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Mycotopia Web Archive Archive Jars, Bags and Containers- Lids & Filters Slow or Stuck Mycotopia Tips Previous Next

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Topic Author Last Poster Posts Pages Last Post
Incubation - 1
Condensation problem - 1
Mycelium slowing down?jaredgreenthumb11 2 11-24-01  01:15 pm
Jar flipping drawbacksMr. Tambourine Manhippie317 1 12-07-01  11:14 pm
Salvage operation: crumble stalled cakes into beds?MartaxusFishy122 1 12-31-01  11:51 pm

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Hudsonismss (Hudsonismss)
Posted on Saturday, August 04, 2001 - 10:12 am:Edit Post Quote Text Delete Post Print Post Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

what is the best way to increase the rate of colinization? does having the substrate too moist inhibit colinization? do external conditions realy matter (disregarding extreme temps..)?
i have 6 jars going, and only two have had any major mycilia growth after over 2 weeks, anothers lost to contam....
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Lichen (Lichen)
Posted on Saturday, August 04, 2001 - 11:00 am:Edit Post Quote Text Delete Post Print Post Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

You get what you get and you can't do anything about jars that are already innoculated and colonizing.

However, if you put a thin layer of dry verm in the bottom of your jars before loading them with substrate, they will colonize much, much faster. I have cakes fully colonized in 10 days and pins at 14 days...I'll harvest my first PFAlbino shrooms @ 22 days.

It seems to speed things up a bit.
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Kaijan (Kaijan)
Posted on Saturday, August 04, 2001 - 02:46 pm:Edit Post Quote Text Delete Post Print Post Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

you'll want the temp around 85* -- they colonize nicely at that temp
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Nanook of the North (Nanook)
Posted on Saturday, August 04, 2001 - 04:22 pm:Edit Post Quote Text Delete Post Print Post Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Substrate that is mixed too wet will be a problem too, especially if you Inoculate them too heavy.

If you open the jar it is doomed to failure. Do not open slow or stalled jars until you are ready to pitch it.

Nanook
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Hudsonismss (Hudsonismss)
Posted on Sunday, August 05, 2001 - 04:07 am:Edit Post Quote Text Delete Post Print Post Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

i think my substrates are a bit too wet, i'll take care to make sure they're just moist enough to hold the BRF. and i'll try putting a layer of verm down on the bottom...thanks guys
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Bobby (Bobby)
Posted on Thursday, October 18, 2001 - 04:03 pm:Edit Post Quote Text Delete Post Print Post Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

I believe my jars have stalled in incubation. The mycelium is around 95 percent. Any sugestions on how to fix my problem?
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Nan (Nanook)
Posted on Thursday, October 18, 2001 - 04:36 pm:Edit Post Quote Text Delete Post Print Post Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Try flipping the jars upside down.
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Lichen (Lichen)
Posted on Thursday, October 18, 2001 - 06:14 pm:Edit Post Quote Text Delete Post Print Post Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Bobby, do you have the temperature regulated? If there's too much up and down variance, they can stall; also if they're cold they will stall. I have a few jars that are more than 7 weeks, and still trying...I found out they were stalled because they were too cold. As soon as I put them in a controlled environment, they started going again.
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Bobby (Bobby)
Posted on Thursday, October 18, 2001 - 06:38 pm:Edit Post Quote Text Delete Post Print Post Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

It is pretty cool in my apartment because we had a cold front come through. I'm going to put them over a stove and see what happens its a few degrees warmer.
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Lichen (Lichen)
Posted on Friday, October 19, 2001 - 01:12 am:Edit Post Quote Text Delete Post Print Post Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

get a thermometer and make sure it's at least 80F. Not higher than 86F, though. That's a nice comfortable range for pfjars
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XUnkyHerbX (Notapplicable)
Posted on Tuesday, October 30, 2001 - 05:39 am:Edit Post Quote Text Delete Post Print Post Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

My jars started to colonize very quickly, then all the sudden almost stopped. There is only a small area of 3 of 5 cakes that isn't colonizing.

You know how the germination starting areas grow out as a circle, then overlap with each other? Well it's like the circle only partially overlapped.. Shaped like this

. = Mycellium
[||||||||||]
|.....\ /.....|
|.... | |.....|
|..../__\....|

Later when they overlap...

