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Condensation Problem - 1

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venusfly (Venus)
Posted on Tuesday, November 27, 2001 - 12:26 am:Edit Post Quote Text Delete Post Print Post Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)


As stated I am using the SOS tek(Sea of Shrooms)This is my first time and I feel I have learned quite a bit due in part to all the generous info of good folks like y'all!I have varying sucess so far and have some more questions.I am new so bare with me please.After being informed that my cakes were not turning blue because of lack of nutrients but rather water I decided to spray the top and sides.Anyone unfamiliar with the SOS tek it is something like this:put small amount of casing material in bottom of 5 oz.solo cup,crumble cake,put top casing layer on crumbled cake.Just like a tray casing method only micro right.Now then, it has been over a month since I started.I have been blessed with some very decent little shrooms.Not lots and lots but a fair amount for a first timer I must say.I took the casing/cakes out of the solo cups and cut the cups down so that the middle mycelial layer and top casing layer were exposed.Ok on with the question.After spraying the exposed top and sides I have noticed an orangish, yellowish color appear just on the exposed middle cake.It is not powdery but has me concerned.There are also small black dots that appeared after I sprayed the exposed layers of casing material and crumbled cake.I assume these were nothing more than pinnheads rotting from the water I sprayed and promptly removed them .I have chucked about a fourth to one third of my casing/cakes due to small pink and green dots and some black fuzz that I was unsure of and cakes that were simply sitting there doing nothing.Any clue on the yellow color?Thank you all
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Lichen (Lichen)
Posted on Tuesday, November 27, 2001 - 12:32 am:Edit Post Quote Text Delete Post Print Post Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

if you rub it and it smears, it is not healthy mycelium...it's something else. If it doesn't, it's water damage. But usually water damage occurs when invitro, because of constant contact with excessive moisture. Hip will have the answer
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venusfly (Venus)
Posted on Tuesday, November 27, 2001 - 12:36 am:Edit Post Quote Text Delete Post Print Post Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

The yellowing appears to almost be a part of the cake
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venusfly (Venus)
Posted on Tuesday, November 27, 2001 - 12:39 am:Edit Post Quote Text Delete Post Print Post Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Also it should be noted that i have been spraying the top casing layer and the water runs down the side into the cut cup.I then pour the drained water out of the bottom of the cup.
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Lichen (Lichen)
Posted on Tuesday, November 27, 2001 - 12:45 am:Edit Post Quote Text Delete Post Print Post Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

well, this kind of thing should fuzz over rather quickly; within 36 hours. Watch it, and you'll get a better idea what is happening
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venusfly (Venus)
Posted on Tuesday, November 27, 2001 - 12:55 am:Edit Post Quote Text Delete Post Print Post Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

they have been there for the past two or three days.Water damage?
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venusfly (Venus)
Posted on Tuesday, November 27, 2001 - 12:58 am:Edit Post Quote Text Delete Post Print Post Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Oh yeah what about the black dots I assume are rotten pinheads?

be well
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hippie3 (Hippie)
Posted on Tuesday, November 27, 2001 - 11:23 am:Edit Post Quote Text Delete Post Print Post Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

sounds like you're prolly ok,
and correct with your diagnosis.
ignore the water damage but remove the black dots.
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whoever (Livedangerous)
Posted on Monday, November 19, 2001 - 04:54 am:Edit Post Quote Text Delete Post Print Post Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

two of my cakes have a yellowish tint with darker patches and they have been that way for a long time (even before birth)so i didnt think much of it. they started growing shrooms way after the rest of the cakes. basically, im in denial about these cakes being contaminated. is it possible that this is anything other than the infamous yellow mold that can lead to liver cancer. how close do you have to be to the cakes to be in danger of breathing in the harmful spores anyway. are cakes yellowish for any other nonharmful reason?
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Lichen (Lichen)
Posted on Monday, November 19, 2001 - 05:51 am:Edit Post Quote Text Delete Post Print Post Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

yellow is bad. Got any pics?
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Hippie (Hippie)
Posted on Monday, November 19, 2001 - 01:33 pm:Edit Post Quote Text Delete Post Print Post Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

