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Hippie3 (Admin)
Board Administrator
Username: Admin

Post Number: 10937
Registered: 02-2001
Posted on Saturday, January 17, 2004 - 02:30 am:Edit Post Quote Text Delete Post Print Post Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

archive material
application/pdfUpload
CroweIMC6.pdf (381.1 k)

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Sharkie Jones (Rainbowfungus)
Senior Member
Username: Rainbowfungus

Post Number: 636
Registered: 12-2002
Posted on Saturday, January 17, 2004 - 05:55 am:Edit Post Quote Text Delete Post Print Post Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

In english please.
God bless the Post Office, and tyvek.
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rodger rabbit (Skyypilot)
Senior Member
Username: Skyypilot

Post Number: 1484
Registered: 02-2003
Posted on Saturday, January 17, 2004 - 07:04 am:Edit Post Quote Text Delete Post Print Post Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

caffeine seems to help sclerotia formation.
"I feel rowdy and I don't know why. . .Excuse me while I kiss the sky". . .jimi hendrix
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psycho naut (Xochipilli2012)
Senior Member
Username: Xochipilli2012

Post Number: 415
Registered: 05-2003
Posted on Saturday, January 17, 2004 - 08:15 am:Edit Post Quote Text Delete Post Print Post Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

I wonder what would work better.

using brewed coffee in grain jars instead of water.
or coffee grinds mixed in the grain,maybe both.
"I got ta get my props,cops,trying ta come and snatch my crops.These pigs wanna blow my house down,Head underground to the next town.they get mad when they come to raid my pad,And I'm out in the nine-deuce Cad"
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rodger rabbit (Skyypilot)
Senior Member
Username: Skyypilot

Post Number: 1487
Registered: 02-2003
Posted on Saturday, January 17, 2004 - 08:42 am:Edit Post Quote Text Delete Post Print Post Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Brewed coffee, but dilute it 50% from 'drinking' strength, and use that to hydrate the grains.
"I feel rowdy and I don't know why. . .Excuse me while I kiss the sky". . .jimi hendrix
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Soliver (Soliver)
Senior Member
Username: Soliver

Post Number: 525
Registered: 03-2003
Posted on Saturday, January 17, 2004 - 03:51 pm:Edit Post Quote Text Delete Post Print Post Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Interesting....

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Hippie3 (Admin)
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Username: Admin

Post Number: 11041
Registered: 02-2001
Posted on Sunday, January 18, 2004 - 03:20 am:Edit Post Quote Text Delete Post Print Post Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

yep.
i'm wondering if it will similarly trigger pins in cubies...
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rodger rabbit (Skyypilot)
Senior Member
Username: Skyypilot

Post Number: 1506
Registered: 02-2003
Posted on Sunday, January 18, 2004 - 03:18 pm:Edit Post Quote Text Delete Post Print Post Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

It sure made those pr's pin in two weeks after a grain to grain transfer into popcorn. http://archives.mycotopia.net/discuscgi-bin/discus/show.cgi?t pc=2&post=155968#POST155968 Of course, the master was already pinning when I did the grain to grain, so two experiments were going at the same time. Hardly reductive.
"I feel rowdy and I don't know why. . .Excuse me while I kiss the sky". . .jimi hendrix
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Joe Millionaire (Rotterdam_y2k)
Senior Member
Username: Rotterdam_y2k

Post Number: 640
Registered: 07-2003
Posted on Sunday, January 18, 2004 - 04:00 pm:Edit Post Quote Text Delete Post Print Post Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

How about decaffinated coffee? Or is is the stimulant in the caffeine that does it?
"Ekam Sat Vipras Bahudda Vidante"
The One Truth is named by the wise in many ways.
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Sharkie Jones (Rainbowfungus)
Senior Member
Username: Rainbowfungus

Post Number: 643
Registered: 12-2002
Posted on Sunday, January 18, 2004 - 04:09 pm:Edit Post Quote Text Delete Post Print Post Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

So if I were to use diluted coffee in my rye grass preperation, I would just soak the grains in diluted coffee overnight?
God bless the Post Office, and tyvek.
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rodger rabbit (Skyypilot)
Senior Member
Username: Skyypilot

