print Post Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

How long after 100% colonization of jars before pinning can be observed? Can cakes be birthed immediately after surface colonization?
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Brettiejams (Brettiejams)
Posted on Saturday, September 29, 2001 - 05:49 am:Edit Post Quote Text Delete Post Print Post Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

The inside of the cake colonizes slowest... best to wait 3-5 after outside is colonized to birth.
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Sha Taki (Mushymouth)
Posted on Tuesday, October 30, 2001 - 09:26 pm:Edit Post Quote Text Delete Post Print Post Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Everyone has been very helpful. Thank you so much. Here is today's question.

20 days since inoculating PF strain (standard PF Tek). Cakes are almost 100% colonized, we think we're seeing pins (tiny, tiny, white things?). No brown bumps or worm like thingies like PF mentions yet. Should we birth or wait?
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Nan (Nanook)
Posted on Tuesday, October 30, 2001 - 09:57 pm:Edit Post Quote Text Delete Post Print Post Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

You can't birth until you get to 100% colonized, then I usually let them go 3-4 days after that before birthing. Give em some light if you are not already, that will speed up the pinning process.
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Rich G. (Vicwaters)
Posted on Tuesday, October 30, 2001 - 10:28 pm:Edit Post Quote Text Delete Post Print Post Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

You may also take the tape off and turn them upside down. (Provided that the verm barrier at the top is still intact. This seems to help when I have that problem.
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benofnazareth (Benofnazareth)
Posted on Saturday, November 03, 2001 - 08:26 am:Edit Post Quote Text Delete Post Print Post Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

then i shall proceed. thanks patrick!
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Scotsman (Barrowland)
Posted on Sunday, November 25, 2001 - 06:52 pm:Edit Post Quote Text Delete Post Print Post Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

how do u tell top from bottom of the cake,when in the jar is the top or bottom of the cake facing the lid,its so i dont put them in upside down
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Lichen (Lichen)
Posted on Sunday, November 25, 2001 - 07:12 pm:Edit Post Quote Text Delete Post Print Post Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

I assume you're talking about birth and casing? It doesn't matter, and you can even flip them one way and then another inbetween flushes when you've dunked and are recasing
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Scotsman (Barrowland)
Posted on Sunday, November 25, 2001 - 07:33 pm:Edit Post Quote Text Delete Post Print Post Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

no casing ,i mean before i put them in the terrarium,which way up do the cakes sit in the terrarium ,which is top and which is bottom
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Cragith Kilbonith (Kilborn)
Posted on Sunday, November 25, 2001 - 07:43 pm:Edit Post Quote Text Delete Post Print Post Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

say your jars are sitting on the glass and the lids ontop right. flip it that way. so the cake will be sitting on the extra verm layer which you may have added. <~ kinda like this pic (knew it would come in handy!)
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Scotsman (Barrowland)
Posted on Sunday, November 25, 2001 - 08:01 pm:Edit Post Quote Text Delete Post Print Post Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

got it,so the mycelium covered bottom of the glass will be facing heaven,it is an easy Q but hard to word......thanks
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Cragith Kilbonith (Kilborn)
Posted on Sunday, November 25, 2001 - 08:26 pm:Edit Post Quote Text Delete Post Print Post Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

yep :] glad me could help.
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Liberty_Caps (Liberty_Caps)
Posted on Sunday, November 25, 2001 - 08:48 pm:Edit Post Quote Text Delete Post Print Post Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

just want to be clear
so u set the cakes on the verm barrier right???
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hippie3 (Hippie)
Posted on Monday, November 26, 2001 - 02:21 pm:Edit Post Quote Text Delete Post Print Post Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

i do, then i add verm. to the bare side on top.
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Great Expectations (Shade)
Posted on Sunday, November 25, 2001 - 07:08 pm:Edit Post Quote Text Delete Post Print Post Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

