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Poppies 2017


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#21 skunk

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Posted 24 February 2017 - 09:54 AM

Those look nice!
I'm thinking about growing a few too. Mostly because my mom likes to use them in bouquets, but also because I'm kind of interested in poppies.

What do people do with them?
I've read about teas from the seeds, and scratching the pods for raw opium. Is any of those things worth the hassle?
I'm curious about what would be the best way to start experimenting with it.

If one of you could provide me with some info, or where to look, that would be nice.

Good luck on the grow, have some of my karma!

Here are a couple of ideas from one of our members.

LAUDENIM
https://mycotopia.ne...Making-Laudenum

Water Extraction- look to the end of this thread. Anything from Shadow Wing is really informative. Starting at post #241 but do read over his whole thread.
https://mycotopia.ne...16#entry1284763

The only time I've tried using my harvest I just made a Pod tea. Worked really well and was quick and simple to prepare.

I've scored a few pods for informational purposes and didn't seem like a productive method for a small scale grower. I believe one would need a few hundred plants to make scoring worth while. If extracting the contents from the pods is your game then do read the above links provided written by Shadow Wing. Very informative

Be careful with opiates and alcohol as they can be a dangerous combination and do your own research on dosing. Below is a good link for information .
https://www.erowid.org/

As for sourcing poppy seed, World Seed Supply I've been very happy with them and have grown their seeds out. If you care to be a supporting member I'm sure one of our members would be able to help you out in the VIP Section with a seed request to get you started

SkUnK

Edited by skunkbudda403, 24 February 2017 - 09:56 AM.

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#22 skunk

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Posted 24 February 2017 - 10:15 AM

I find that when starting poppies, they really like the cold....I broadcast this seed with a thin layer of snow on the ground at the beginning of the month(Feb.). I'm also at 4,500 feet above sea level in the high desert.....

attachicon.gifIMG_20170222_080209966.jpg

attachicon.gifIMG_20170222_080148296.jpg

The seed I used was from these store bought pods.....

attachicon.gifIMG_20160727_134753_065.jpg

Looking lovely there Fungi2Bwith! Looks like your off to a great start this season. I have little experience growing them from seed outdoors so I'll be watching your grow closely. I plan to sow some seeds next Chinook we get so they can germinate under the snow.

My 1st indoor sowing has been a great success. Will do another 2 sowings in the following weeks so I have blooms for the whole season.

Here's what's come up the last day. Think I went a little heavy on the seeds in some pots lol.
40b315ca600766b68d4a12ec9394517e.jpg

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#23 Heirloom

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Posted 24 February 2017 - 02:06 PM

I was a bit out of sorts in my last few posts. I was concerned about getting the real deal.

I have ordered more seeds and will record germination rates and in the end the medical value.
The way I see it if the poppy latex from scoring is 10% morphine then .1 gram of dried raw opium should contain 10mg of morphine enough to determine if the variety that it came from is worth growing or not.

I emailed seed sellers but got no reply yet. I have came across reviews of people who asked if the poppies had med value and the reply they got was NO .

I just want us to know what seeds to avoid. I think poppy flowers are beautiful but I find the high morphine varieties to be way more beautiful.

I am frustrated from several poppy grow failures, 50 mph wind , heavy rains and so on.

Here is another thing a person can do with poppies depending on your needs and where you live.

I want poppy seeds from India, Thailand, Laos, Mexico the real deal from opium producing areas.

United States Patent 6,054,584

Process for Extracting and Purifying Morphine From Opium
https://erowid.org/a.../morphextr.html

Abstract

A process for extracting morphine from opium is described. In the process, opium is extracted with a basic alcoholic solution. The basic alcoholic solution is filtered and the alcohol removed from the filtrate to leave a residue. The residue is then extracted with a basic aqueous solution having a pH of at least 11. The basic aqueous solution may be filtered to remove any solid matter remaining after the aqueous extraction step, and then be stirred with a sufficient amount of a salt to avoid emulsion formation. The basic aqueous solution or filtrate is then extracted with benzene or toluene. Next, adjusting the pH of the basic aqueous filtrate to pH 8.5 to 9.5 allows The morphine to precipitate and be recovered.

Field of the Invention

This invention relates to an improved process for the 10 extraction and purification of morphine from opium. The object of this invention is to provide a more economical method of preparing morphine that utilizes less environmentally toxic solvents
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#24 Heirloom

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Posted 27 February 2017 - 07:14 PM

Some of the seeds I am trying, just got the china white today in a baggie, the Pepper box and Hungarian came in standard
seed packs.

The china white from chill Hawaiian. Germination soon to come.

I am waiting on my hens n chicks and an afghan.

These are from different vendors. Reports on them all. I am not spamming for the vendors
just the opposite if they are not up to standards I want to prevent you from wasting your money and time.
If they are good I'll say so and save seeds for future crops and share seeds.

I can say that the first 2 packs I got from Renee seeds are the Hungarian and PepperBox
They had a great germination rate.  I emaled them to find out if they were a low morphine type
called Norman or prezmko.  So far they have not responded. I did not say I was after high morphine content.

