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Archive through December 02, 2003ridderMike25 1 12-02-03  01:09 am

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ridder (Ridder)
Senior Member
Username: Ridder

Post Number: 626
Registered: 01-2003
Posted on Tuesday, December 02, 2003 - 01:09 am:Edit Post Quote Text Delete Post Print Post Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

i know hip what i'm talking about is the tendency to do such.. of course it's a genetic traight and that is why you can over multiple generations breed a strain that has a greater tendency. If the dog and a natural reaction to the cropping of the tale that was favorable and you breeded the dog because of that you would hope over multiple generations of selected breeding to get that trait in the majority of offspring from your selected breeding. That is all i'm talking about. Of course the cause is not something that can be inherited but the effect, or in this case reaction, is. The fact is it would have to be many many many generations before you would probably have an undesired effect, but lets say someone performed this trick to get females from the same strain over many generations for 30 years.. If you compared that to the original strain I would bet the strain 30 years later would have a greater tendency to hermie because it went thru n generations in an artificial environment that favored the hermie traight as a way of reproduction to the more natural way.

As far as the bright light issue I am aware of it and have been watching it closely.. however 2o of the plants that need it haven't stretched enough to water underneath and I do not want to disturb them until they've taken root better :-). Do you think i should hold off on spraying them until i can get them underneath?
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Hippie3 (Admin)
Board Administrator
Username: Admin

Post Number: 8307
Registered: 02-2001
Posted on Tuesday, December 02, 2003 - 01:13 am:Edit Post Quote Text Delete Post Print Post Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

despite what logic might tell you,
no number of generations in a given environment will alter the genetic make-up.
you could cut dogs tails off for a million years
and the next litter they'd still have tails.
ditto for stress-induced hermi flowers.
but hey, why argue ?
it's your project, not mine.
but yeah, i'd hold off directly misting those leaves unless you do it right before the dark cycle so it can dry off before the bright light returns.
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ridder (Ridder)
Senior Member
Username: Ridder

Post Number: 627
Registered: 01-2003
Posted on Tuesday, December 02, 2003 - 01:15 am:Edit Post Quote Text Delete Post Print Post Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

And by reaction dog wise i meant mainly a physical body reaction.. like say it caused his ass to gain 25% more muscle mass to compensate for the loss of balance which in turn gave it a more powerful towing strength etc.. although emotional response must be somewhat genetic as well.. the question is how much?
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Hippie3 (Admin)
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Username: Admin

Post Number: 8308
Registered: 02-2001
Posted on Tuesday, December 02, 2003 - 01:17 am:Edit Post Quote Text Delete Post Print Post Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

A question on collecting pollen from male plants...how do you do this safely with the females close by...or possibly in the same chamber as the male?
not in my opinion.
those little bastids can surprise you,
it's best to move males to a different area as soon as you can id them.
some say a baggie or paper bag over the flower clusters but almost always some pollen will leak, or you miss seeing one down under. or if the baggie is tight enough not to leak, it's too humid in there and the shoot starts to rot, wilt, etc.
i'd remove them to a whole different area to let their flowers open if pollen is desired.
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ridder (Ridder)
Senior Member
Username: Ridder

Post Number: 628
Registered: 01-2003
Posted on Tuesday, December 02, 2003 - 01:24 am:Edit Post Quote Text Delete Post Print Post Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

well actually hip there is one big difference tho between the dog and the plant.. the plant when hermied this way is breeding with itself so it is effectively creating a genetic duplicate.. so perhaps in that sense it isn't really breeding generations.. however i would imagine that a senisense of the genetic code making up that strand would occur over many (maybe thousands) generations if left unchecked due to the lack of control in the artificial environment to keep genetic mutations down.. Example would be likening it to a carbon copy.. seemingly identical but often a bit fuzzier than the original... Of course i doubt any of us could live long enough to see this happen in any plant let alone cannabis... but who knows :-)
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Hippie3 (Admin)
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Username: Admin

Post Number: 8311
Registered: 02-2001
Posted on Tuesday, December 02, 2003 - 01:35 am:Edit Post Quote Text Delete Post Print Post Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

agreed, there is always a danger with in-breeding.
still, if one culls out the undesirables,
and only keeps the best to breed next gen,
it can be carried on many generations,
as the royal families of europe can attest.
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PBeester (Pissybee)
Senior Member
Username: Pissybee

Post Number: 302
Registered: 12-2002
Posted on Tuesday, December 02, 2003 - 06:46 am:Edit Post Quote Text Delete Post Print Post Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

The way they get feminized seeds is by turning a plant hermi and cross pollinating it with itself. Or if you have a male plant that grows female flowers, not a female that grows male flowers, then the hermi can be used to produce mostly fmale seeds. I'll have to look up in my reference for more details but that is the gist of it.
PB
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Alien Primate (Alienprimate)
Intermediate Member
Username: Alienprimate

Post Number: 64
Registered: 08-2003
Posted on Tuesday, December 02, 2003 - 07:22 am:Edit Post Quote Text Delete Post Print Post Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

The interesting thing about the dog tail example is that the dog does not lose its tail on its own due to certain conditions.