yellow is most often water damage, very common.
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whoever (Livedangerous)
Posted on Monday, November 19, 2001 - 06:46 pm:Edit Post Quote Text Delete Post Print Post Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

i figured it was water damage too, especially because it occured on cakes that had the most water in the substrate. if its water damage are things ok to eat or are you just saying that is the likely cause of the harmful yellow mold? anyway ill try to post some pics tonight and get some feedback from you guys. thanks
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Nan (Nanook)
Posted on Monday, November 19, 2001 - 07:31 pm:Edit Post Quote Text Delete Post Print Post Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Water damage causes discoloration but it will not hurt you. Cakes are not as resistant to contams when water damaged, but water damage does not indicate that contams are present. Shrooms are OK to eat from water damaged cakes.
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drylander (Romelur)
Posted on Tuesday, November 20, 2001 - 12:22 am:Edit Post Quote Text Delete Post Print Post Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

there is a *great* pic over at the shroomery of this right now, might want to snag it for the archives :)
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Sillycybin (Sillycybin)
Posted on Tuesday, November 20, 2001 - 12:35 am:Edit Post Quote Text Delete Post Print Post Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

I have found that if my water damage occurs during the early stages of colonization and I correct the overly wet jar, the yellow part gets grown over with new mycelium and the cake makes a full recovery.

I don't know how controvertial this will be, but i am only speaking from my experience. I know that a lot of people recommend that you not mess with the jar lids and leave the tape on until at least 50-80% colonization, but then again other people grow without tape at all. Hypothetically, you could grow without a lid or jar...just a glass with foil over it. So here goes...

When i had water damage, i removed the tape and slightly unscrewed the jar lid, which allowed some of the water to escape the jar through evaporation. The yellow spots immediately stopped getting bigger and within days new fluffy mycelium was overgrowing the yellow spots.

I don't know if you want to try this or even if anyone else would recommend it, but it is something you could try when you first see the water damage in the jars if you want to stop the water damage from getting worse. If you are worried about contaminants, you could keep the environment around your jars particularly clean while the jar lids are loose

Sillycybin
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An guy (Boomer)
Posted on Tuesday, November 20, 2001 - 01:17 am:Edit Post Quote Text Delete Post Print Post Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Sometimes I think there is a kind of 'institutionalized' attitude with this hobby- if it works, post it, I say.

I had some of my jars open to let some of the water evap- it was too late for them, but none of them contammed out- they're still clean- this was with several days of lids off. The verm layer is an excellent filter.

This is not to say they *won't* ever get contaminated doing that, but that they didn't.

This also is not to say be careless around contamination.

This is just to say I am of the opinion that if something is working, balls out post it, even if it goes against conventional wisdom. That's how the thing evolves and grows.

So, thanks silly.

boomer
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Lichen (Lichen)
Posted on Tuesday, November 20, 2001 - 02:12 am:Edit Post Quote Text Delete Post Print Post Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Institute Of Mycological Knuckeheads

Actually there's no problem with this idea...I have birthed 95% colonized jars routinely, they go ahead and colonize out in the terrerium and fruit normally. I have also taken a spoon and scooped out yellow and red bacteria and mold, and had 100% success with the cakes that I thought were fucked.

None of the more experienced people here will agree that we are institutionalized...rather, innovation is what keeps our hobby interesting, even though pfcakes are still the best way to grow out easy, foolproof, clean spawn.
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An guy (Boomer)
Posted on Tuesday, November 20, 2001 - 02:31 am:Edit Post Quote Text Delete Post Print Post Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Well, you're right lichen- this is a really open-minded crowd- I just think there is a slight tendency is all, as evidenced by silly's hesitancy above, and you gettin chewed on a little for that post this morning.

I think there's lot's of open minds, a little bit of instituionalization, very much helpfulness, good advice, sometimes I want to say 'try it' when someone else says 'it won't work- that's not how it's done', etc.

pf slammed you this morning- I believe there is merit to his position, and I believe there is merit to yours, as I think others do- pretty much all the pix show spread out caps...