[|||||||||]
|.....\/<--|---Area that won't colonize.
|............|
|...../\.....|

Any ideas why? Could a contaminate survive being that small and the mycellium so dominating?
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Mrt (Mrt)
Posted on Tuesday, October 30, 2001 - 06:11 am:Edit Post Quote Text Delete Post Print Post Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Take the tape off the holes on your lids (if you haven't already done so). I do this when my jars are about 50% colonized. This allows the mycelium to breath and speeds up growth.
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Nan (Nanook)
Posted on Tuesday, October 30, 2001 - 06:13 am:Edit Post Quote Text Delete Post Print Post Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Do what Mrt said, and also flip the jar upside down.
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Martaxus (Martaxus)
Posted on Tuesday, October 30, 2001 - 06:29 am:Edit Post Quote Text Delete Post Print Post Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

As a guideline Nanook, would you say jar flipping is adviseable at 50% colonization?
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Nan (Nanook)
Posted on Tuesday, October 30, 2001 - 06:44 am:Edit Post Quote Text Delete Post Print Post Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

You know, I never need to flip. Don't ask why, but my jars never seem to stall up. But when jars slow up and stop, pull the tape off and flip em right away... The reports that come in state it gets em moving again... And it worked when I happened by a growing friend who had an entire case of stalled jars... I peeled the tape off and flipped them and he called three days later and thanked me saying they were moving again. It works.

No need to flip if you are not stalling up (I never need to flip) but if you hit a problem it's the first thing you should do.
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XUnkyHerbX (Notapplicable)
Posted on Tuesday, October 30, 2001 - 06:54 am:Edit Post Quote Text Delete Post Print Post Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

My jars have been flipped actually.. I flip them once the mycellium start to touch each other. Maybe I did it too soon? Oof that would suck. I set them right side up again earlier today, but have now flipped them back upside down.

Some specifics I forgot to mention -
My jars are only covered in tinfoil, no tape was ever used.
The strain is panamanian.
I used the 'Invitro double-ended case casing tek'.

Think thats all, quick responces :)
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Nan (Nanook)
Posted on Tuesday, October 30, 2001 - 07:07 am:Edit Post Quote Text Delete Post Print Post Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Leave em be for 3 days. If you do not see any improvement, sanitize the cover of a phone book with some Lysol. Rap the jar lids on the phone book sharply and break the cake free from the bottom and return the jars to the incubator.

The most common reasons jars stall: incubation temps rising and falling (they need to be stable in the mid-80's and that is a problem this time of year); lack of moisture; yeast contam which is not visible to the eye.

Best O'luck to you.
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Martaxus (Martaxus)
Posted on Tuesday, October 30, 2001 - 07:41 pm:Edit Post Quote Text Delete Post Print Post Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

With the incubation temps, is it harmful to have them around 80-85F in the day, then 70F at night?
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Nan (Nanook)
Posted on Tuesday, October 30, 2001 - 09:45 pm:Edit Post Quote Text Delete Post Print Post Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Yes, when the temps rise and fall during incubation it can cause the jars to stall. Best to incubate at a set temp, even if it is lower than optimum.
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XUnkyHerbX (Notapplicable)
Posted on Tuesday, October 30, 2001 - 11:58 pm:Edit Post Quote Text Delete Post Print Post Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

So what do you suggest I do to keep them at a constant temp? It's fairly warm here during the day, but then gets bitter cold at night. I have them in the warmest room in the house, but the temp easily drops 15 degrees at night. Blah, they were so close! I have been waiting for atleast 3 days for those last areas, closer to a week actually Nan. Should I do that stuff on a phonebook now?

My basement is constantly cold.. probrablly 60 or so degrees, maybe a little higher. Should I put them down there even though its SO cold?
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XUnkyHerbX (Notapplicable)
Posted on Wednesday, October 31, 2001 - 12:00 am:Edit Post Quote Text Delete Post Print Post Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Hmm.. Reading more suggests people have an "Incubator".. Don't have much money, what would be the easiest way to contruct an incubator? My drawer is my incubator :/
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Nan (Nanook)
Posted on Wednesday, October 31, 2001 - 12:37 am:Edit Post Quote Text Delete Post Print Post Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Archives->Jars->Incubation

You can put something together on the cheap. For about $3.00 you can pop your jars into a styrofoam cooler in your warm room, that alone would go far towards stablizing the temperature swings. For a few bucks more you can add a fish tank heater in a pickle jar (which provides heat _and_ humidity keeping the jars from drying out).

Look at Marx2k's Pickle Jar Heater, when used in a Jar Incubator you do not need the bubbler.

I would think the $3.00 styro cooler would be a good start all by itself. It's clean, draft free, and stablizes temps.