Post Number: 1507
Registered: 02-2003
Posted on Sunday, January 18, 2004 - 04:26 pm:Edit Post Quote Text Delete Post Print Post Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Yes sharkie, or longer if bacteria is a problem with the grains you use. I soak them up to 48 hours to allow the bacterial endospores to germinate, so they'll be 86'd by the boiling/pc'ing. If you'll use the diluted coffee to hydrate your rye, you'll notice a big difference. I soak the grains in the coffee, then boil for a few minutes just before draining, to heat the grains up. Once you pour them into a collander to drain, lots of moisture from the kernals will evaporate due to the heat, especially if you shake the collander a few times as the grain cools. This will leave the rye at the right moisture level to use.
"I feel rowdy and I don't know why. . .Excuse me while I kiss the sky". . .jimi hendrix
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rodger rabbit (Skyypilot)
Senior Member
Username: Skyypilot

Post Number: 1508
Registered: 02-2003
Posted on Sunday, January 18, 2004 - 04:29 pm:Edit Post Quote Text Delete Post Print Post Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

By the way, I pc rye(after boiling) for 2 1/2 hours at 15 lbs. That is more than recommended in tmc and ggmm, but it works very well, and reduces the contamination level to a 'tolerable' point.
"I feel rowdy and I don't know why. . .Excuse me while I kiss the sky". . .jimi hendrix
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Sharkie Jones (Rainbowfungus)
Senior Member
Username: Rainbowfungus

Post Number: 644
Registered: 12-2002
Posted on Sunday, January 18, 2004 - 08:10 pm:Edit Post Quote Text Delete Post Print Post Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Hmmm,I will try that this week. Sounds like an interesting experiment. Thanks for the info.
God bless the Post Office, and tyvek.
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Sharkie Jones (Rainbowfungus)
Senior Member
Username: Rainbowfungus

Post Number: 645
Registered: 12-2002
Posted on Sunday, January 18, 2004 - 08:12 pm:Edit Post Quote Text Delete Post Print Post Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

When you say boil for a few minutes, do you mean that you boil them in the coffee soak?
God bless the Post Office, and tyvek.
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Hippie3 (Admin)
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Username: Admin

Post Number: 11109
Registered: 02-2001
Posted on Sunday, January 18, 2004 - 08:31 pm:Edit Post Quote Text Delete Post Print Post Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

I soak the grains in the coffee, then boil for a few minutes just before draining, to heat the grains up.
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Soliver (Soliver)
Senior Member
Username: Soliver

Post Number: 536
Registered: 03-2003
Posted on Monday, January 19, 2004 - 07:51 pm:Edit Post Quote Text Delete Post Print Post Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

OK-

Here's what I'm doing - I'll keep you fellows posted as to the
results:

large batch of rye grass SEED soaked in dilute coffee solution
overnight, boiled briefly, drained, then loaded
2/3 into quart jars and leftovers dumped into 1/2 pint
jars (full up).

All jars were covered with a 2x layer of tyvek and the
lids were screwed on.
The quart jars have 1/2 inch holes drilled into the
lids for air exchange as well as a smaller hole in
each lid for innoculation.

I have spores for the following side-by-side comparison:
1 quart jar and 3 1/2 pint jars of the following:

Mexicana A. Strain (see my post in Pics for previous experiences)
Lippy Yai
Koh Samui

Perhaps the LY and KS will form sclerotia in this
medium with the caffeine soak? Who knows! We'll soon find out!
(and by soon, I mean in a few months).

The mexicana should show some sclerotia growth in
a month or so - we'll see about the rest.

The PC is huffing away as we speak - I'll innoculate
tonight.

Even if the LY and KS don't grow sclerotia, I'm curious to
see if they'll fruit invitro or cased... oh what fun we'll have . . .