If we pretend that there is a genetic trait that will allow a dog to shed its tail under certain conditions, and these conditions can become less and less strenuous through the generations because the trait is favored by natural selection, then I would think it would be possible for a dog to have the capability of losing its tail faster and under less strict conditions than its ancestor. This is assuming that natural variation or mutation provides a genetically variable degree of conditions for this tail-losing capability.

Now if we move this analogy over to the issue of hermaphrodites, I think we can see what Ridder is getting at.

It's true that if you cut a dog's tail off generation after generation it will have no impact on the DNA, but if it wasn't cut off but instead fell off due to genetic conditions, it could become more prevalent if natural selection favored the trait.

This is just like no matter how dark I tan my children won't inherit my tanned skin, but only my "potential" to tan, or my tanning plasticity.

So it is really the "plasticity" of becoming a hermaphrodite that should be inheritable, I think. If natural selection favors high plasticity, then the plants might become hermaphrodite much easier over the generations if natural selection favors it.

So in other words, Hip and Ridder are both right! Sorry for the ramble.
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Hippie3 (Admin)
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Username: Admin

Post Number: 8397
Registered: 02-2001
Posted on Wednesday, December 03, 2003 - 12:50 am:Edit Post Quote Text Delete Post Print Post Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

of course, if one had multiple females that were stressed in hermi,
what's to say you couldn't take pollen from one female and use it on a different female ?
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ridder (Ridder)
Senior Member
Username: Ridder

Post Number: 643
Registered: 01-2003
Posted on Friday, December 05, 2003 - 05:15 am:Edit Post Quote Text Delete Post Print Post Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Here are some updates on my grow.. been busy building! :-)

Example of the inside..
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Example of the outside..
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This is the entrance..
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This is the entrance open! :-)
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ridder (Ridder)
Senior Member
Username: Ridder

Post Number: 644
Registered: 01-2003
Posted on Friday, December 05, 2003 - 05:23 am:Edit Post Quote Text Delete Post Print Post Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Aaaaaaaaaaand heres the vents :-)
Upload
Upload
Upload
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Jesse James (Spacecowboy)
Senior Member
Username: Spacecowboy

Post Number: 421
Registered: 03-2003
Posted on Friday, December 05, 2003 - 05:49 am:Edit Post Quote Text Delete Post Print Post Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

nice vents,

going to install a C02 system?
If it's not broken, then the government will try to fix it until it is.

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ridder (Ridder)
Senior Member
Username: Ridder

Post Number: 648
Registered: 01-2003
Posted on Friday, December 05, 2003 - 10:07 pm:Edit Post Quote Text Delete Post Print Post Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

thx :-), prolly not.. but ya never know :-)

Here is an update on 3 of the 4 little ones.. i'm pretty sure the one is not gonna make it so it doesn't get a photo op... very sad to see it go but such as life :-(.

At any rate here they are :-)!

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Upload
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ridder (Ridder)
Senior Member
Username: Ridder

Post Number: 649
Registered: 01-2003
Posted on Friday, December 05, 2003 - 10:34 pm:Edit Post Quote Text Delete Post Print Post Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

one question on the top plant.. time to top yet (considering i'm doing ScrOG)? Perhapse I should let it grow a bit more then i can still take above the 5th node and turn the top into a clone? the FIM topping lookins interesting too, but it seems you have to do it right at the tip of the grow tip on that.
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Hippie3 (Admin)
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Username: Admin

Post Number: 8667
Registered: 02-2001
Posted on Saturday, December 06, 2003 - 12:17 am:Edit Post Quote Text Delete Post Print Post Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

none of those are ready yet.
the middle one looks scorched,
maybe from too much light on wet leaves...
do they already have roots ?