If I were a chemist high thebaine content would be desirable. A lot safer to grow. I am not a chemist so
I desire the old poppy medicine plants.

Attached Thumbnails

  • AAPoppy 001.JPG
  • AAPoppy 004.JPG


#25 fungi2bwith

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Posted 01 March 2017 - 12:26 AM

@heirloom, those pepperbox poppies are not somniferums are they? The picture on the package appears to be corn poppies....


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#26 scott_1971_h

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Posted 01 March 2017 - 01:10 AM

Heiroom, Tasmanians used to be ultra high morphine, and the strain is still grown. The high thebaine varieties came about when Oxycontin (fabulous as it is) became so successful/addictive, plus the general public would be less "botanically exuberant". So they did a high thebaine variety as well. Most people still have some of the MegaMorphine ones.

Jan, you can score, but its too fiddly. One could make tea and slowly reduce that down to something approaching genuine O. So much easier. There was one very pleasant winters sunday afternoon spent in the bath, Opium Suppository on board. It redefines the term "Lovely, relaxing bath".

One could dry the pods on plant, collect the seeds and run the dry pods through the coffee grinder to a fine dust. One teaspoon in the morning with a coffee or three. Lovely start to the day...


Edited by scott_1971_h, 01 March 2017 - 01:12 AM.

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#27 scott_1971_h

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Posted 01 March 2017 - 01:16 AM

@heirloom, those pepperbox poppies are not somniferums are they? The picture on the package appears to be corn poppies....

The pod looks like the corn poppy, but the flowers look like sonmis. Given the pollen appears white I'd say it's genuine. Oriental have blue pollen.



#28 fungi2bwith

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Posted 01 March 2017 - 08:53 AM

 

@heirloom, those pepperbox poppies are not somniferums are they? The picture on the package appears to be corn poppies....

The pod looks like the corn poppy, but the flowers look like sonmis. Given the pollen appears white I'd say it's genuine. Oriental have blue pollen.

 

 

 

You can tell all that from the picture on the seed packet?!!  That's fuckin' amazing....you need to use that talent and go make some money!!!!

 

This statement makes me laugh, "The pod looks like the corn poppy, but the flowers look like sonmis"   Ummmm.....LOL....most poppy flowers do look alike.....wow.....like, wow......

 

I was just going off the hairy ass stems and flower buds pictured on that packet.....I've yet to see a hairy somniferum

 

A corn poppy pictured below, or is it?.....It does have a flower that looks like a somniferum.....I can't make out what color the pollen is though from this picture soooo......um......derka

 

Corn-poppy_20.jpg


Edited by fungi2bwith, 01 March 2017 - 09:15 AM.

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#29 Heirloom

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Posted 01 March 2017 - 11:41 AM

@ Scott the pepperbox are supposed to be somniferum, sold as breadseed poppy . I think only somniferum are used for
edible seeds. The pic on the seed packet does show a lot of hairs.

I'm thinking of getting some of the Danish Flag and a few more, I got 5 types now. Thought about putting some out in
guerilla grows.

I feel like I need about 10 -15 grams of opium for a years supply of pain killer or the equivalent in dry pods.
I hate the risk of scoring pods but it would be a good way to get a small sample to test.

I will get a vacuum pump to evaporate pod tea much faster, Steampunk has a thread on DIY that shows making a vac chamber.
A vac chamber could be used for other things to like drying cactus extracts , drying mushrooms and so on. I can get a vac pump for about $50  at a tool shop nearby.
 


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#30 skunk

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Posted 01 March 2017 - 11:50 AM

@ Scott the pepperbox are supposed to be somniferum, sold as breadseed poppy . I think only somniferum are used for
edible seeds. The pic on the seed packet does show a lot of hairs.

I'm thinking of getting some of the Danish Flag and a few more, I got 5 types now. Thought about putting some out in
guerilla grows.

I feel like I need about 10 -15 grams of opium for a years supply of pain killer or the equivalent in dry pods.
I hate the risk of scoring pods but it would be a good way to get a small sample to test.

I will get a vacuum pump to evaporate pod tea much faster, Steampunk has a thread on DIY that shows making a vac chamber.
A vac chamber could be used for other things to like drying cactus extracts , drying mushrooms and so on. I can get a vac pump for about $50 at a tool shop nearby.

I too was under the assumption that Pepper Box was a P.Somniferum labeled drop World Seed Supply where inquired my seed from came labeled as such.

The Pepper Box I received from a World Seed Supply auction came labeled as Papaver Somniferum......
Here is a link to the site
https://www.worldsee...ox-poppy-seeds/

Doesn't talk about the Alkiloid concentrations of said poppies. Here are pictures of the grown out Pepper Box Variety.

I have noticed hair on all the P.Somniferum's I have grown over the years. Not a completely Hairy stock but a few hairs seems normal to myself. When I've grown them beside other kinds of poppies I've noticed them to be less hairy.
(Seed grown out from above link)
0bb115494a6b5445633a7d1a9b3e0e13.jpg
b39bf04ff04886ad33c352861619eff1.jpg


@ Heirloom Spores
-Shoot me a PM if your looking for seeds shoot me a private message.