I would not bash pf- He's kind of a cult hero to me and I dont' give a shit what anyone sez- I also would not bash you on your experience. I even thought the bashing he did was great- bashing is needed once in a while- anyone who is nice-nice all the time is a person who scares the shit outta me- soemthing wrong there, and it usually carries a big fucking bloody axe....

I am just saying, there is just the slightest tendency, and it's evidenced in the tentativeness of your 'BS' post this morning, and in silly's above.

So, it's just something I want to watch for and try to put a light on, not that this board is full of narrow-minded chuckleheads- I think there's marvelous thinking, doing, spreading going on here.

My motto is 'Safety first, but try any old thing that comes into your (pin)head...'

And I think that seems to be the motto of this board and it's members too.

I just want to work to keep it that way....and man, I keep thinking I'm sounding self-righteous- I dont' mean to, don't mean to say I'm the only or most forward-thinking person here- wouldn't even presume....man, I'm gonna shut up now, I hope you get what I didn't do a very good job of saying.....

:)
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whoever (Livedangerous)
Posted on Tuesday, November 20, 2001 - 02:37 am:Edit Post Quote Text Delete Post Print Post Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

1,yellowcakes.bmp
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Lichen (Lichen)
Posted on Tuesday, November 20, 2001 - 02:41 am:Edit Post Quote Text Delete Post Print Post Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

I understand what you're saying, and you're right, and free to say it any ole way you like
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whoever (Livedangerous)
Posted on Tuesday, November 20, 2001 - 02:42 am:Edit Post Quote Text Delete Post Print Post Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

the picture is shitty if it even works since i dont know what im doing but it might give you an idea of the coloryellowcakes
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Hippie (Hippie)
Posted on Tuesday, November 20, 2001 - 01:39 pm:Edit Post Quote Text Delete Post Print Post Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

yup, bad water damage.
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Delta25 (Delta25)
Posted on Wednesday, October 24, 2001 - 07:59 pm:Edit Post Quote Text Delete Post Print Post Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Ok i have a jar bout 40% colonized was doing fine actually still is but the myc at the inoculation points areturning a dusty light orange at first i thougt it might be water spots but now i am not sure any ideas
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Nan (Nanook)
Posted on Wednesday, October 24, 2001 - 08:45 pm:Edit Post Quote Text Delete Post Print Post Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Light tan, brown, and orangie colors are frequently seen in jars on older mycelia. I would not fret at this point, but keep your eyes on it. At 40% colonized the mycelia should be snow white throughout: if it gets worse, goes fuzzy, or changes colors for the worse... Pitch it and make up a replacement jar.
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Delta25 (Delta25)
Posted on Wednesday, October 24, 2001 - 09:21 pm:Edit Post Quote Text Delete Post Print Post Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

thanks nanook
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SYDYSTYK (Addict)
Posted on Thursday, October 25, 2001 - 02:11 am:Edit Post Quote Text Delete Post Print Post Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

i see those colors frequently on my albinos(kinda overdue for birth) especially
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Nan (Nanook)
Posted on Thursday, October 25, 2001 - 03:03 am:Edit Post Quote Text Delete Post Print Post Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Yep me too. But it usually appears on older fully colonized jars, jars at 40% should be snow white at the innoculation point. Keep an eye on it. Nan
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Bobby (Bobby)
Posted on Thursday, October 25, 2001 - 05:18 am:Edit Post Quote Text Delete Post Print Post Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Alright I just had a birth for 10 PF jars. All looked well but one had little greenish-blue spots on the bottom of the cake. It was there before I opened the jar. I opened the lids at 80% and fliped to let CO2 out. Do you think this is a bacteria? How can I find out? Thanks in advance!
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Nan (Nanook)
Posted on Thursday, October 25, 2001 - 05:28 am:Edit Post Quote Text Delete Post Print Post Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Normal bruising. Bacterial infections eat into the cakes. Mold smears when you rub it. Blue/green discoloration is fairly normal... Why is that you and Snoop have symptoms of dry cakes??
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Bobby (Bobby)
Posted on Thursday, October 25, 2001 - 04:10 pm:Edit Post Quote Text Delete Post Print Post Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