Soliver
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Hippie3 (Admin)
Board Administrator
Username: Admin

Post Number: 11194
Registered: 02-2001
Posted on Tuesday, January 20, 2004 - 01:07 am:Edit Post Quote Text Delete Post Print Post Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

cubies don't make sclerotia, that's a species-specific trait.
but they will fruit invitro, of course.
your experiment should prove very interesting.
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Soliver (Soliver)
Senior Member
Username: Soliver

Post Number: 537
Registered: 03-2003
Posted on Tuesday, January 20, 2004 - 08:58 pm:Edit Post Quote Text Delete Post Print Post Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

The grass seed is clumped together in the jars..
If I shake 'em, it breaks up a bit but not all the
way;
think I should go ahead and innoc?
There's no moisture buildup or pooling at the bottom . . .

Or perhaps I should try again; maybe mix some damp
verm in with the rye grass? Hmmmm. . . .

sol
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Hippie3 (Admin)
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Username: Admin

Post Number: 11273
Registered: 02-2001
Posted on Tuesday, January 20, 2004 - 11:47 pm:Edit Post Quote Text Delete Post Print Post Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

beat the sucker [wear thick gloves] on a phone book until it breaks up better
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rodger rabbit (Skyypilot)
Senior Member
Username: Skyypilot

Post Number: 1536
Registered: 02-2003
Posted on Wednesday, January 21, 2004 - 12:18 am:Edit Post Quote Text Delete Post Print Post Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

You've gotta wash grains or wbs really well before you try to hydrate them. Put the required amount into a large boiling pot, then fill it up with water and shake around. Drain and repeat until the water pours off clear. You'll find wbs, rye, and corn will have a lot of dust floating in with the grains. Get rid of it, or they will clump up, and you also stand a greater risk of bacteria contamination.
"I feel rowdy and I don't know why. . .Excuse me while I kiss the sky". . .jimi hendrix
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Hippie3 (Admin)
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Username: Admin

Post Number: 11346
Registered: 02-2001
Posted on Wednesday, January 21, 2004 - 02:01 pm:Edit Post Quote Text Delete Post Print Post Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

a little calcium carbonate [chalk] added to the jar before pc'ing also reduces clumping.
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Soliver (Soliver)
Senior Member
Username: Soliver

Post Number: 545
Registered: 03-2003
Posted on Wednesday, January 21, 2004 - 10:47 pm:Edit Post Quote Text Delete Post Print Post Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Cool -

thanks guys - I'm just gonna scrap these jars and
redo. No point in wasting good spores on bad
substrate...

:-)

sol
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Headro (Goodiekev)
Junior Member
Username: Goodiekev

Post Number: 16
Registered: 01-2004
Posted on Wednesday, January 21, 2004 - 10:56 pm:Edit Post Quote Text Delete Post Print Post Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

As a note, decaffeinated coffee is not UNcaffinated; it still has 50% the caffeine of regular. So perhaps there would not be any need to dilute decaf.
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not *really* a Jedi (Mycofile)
Intermediate Member
Username: Mycofile

Post Number: 67
Registered: 05-2003
Posted on Thursday, January 22, 2004 - 10:14 pm:Edit Post Quote Text Delete Post Print Post Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Really!? What a scam, I saw some "light" coffee at the store, which claimed to have only 50% the cafeine of regular coffee! I guess it's just decaf for people who think they'd be sissies if they actually bought decaf.

But so far as dilution goes, I would guess I would have to dilute it about 10% of my drinking strength. My coffee's been known to even get speed freaks jittery!
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Peter Parker (Captain_future)
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Username: Captain_future

Post Number: 3
Registered: 01-2004
Posted on Thursday, January 22, 2004 - 10:30 pm:Edit Post Quote Text Delete Post Print Post Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

No point in wasting good spores on bad
substrate...


Time to start a petri culture, eh? I always use clumbed white milk rice (round korn) when making sklerotia spawn. Just let the agar piece glide over the surface a bit and a few days later the Mycelium starts to grow inside the rice.