My first cakes have finished colonizing which brings me nothing but great joy. However, one of my cakes has shrunk so much that it's only about 2/3 the size it was a week ago. Is this because of water loss?
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Lichen (Lichen)
Posted on Sunday, November 25, 2001 - 07:22 pm:Edit Post Quote Text Delete Post Print Post Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Usually when colonizing the cakes don't lose too much water, unless you've got a lot of evaporation thru the holes in the lid. It's probably just normal shrinkage due to the mycelium eating on the rice. If you think it might be somewhat dry, go ahead and dunk it before you case and put it into the fruiting chamber.
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nuecrew (Nue)
Posted on Monday, November 26, 2001 - 03:40 am:Edit Post Quote Text Delete Post Print Post Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Thats why they call them "magic". They transmute water and rice into mushrooms!
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hippie3 (Hippie)
Posted on Monday, November 26, 2001 - 02:24 pm:Edit Post Quote Text Delete Post Print Post Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

i've seen shrinkage before, it's rather odd how some cakes can shrink to hockey puck size while others barely shrink at all.
doesn't seem to matter much,
either way.
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Brad (Raze)
Posted on Monday, November 26, 2001 - 12:15 am:Edit Post Quote Text Delete Post Print Post Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

When the jars first reach 100%, wont the centers still be just BRF and not colonised? Do I have to wait at all after it reaches 100%? Two of mine are half way there already (though one of them looks like its contamed)
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Liberty_Caps (Liberty_Caps)
Posted on Monday, November 26, 2001 - 12:27 am:Edit Post Quote Text Delete Post Print Post Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

wait a week after 100% colinization then birth.
or wait for pins.
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Cragith Kilbonith (Kilborn)
Posted on Monday, November 26, 2001 - 12:39 am:Edit Post Quote Text Delete Post Print Post Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

you dont have to wait a full week, i think 4 days is fine. but if you dont have pins it might be a good idea to introduce them to light so by the time the center is colonized you will be shortly seeing pins.
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Brad (Raze)
Posted on Monday, November 26, 2001 - 12:56 am:Edit Post Quote Text Delete Post Print Post Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Cool, thanks. I've estimated that they'll be done by the first week of december. I innoculated half on the 17th, the other half on the 20th. I figured 14 days later is the 1st and 4th. I have them at 85 degrees... My estimate sound about right?
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Cragith Kilbonith (Kilborn)
Posted on Monday, November 26, 2001 - 01:20 am:Edit Post Quote Text Delete Post Print Post Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Hopefully .
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hippie3 (Hippie)
Posted on Monday, November 26, 2001 - 02:31 pm:Edit Post Quote Text Delete Post Print Post Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

yes, they should be fully colonized by 14 days.
it does take a few more days to reach the center,
but unless you plan to cut them up, that's not a problem.

Shroom Glossary : Dunking After Birth : Free Mycelial Syringe : Grow Chambers
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Drew Man (Dman)
Posted on Sunday, December 02, 2001 - 06:06 am:Edit Post Quote Text Delete Post Print Post Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

I have 5 vermiculite and BRF jars started with 60cc of water. I seem to have some uneven growth of mycelia in the jars. Should I birth them if they are uneven or should I try and case them? If i should case them can I case using BRF and vermiculite? I think I can just use the same measurements I used for my jars and multiply it then just add water and bake in tinfoil for 250 degress ferenheit for one hour right? If I have my idea of casing wrong please let me know though!?
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plinkerdink420 (Plinkerdink420)
Posted on Sunday, December 02, 2001 - 07:12 am:Edit Post Quote Text Delete Post Print Post Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

don't birth unless they are at least 100% colonized.. casing with BRF and vermiculite will probably give you a loss as it will most likely contaminate... you would have to be an extremely clean person to get away with that... casing isn't adding extra substrate... jars will usually colonize at different rates... just go with the flow...

