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What the hell is this? (pics)awalter44nuecrew13 1 01-04-02  07:19 pm

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Martaxus (Martaxus)
Posted on Sunday, December 02, 2001 - 11:24 pm:Edit Post Quote Text Delete Post Print Post Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Oy! I've noticed in several of my jars (tall half-pints) that during colonization the substrate is sagging/shifting/seperating. This gives the mycelium a big challenge, as it often can't reach across the gap to continue colonizing along the outside of the jar.

My first thoughts were that the jars were packed too loosely, or that the ricewater incoculations of 1~1.5 ml/hole had 'washed away' or weakened the substrate's 'sitting structure'.

I don't think it's the former, as I've had this happen to tighter jars as well. I haven't been shaking the jars. This has happened to different batches, with the temp being anywhere between 70 & 85 F. I can see the latter happening, but I'm not sure how to avoid it.

Anyone else in this boat? Any suggestions?
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hippie3 (Hippie)
Posted on Monday, December 03, 2001 - 03:29 am:Edit Post Quote Text Delete Post Print Post Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

too dry.
store jars in high humidity environment.
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Mr. Tambourine Man (Tambourine_Man)
Posted on Monday, December 03, 2001 - 03:31 am:Edit Post Quote Text Delete Post Print Post Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

You're saying the humidity on the outside of the jars affects the humidity on the inside?
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hippie3 (Hippie)
Posted on Monday, December 03, 2001 - 03:36 am:Edit Post Quote Text Delete Post Print Post Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

correct.
a dry environment will suck the moisture right out of your jars.
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Mr. Tambourine Man (Tambourine_Man)
Posted on Monday, December 03, 2001 - 03:49 am:Edit Post Quote Text Delete Post Print Post Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Through the innoculation holes?
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hippie3 (Hippie)
Posted on Monday, December 03, 2001 - 03:54 am:Edit Post Quote Text Delete Post Print Post Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

yeah....
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Martaxus (Martaxus)
Posted on Monday, December 03, 2001 - 04:10 am:Edit Post Quote Text Delete Post Print Post Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

I'm guessing it would have to be through the holes, as glass is gas impermeable and the lids the same, hence the micron filter disks use.

I don't have a higher or lower humidity environment to place them in; my cakes remain either in half-pint jars or are transplanted to pint jars after birth. I store them upside-down(after birth) in the boxes they came in, lit & heated by x-mas lights.

If I were keeping food moist I'd wrap them in big plastic bags and add a couple pieces of apple, but something tells me that's just nuts.

I store the boxes (during colonization & growth)in a jury-rigged shelving unit, with only about 2" above each box for 'sliding' space. Any suggestions for improving this?

Wrap the shelving units in plastic and put a pan of water with a 2.5" fan on it inside?

Thanks!
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plinkerdink420 (Plinkerdink420)
Posted on Monday, December 03, 2001 - 04:47 am:Edit Post Quote Text Delete Post Print Post Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

if your jars have dried out in a dry environment, is there any way to remedy the situation without starting over?
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hippie3 (Hippie)
Posted on Monday, December 03, 2001 - 11:36 am:Edit Post Quote Text Delete Post Print Post Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

i know of no good way to fix them once they've dried out and begun to separate like that.
a pan of water should help, but better would be a simple room humidifier.
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plinkerdink420 (Plinkerdink420)
Posted on Monday, December 03, 2001 - 02:07 pm:Edit Post Quote Text Delete Post Print Post Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

cool... thanx... very small batch anyways, so if i gotta start over... not all that big of a deal
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TooMushTrippin (Toomushtrippin)
Posted on Sunday, December 16, 2001 - 02:12 am:Edit Post Quote Text Delete Post Print Post Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

c:\my documents\john
c:my documentsjohndscf0028.jpgdscf0028.jpg
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TooMushTrippin (Toomushtrippin)
Posted on Sunday, December 16, 2001 - 02:17 am:Edit Post Quote Text Delete Post Print Post Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

woops, for some reason the text got cut off. anyway, when i woke up this moring a few of my cakes were cracked at the top of the jar. it goes all the way across but its only about a 1/2 inch deep. Is this going to be a problem? will mycelium just fill in the crack? the only way i can think of that they got like that is when they clang against each other when i have to move the box that they're in..
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Nan (Nanook)
Posted on Sunday, December 16, 2001 - 07:19 am:Edit Post Quote Text Delete Post Print Post Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

The mycelium was pretty hungry huh? It ripped the cake apart

That is happening is the mycelium near the lid is contracting around the substrate, and the uncolonized bottom split from the stress. Your humidity may be too low and heat uneven. It will grow through, but the split is likely where the contam that eventually kills the cake will start.
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hippie3 (Hippie)
Posted on Sunday, December 16, 2001 - 02:33 pm:Edit Post Quote Text Delete Post Print Post Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

prolly a bit too dry, as well.
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TooMushTrippin (Toomushtrippin)
Posted on Sunday, December 16, 2001 - 03:50 pm:Edit Post Quote Text Delete Post Print Post Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

so theres a good chance that the cakes will be contaminated? or do you just mean if there's a contamination its likely to start at the crack?
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Kaijan (Kaijan)
Posted on Sunday, December 16, 2001 - 06:58 pm:Edit Post Quote Text Delete Post Print Post Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Well, if you haven't opened the jar yet, don't.

let the cake fully colonize all the material, then you should be fine.


kai