Greez,
Cap

(Message edited by captain_future on January 22, 2004)
May the force be with you
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Imok wanted me to change my name. (Mrhomeless)
Junior Member
Username: Mrhomeless

Post Number: 20
Registered: 12-2003
Posted on Friday, January 23, 2004 - 02:41 pm:Edit Post Quote Text Delete Post Print Post Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

headro: it depends on the decaf, some will have 50% but alot of them take it down to almost 10%, it depends on how long they treat it for. selling the extracted caffine to soda companies makes pretty good money.
go to google and type in "miserable failure", hit the "i'm feeling lucky" button and enjoy.
i love the google programmers.
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rodger rabbit (Skyypilot)
Senior Member
Username: Skyypilot

Post Number: 1562
Registered: 02-2003
Posted on Friday, January 23, 2004 - 03:56 pm:Edit Post Quote Text Delete Post Print Post Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

When I said dilute it 50%, it wasn't to cut down on caffeine. Everytime I went more than that, it contaminated before full colonization.
"I feel rowdy and I don't know why. . .Excuse me while I kiss the sky". . .jimi hendrix
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Peter Griffin (Factory651)
New member
Username: Factory651

Post Number: 1
Registered: 01-2004
Posted on Saturday, January 24, 2004 - 07:47 am:Edit Post Quote Text Delete Post Print Post Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

My question is concerning propagation on agar. I have a P.Mexicana syringe, but I want to germinate some of it on agar, and not just inoculate jars with it. The only thing I'm wondering is if in the agar propagation I should isolate a rhizomorphic/stringy section (as with regular mushroom formation), or if the tementose/cottony mycelium is important to the formation of sclerotia.
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Headro (Goodiekev)
Member
Username: Goodiekev

Post Number: 24
Registered: 01-2004
Posted on Saturday, January 24, 2004 - 10:43 am:Edit Post Quote Text Delete Post Print Post Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Imok: awesome, and all this time i was thinking that people who ask for decaf were crazy once they had two or threee cups. lol. i love learning.

every day i do.
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Imok Urok2 (Imok)
Moderator
Username: Imok

Post Number: 831
Registered: 07-2002
Posted on Saturday, January 24, 2004 - 09:05 pm:Edit Post Quote Text Delete Post Print Post Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Hedro, that wasn't me that posted, that was mrhomeless
Hope this helps :-)
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Hippie3 (Admin)
Board Administrator
Username: Admin

Post Number: 11582
Registered: 02-2001
Posted on Saturday, January 24, 2004 - 09:07 pm:Edit Post Quote Text Delete Post Print Post Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

The only thing I'm wondering is if in the agar propagation I should isolate a rhizomorphic/stringy section (as with regular mushroom formation), or if the tementose/cottony mycelium is important to the formation of sclerotia.
good question.
having never heard anything to the contrary,
i would tend to think one would still want
rhizo mycellia for several reasons.

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Imok Urok2 (Imok)
Moderator
Username: Imok

Post Number: 832
Registered: 07-2002
Posted on Saturday, January 24, 2004 - 09:08 pm:Edit Post Quote Text Delete Post Print Post Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

mrhomeless, it looks like you are going to have to find
a name that doesn't have a current members name in it.
Sorry, looks like there may be some confusion otherwise.
But thanks for being my child for a while
Hope this helps :-)
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Peter Griffin (Factory651)
New member
Username: Factory651

Post Number: 2
Registered: 01-2004
Posted on Saturday, January 24, 2004 - 10:55 pm:Edit Post Quote Text Delete Post Print Post Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)


good question.
having never heard anything to the contrary,
i would tend to think one would still want
rhizo mycellia for several reasons.


Ya, I posted that question on a few forums and it doesn't seem like anyone's looked into that. Maybe I'll inoculate some jars with just rhizomorphic and some with straight spores and post the results in a couple months.
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Hippie3 (Admin)
Board Administrator
Username: Admin

Post Number: 11606
Registered: 02-2001
Posted on Saturday, January 24, 2004 - 11:00 pm:Edit Post Quote Text Delete Post Print Post Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

that would no doubt prove interesting,
try to get some pix if you can.

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Peter Griffin (Factory651)
New member
Username: Factory651

Post Number: 3
Registered: 01-2004
Posted on Tuesday, January 27, 2004 - 08:23 pm:Edit Post Quote Text Delete Post Print Post Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Will do. That is, if my friggin syringe actually arrives in the mail.

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