(Message edited by admin on December 06, 2003)
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ridder (Ridder)
Senior Member
Username: Ridder

Post Number: 650
Registered: 01-2003
Posted on Saturday, December 06, 2003 - 03:23 am:Edit Post Quote Text Delete Post Print Post Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

yeah it was scorched but not from too much light on wet leaves.. it happened the first day i got them.. long story short unfortunate timing and a light that was too low on clones not yet ready for prime time.
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Hippie3 (Admin)
Board Administrator
Username: Admin

Post Number: 8737
Registered: 02-2001
Posted on Saturday, December 06, 2003 - 03:35 am:Edit Post Quote Text Delete Post Print Post Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

oh yeah,
you mentioned that.
i gotta quit sitting here
puffing on this bowl while i post.
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ridder (Ridder)
Senior Member
Username: Ridder

Post Number: 651
Registered: 01-2003
Posted on Saturday, December 06, 2003 - 03:37 am:Edit Post Quote Text Delete Post Print Post Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

hehe good idea think i'll roll one myself :-)
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Marvin Martian (Marvinm92)
Advanced Member
Username: Marvinm92

Post Number: 93
Registered: 10-2002
Posted on Sunday, December 07, 2003 - 12:30 am:Edit Post Quote Text Delete Post Print Post Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Whats up Riddler?

A tripod does wonders, eh?

What is that reflective material in the first few posts? ReflectX?
A wise monkey never monkeys with another monkeys monkey...
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ridder (Ridder)
Senior Member
Username: Ridder

Post Number: 663
Registered: 01-2003
Posted on Tuesday, December 09, 2003 - 04:15 am:Edit Post Quote Text Delete Post Print Post Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

an update, just before i topped 2 of em (FIM style) :-)

She got topped :-)
Upload

Not her! :-)
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She did tho! :-)
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And look, just as i was about to pull this one (had all but given up hope), a new tip emerges :-)! 2 days ago I spread the 2 leaves as much as i could, hoping the slight splitting (not visible of course) combined with light to the area would help, and boom! :-) :-)
Upload
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Alien Primate (Alienprimate)
Intermediate Member
Username: Alienprimate

Post Number: 69
Registered: 08-2003
Posted on Tuesday, December 09, 2003 - 04:41 am:Edit Post Quote Text Delete Post Print Post Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Nice job Ridder, they are lookin good! based on the look of the stems are they cuttings? Sweet deal, keep us updated!

AP
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ridder (Ridder)
Senior Member
Username: Ridder

Post Number: 665
Registered: 01-2003
Posted on Tuesday, December 09, 2003 - 07:24 am:Edit Post Quote Text Delete Post Print Post Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

yes they are, hense the fully mature purple color in the stem (a trait of this strain, silver haze) :-)

(Message edited by ridder on December 09, 2003)
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ridder (Ridder)
Senior Member
Username: Ridder

Post Number: 693
Registered: 01-2003
Posted on Saturday, December 13, 2003 - 01:28 am:Edit Post Quote Text Delete Post Print Post Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

The latest installment on my grow :-)

This is the one I thought was dead, it's really recovering nicely now :-)
Upload

The next two are the same plant; the second is a closeup of the branching from the topping 2+ days ago :-)
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Upload

#3 :-)
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The next 2 are also the same plant, right before and after topping :-)
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Upload
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Jesse James (Spacecowboy)
Senior Member
Username: Spacecowboy

Post Number: 475
Registered: 03-2003
Posted on Saturday, December 13, 2003 - 02:50 am:Edit Post Quote Text Delete Post Print Post Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Good to see they are still doing well, nice pics too.

If it's not broken, then the government will try to fix it until it is.

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myco domesticus (Mycophil)
Senior Member
Username: Mycophil

Post Number: 618
Registered: 10-2002
Posted on Saturday, December 13, 2003 - 03:30 am:Edit Post Quote Text Delete Post Print Post Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

looks like you got em going
congrats and happy tokin
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ridder (Ridder)
Senior Member
Username: Ridder

Post Number: 714
Registered: 01-2003
Posted on Monday, December 15, 2003 - 07:14 am:Edit Post Quote Text Delete Post Print Post Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

another update for ya'll :-)
Upload
Upload
Upload
Upload
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Hippie3 (Admin)
Board Administrator
Username: Admin

Post Number: 9950
Registered: 02-2001
Posted on Sunday, December 28, 2003 - 06:09 pm:Edit Post Quote Text Delete Post Print Post Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

any updates ?
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ridder (Ridder)
Senior Member
Username: Ridder

Post Number: 750
Registered: 01-2003
Posted on Monday, December 29, 2003 - 05:22 pm:Edit Post Quote Text Delete Post Print Post Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Hip -

I started a new thread a week or so ago for the updates cuz there were too many pics in this one thread; peeps with modems don't care for the loading. I am going to be putting all updates in the following thread, each update as a subthread of the main thread :-).

http://archives.mycotopia.net/discus/messages/15362/759 99.html?1072718428
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Hippie3 (Admin)
Board Administrator
Username: Admin

Post Number: 10045
Registered: 02-2001
Posted on Monday, December 29, 2003 - 11:36 pm:Edit Post Quote Text Delete Post Print Post Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

thx

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