I don't think it is dry. When I pulled it out it had condensation on the sides and on the jar it is at the bottom of the cake directly in the middle at the last place the mycelium grew together. It looks like little pieces of vermiculite that turned greenish-blue.
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Bobby (Bobby)
Posted on Thursday, October 25, 2001 - 07:51 pm:Edit Post Quote Text Delete Post Print Post Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Should I try to cut out the green specs?
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Nan (Nanook)
Posted on Thursday, October 25, 2001 - 09:21 pm:Edit Post Quote Text Delete Post Print Post Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Bobby, do these spots smear when you rub them? Does it wash off?
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Bobby (Bobby)
Posted on Friday, October 26, 2001 - 12:23 am:Edit Post Quote Text Delete Post Print Post Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Ya they washed of.
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Nan (Nanook)
Posted on Friday, October 26, 2001 - 12:27 am:Edit Post Quote Text Delete Post Print Post Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Then it is a Mold Contam and you have two choices: pitch it or cut off the contamed area and try casing it.
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jared (Jared112)
Posted on Thursday, November 29, 2001 - 05:59 pm:Edit Post Quote Text Delete Post Print Post Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

I was reading some stuff about cakes getting water logged inside of the jars. When I looked at my jars more carefully I noticed that there appears to be water against the side of the glass in little spots, which I know is normal condensation, but Toward the bottom where the mycelium is still growing towards the substrate I noticed that the first 1/2" or so of the mycelium appears to have water between it and the glass. Can you guys see what I am talking about, and What should I do about it?
water logged
Also notice where the mycelium isn't really white anymore, is this just the normal yellowing of the mycelium due to too much water? I took the tape off the holes and loosened the lids half way. They were upside down, now I have them right side up again.
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Brettiejams (Brettiejams)
Posted on Thursday, November 29, 2001 - 07:00 pm:Edit Post Quote Text Delete Post Print Post Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

If you flip over your jars, any excess water should run down into your dry verm barrier where it will be absorbed.

If your jars were already upside down, it's prolly just normal condensation.

Your cakes should whiten back up nicely after a dunk at birth and a little recovery time.
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An guy (Boomer)
Posted on Thursday, November 29, 2001 - 07:22 pm:Edit Post Quote Text Delete Post Print Post Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

What brettie sed- I had that too. Wasn't anything to be concerned about, turns out.
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jared (Jared112)
Posted on Thursday, November 29, 2001 - 07:35 pm:Edit Post Quote Text Delete Post Print Post Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

So I should just wait until I see some pins then I'll birth them and proceed as usual? Sounds good to me, I just worry about my 'shrooms a lot. Thanks
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Marc Schreiber (Dreamer)
Posted on Friday, October 19, 2001 - 04:29 am:Edit Post Quote Text Delete Post Print Post Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Good day to all...

I've done a spore print recently and afterwards placed them in syringes for the first time!!!

and I've done a new batch of cakes and injected them!!

collecting the spores was a bit nerve wracking but I was cautious!!!

the growth in the cakes is moving along very well...but I have a small cause of concern...on the bottom of a few jars,there's a small yellowish beigish patch...I've grown shrooms a number of times but I don't recall seeing that particular color till now...is this a possible water contaminant???if the mycelium grows over it & the cake smells mushroomy when I open the jar....should I still worry??? if the yellow patch stays visible,what should I do???

confused!!!

have a good day,Dreamer
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Brad (Raze)
Posted on Friday, October 19, 2001 - 05:12 am:Edit Post Quote Text Delete Post Print Post Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

All I have to say is dont open the jar... That equals contam 99% of the time
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Brettiejams (Brettiejams)
Posted on Friday, October 19, 2001 - 06:11 am:Edit Post Quote Text Delete Post Print Post Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Prolly just a little water damage.... if you dunk your cakes for a short time at birth(6 to 12 hours)... this will stimulate some new growth and the cake can "heal" itself then.

If you flip your jars over... any excess condensation should be absorbed into the dry verm barrier.

I'd just flip them over and don't open them until they are fully colonized

Shroom Glossary