Nan
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Kevin Smith (Canshroom)
Posted on Sunday, November 25, 2001 - 06:56 am:Edit Post Quote Text Delete Post Print Post Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

I think my jars might be stalled, so I'm going to remove the tape. What's the thought process with taking it off, anyway? Isn't there a contam concern? Or is the rationale of doing it that the jars are stalled anyway, so it's worth the risks of getting contams to get them started again?
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Liberty_Caps (Liberty_Caps)
Posted on Sunday, November 25, 2001 - 07:13 am:Edit Post Quote Text Delete Post Print Post Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

take the tape off that's probley why thier stalled they cant breath.
yes it may up the risk of contam a bit but not enough to really worry about. take the tape off a hole or 2 if your worried about contams
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Kevin Smith (Canshroom)
Posted on Sunday, November 25, 2001 - 07:16 am:Edit Post Quote Text Delete Post Print Post Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Thanks Liberty. I've taken the tape off all the jars to see if that stimulates more growth. My temp is low & I'm fixing that. Initially, the growth was good, but in the last week, there hasn't been much at all. Is there a danger of the moisture being lost with the tape off?
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Liberty_Caps (Liberty_Caps)
Posted on Sunday, November 25, 2001 - 07:32 am:Edit Post Quote Text Delete Post Print Post Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

just take your jars and flip them so thier siting on thier lids to help c02 excape..
about moisture loss, if your hole's aren't that big you will be fine.
if they get to dry dunk them at birth.
well good luck

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jim brown (Shrhobbyist)
Posted on Sunday, November 25, 2001 - 07:44 am:Edit Post Quote Text Delete Post Print Post Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Kevin, what kind of tape are you using? I use first aid/sports tape. It allows the mycellium to breath well until total colonization. Liberty is correct, though, if they have stalled removing tape and flipping is your best bet.
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Kevin Smith (Canshroom)
Posted on Sunday, November 25, 2001 - 07:51 am:Edit Post Quote Text Delete Post Print Post Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Forgot to flip them...I'll do that now. I'll have to check out that tape, jim. Thanks for the advice.
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jim brown (Shrhobbyist)
Posted on Sunday, November 25, 2001 - 08:01 am:Edit Post Quote Text Delete Post Print Post Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

What kind off tape were you using?
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greenthumb (Greenthumb)
Posted on Sunday, November 25, 2001 - 01:26 pm:Edit Post Quote Text Delete Post Print Post Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

tape talk

more tape talk

even more tape talk

flip tips

dunking
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Kevin Smith (Canshroom)
Posted on Monday, November 26, 2001 - 07:25 pm:Edit Post Quote Text Delete Post Print Post Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Jim- I was using masking tape like the PF tek says. I've read about micropore tape, but I don't know what it is or where to get it. Is someone could shed some light on why it's better, please let me know. (or any other kind of tape for that matter)
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Great Expectations (Shade)
Posted on Monday, November 26, 2001 - 07:55 pm:Edit Post Quote Text Delete Post Print Post Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

You can get micropore tape at this address for pretty cheap: http://www.mypharmacy.com.sg/dept.asp?dept_id=128

However, it's not really necessary, but if you want to be extra cautious...

Shroom Glossary
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Mr. Tambourine Man (Tambourine_Man)
Posted on Friday, December 07, 2001 - 05:20 pm:Edit Post Quote Text Delete Post Print Post Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Should jars that were flipped to prevent stalling during incubation, be flipped back over to right-side-up for fruiting invitro?
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hippie3 (Hippie)
Posted on Friday, December 07, 2001 - 05:22 pm:Edit Post Quote Text Delete Post Print Post Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

not really, it's better to leave them flipped.
that way, excess water and co2 drain down into the vermiculite and out the lid's holes.
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Mr. Tambourine Man (Tambourine_Man)
Posted on Friday, December 07, 2001 - 05:28 pm:Edit Post Quote Text Delete Post Print Post Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Even though the vermiculite won't be in contact with the cake for fruiting?
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hippie3 (Hippie)
Posted on Friday, December 07, 2001 - 05:31 pm:Edit Post Quote Text Delete Post Print Post Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

huh ?
the cake should slide down onto the verm.
tap it a few times to slide it if needed.
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Mr. Tambourine Man (Tambourine_Man)
Posted on Friday, December 07, 2001 - 05:52 pm:Edit Post Quote Text Delete Post Print Post Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Oh OK... must be a tapered jar thing.
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jim brown (Shrhobbyist)
Posted on Friday, December 07, 2001 - 06:02 pm:Edit Post Quote Text Delete Post Print Post Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

It shouldn't really matter if the cake is touching the Verm invitro because that verm should be dry, unless you have replaced with wet verm since total colonization.