Shroom Glossary
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Scotsman (Barrowland)
Posted on Thursday, December 06, 2001 - 05:31 pm:Edit Post Quote Text Delete Post Print Post Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

i have not dunked my cakes yet but i took the 100% colonised out the jar and dried the sides , now i notice a little blue on 1 cake i may have caused it taking it out the jar , will it be ok it aint contams is it
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hippie3 (Hippie)
Posted on Thursday, December 06, 2001 - 05:38 pm:Edit Post Quote Text Delete Post Print Post Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

not to worry, happens all the time.
bluing is just the tissue bruising, or stressed.
prolly from you touching it.
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Sillycybin (Sillycybin)
Posted on Thursday, December 06, 2001 - 11:51 pm:Edit Post Quote Text Delete Post Print Post Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Don't be blue just cause your cakes are, Scotsman

Sillily,
Silly
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Scotsman (Barrowland)
Posted on Friday, December 07, 2001 - 04:39 pm:Edit Post Quote Text Delete Post Print Post Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

now we got a joker in the community...change your name to sillycunt..lol
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hippie3 (Hippie)
Posted on Friday, December 07, 2001 - 05:29 pm:Edit Post Quote Text Delete Post Print Post Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

hey, that's funny, sort of.
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scilly psyman (Madcow)
Posted on Wednesday, January 16, 2002 - 06:25 am:Edit Post Quote Text Delete Post Print Post Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

First I want to thank everyone here (Nan especially) for such a great resource and such helpful advice. It makes the learning curve a good bit shorter.

My questions tonight are twofold. I just birthed the following cake that I had suspected was contamed b/c it shrank in the jar a noticeable amount and seemed dead near the top. Anyway I decided to birth individually to see what I could learn. pins I cased with verm top and bottom and had significant growth through the bottom layer. It had so many pins on the bottom of the cake (none on top) that I have, for now, left it upside down in an effort to promote maturation of what's there. I have read in various places that this is not a good idea b/c the mushies will try to grow up from how they were oriented during incubation (which would now be down). So was I supposed to just clean off all the tiny pins when I birthed and turn right side up? Will these grow right if left like this or should I clean the cake, dunk, set up-right and wait for the next flush?

Second question is relative to clear case of green mold. green mold This cake was almost colonized when this showed up. Is there anything that can be done or is green mold always pretty much a total loss?

Thanks again for the help.
madcow
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Brettiejams (Brettiejams)
Posted on Wednesday, January 16, 2002 - 06:35 am:Edit Post Quote Text Delete Post Print Post Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Just leave the cake with the pins like it is and fruit as usual(provide proper humidity, light, temp, and air exchange).

You can try and cut the top half of the cake with the mold off and rinse the rest real good under the faucet then fruit it in isolation(a quart jar with a little wet perlite would work good), but no promises.

Next time you make up jars, you might want to use the fine verm.

That coarse stuff is really best for casing.
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Jesseb (Jesseb)
Posted on Wednesday, January 16, 2002 - 03:46 pm:Edit Post Quote Text Delete Post Print Post Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

I always just chuck the green. No use in taking any chances.

jesseb
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Tom Baxter (Kappy)
Posted on Wednesday, December 19, 2001 - 10:43 pm:Edit Post Quote Text Delete Post Print Post Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

when my jars are 100 % colonized do i scrape off the extra vermiculite or leave it on for watering?>?
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Nan (Nanook)
Posted on Wednesday, December 19, 2001 - 11:11 pm:Edit Post Quote Text Delete Post Print Post Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Scrape the loose verm off with a spoon. Rinse the cake in tap water and proceed to "double-end casing"
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Organism (Organism)
Posted on Wednesday, December 26, 2001 - 12:44 am:Edit Post Quote Text Delete Post Print Post Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

I just birthed my cakes into a styrofoam cooler w/ lid cut out, replaced with plexiglass. I should only spray the cakes with the spray shield in place right? Fan when I spray? Should I spray down the inside walls of this chamber before the cakes go in?
Thanx for input.

* Avoid spraying cakes directly, a sheild is not required if you use Perlite. Fan when first opening the grow chamber, then mist, and quickly seal the lid when done spraying to trap the water vapor and mist droplets inside. When fruiting cakes always keep the chamber walls misted and visibly moist - Nan
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big slick (Baddaboom)
Posted on Thursday, January 03, 2002 - 03:34 pm:Edit Post Quote Text Delete Post Print Post Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Inocullated 24 jars 12/20, 3 jars are 95% colonized, been exposing them to light 24/7 cause I wanted to do hippie neg tek. No signs of pinning, but now I'm thinking from reading posts on this site I could dunk (the 3 jars) cut em in half and case with vermiculite on top and bottom, may lose some cakes to contamination, but maybe I will have shrooms within 10 days. Is this feasable?

I appreciate the info from this site, thanks
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hippie3 (Hippie)
Posted on Thursday, January 03, 2002 - 04:02 pm:Edit Post Quote Text Delete Post Print Post Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

not really.
10 days is far too fast, for cakes with no visible pinning.
my advice is to just let them finish,
you'll get more shrooms.
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MushroomStu (Mushroomstu)
Posted on Thursday, February 07, 2002 - 03:59 am:Edit Post Quote Text Delete Post Print Post Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

I'm just wondering (and thus far not gotten a specific answer) can a fully colonized cake become contammed ? The bottom line is how sanitary does a terrarium have to be? This is my first shot at this and I need all the info I can get. Thanks.
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relic (Relic)
Posted on Thursday, February 07, 2002 - 04:26 am:Edit Post Quote Text Delete Post Print Post Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

it is possible, but unlikely. you can increase the risk by not airing them for 2 or more days, excess humidity(i.e. condensation on cakes), dirty hands, etc.. by in large they are pretty much impervious to contamination once colonized. keep the terrarium as clean as possible within reason. don't leave standing water in it for to long, rinse it out between grows or if it gets real bad. wash it if you get contamination.
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Delekhan J. Delekhan (Delekhan)
Posted on Thursday, February 07, 2002 - 01:46 am:Edit Post Quote Text Delete Post Print Post Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

About 3 of my PF cakes (PR's) look to be about 80-90% colonized. White has made it all the way around but the bottoms are still bare (should they colonize too?) They've been sitting at a steady 85 degress (heat provided by indirect light from a lamp) for about a week and a half. Am I getting close to birth? Should I see any invitro pinning with these PR's? Should I be getting my fruiting chamber ready? What should I be expecting?

Delekhan
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Delekhan J. Delekhan (Delekhan)
Posted on Thursday, February 07, 2002 - 02:13 am:Edit Post Quote Text Delete Post Print Post Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

BTW, so far so good on my microwave sterilization, no contams yet. I screwed up my first batch of substrate though, I know it's lame but my measurements were off and I think it ended up too dry, so I wasted about half a syringe of spore solution on the jars I did with that. One jar has colonized (actually doing quite well it seems), none of the rest have shone any growth. I made a new batch of substate that seemed much better after I realized my first one wasn't working out too well. Out of five jars made with the new substrate, 4 have growth, 1 doesn't.

Anyway, the one old jar and 2 of the viable new jars are almost colonized. The remaining new jars are at about 50%.

All sterilized in the microwave at different times, some boiled in a plastic pot in the microwave (seemed to work out best). None of the jars with growth have shown any contams. One of the old jars with the poor substrate developed some kind of greyish stuff growing in it, since it didn't have any myc. growth I just threw it out, fearing it might be cobweb or something and not wanting to infect my new cakes.

Anyway... that's my progess... back to my question... what do I need to be doing.. what should I be expecting, looking for... anything soon?

Delekhan
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Vwaddict (Vwaddict)
Posted on Thursday, February 07, 2002 - 02:20 am:Edit Post Quote Text Delete Post Print Post Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

yes, the cake needs to colonize the bottom. after the cake looks fully colonized give it a few more days to make sure the middle is colonied, maybe 5 days. with your incubating temps you should be 100% in no time. how long has it been since inoculation? i inoculated 12 jars of Hawaiian on 1/26 today 2/6 they are mostly 95% and a few are fully colonated.

I cant help ya on the invitro pinning, not sure how PRs would do with that tek. but with all that light your giving them...

yes, you need to get your fruiting chamber ready!! they need to be placed in the chamber immediatly after birth.

good luck!