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#31 fungi2bwith

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Posted 01 March 2017 - 01:40 PM

I just thought that the pic on that packet looked alot like something other than somniferum....Most packets also include the latin name, but I didn't see it on that packet in the pic.....So ultimately, I was curious as to if they were somniferums....The pic on the packet is obviously a crude water color rendering of what the flowers are supposed to look like.....so, with there being that many hairs, and the way the pods looked in the shitty water color, I thought that perhaps they were something else.   I have seen a few and far between hairs on somniferum stems, but never the flower bud, and not as prolific as what is pictured in that painting.....


Edited by fungi2bwith, 01 March 2017 - 01:41 PM.

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#32 Heirloom

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Posted 01 March 2017 - 04:36 PM

The pic I saw when I bought them was not showing so much haits if any. I had no idea that they would come in seed packs like other seeds do. I read a revue on a different variety that said his seed did not look like what was pictured.

We all know that retailers can be honest and there are ones who would say anything to make a sale.

I got my Hens n chick poppy seeds today., going to get a few large pots to start a few in to se the germination rates.

I am going to grow some indoors und metal halides, some in pots outside and in some of my old cannabis grow  spots outside.

I am more determined that every to get a good harvest this year.

Thanks for the suggestions and opinions , I know they will help me.


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#33 Heirloom

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Posted 01 March 2017 - 06:13 PM

I though this PDF might be of some interest to a few people. here are a few
things that can be found in the PDF.

There was mention of an opium honey material collected by honeybees that might be useful. That's in the PDF.


Opium Poppy: Genetic Upgradation Through
Intervention of Plant Breeding Techniques

"Losak and Richter [80] studied the effect
of nitrogen supplementation to cultivar ‘Opal’ of opium poppy plant in a pot experiment.
They applied ammonium nitrate in single dose at two stages of plant growth i.e. at the
beginning of growing season and at the stage of flowering. They observed that the increasing
dose of nitrogen increased number of capsules per plant, morphine content

Additionally they also noticed that there is no important correlation
between morphological traits and alkaloid content.

They further concluded that constant water supply is beneficial
for the accumulation of alkaloids in poppy capsules.

A mutant variety known as ‘TOP 1’ (‘thebaine oripavine poppy 1’) in opium poppy (Papaver
somniferum) was developed by Tasmania Company. In this mutant the morphinan pathway
is blocked at thebaine results in absence of codeine and morphine. The major loss of this
blockage is on the end product i.e. morphine which is absent in this mutant [84]. This mutant
was developed by a mutagen treatment to seeds of commercial poppy cultivar (P. somniferum.

They observed lower values of morphine in
husk of white coloured seeds while high morphine in blue to grey seeds.

Attached Files


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#34 scott_1971_h

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Posted 01 March 2017 - 06:47 PM

 

 

@heirloom, those pepperbox poppies are not somniferums are they? The picture on the package appears to be corn poppies....

The pod looks like the corn poppy, but the flowers look like sonmis. Given the pollen appears white I'd say it's genuine. Oriental have blue pollen.

 

 

 

You can tell all that from the picture on the seed packet?!!  That's fuckin' amazing....you need to use that talent and go make some money!!!!

 

This statement makes me laugh, "The pod looks like the corn poppy, but the flowers look like sonmis"   Ummmm.....LOL....most poppy flowers do look alike.....wow.....like, wow......

 

I was just going off the hairy ass stems and flower buds pictured on that packet.....I've yet to see a hairy somniferum

 

A corn poppy pictured below, or is it?.....It does have a flower that looks like a somniferum.....I can't make out what color the pollen is though from this picture soooo......um......derka

 

Corn-poppy_20.jpg

 

Yes that looks like a corn/field poppy. the petals form like a dinner plate but somnis there is a definite, almost 90 degree bend so they form a definite cup shape. The seed pods have a flat top where somnis are drawn in before terminating in the stigma (which turns upward as the pod ripens)


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#35 Heirloom

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Posted 02 March 2017 - 07:53 PM

I got an email that assured me that the Hungarian are not of the Przemko or Norman low morphine varieties, they failed to comment on the pepper box though.
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#36 scott_1971_h

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Posted 02 March 2017 - 11:28 PM

I got an email that assured me that the Hungarian are not of the Przemko or Norman low morphine varieties, they failed to comment on the pepper box though.

Good. Dont want you going 'Claytons' on us.



#37 Heirloom

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Posted 03 March 2017 - 01:05 AM



Poppy Pepperbox (Papaver Somniferum Pepperbox) - Bring some romance and charm to your garden and grow Pepperbox Poppy seeds. The image below from Seasonal Wisdom shows the beauty of this heirloom poppy. This variety blooms in shade of pinks, purples, and lilacs, and some of the petals are fringed and others smooth to provide a beautiful display. Once the flowers are spent, these Poppies are known for their nutty flavored seeds that can be left to ripen and used in baking. Leave the pods to ripen and collect them at the end of the season for kitchen use. Growing Poppies from seed is so rewarding. Create a beautiful display with these flower seeds!

I got many descriptions of pepper box , my pack says purple ,red and pink, with darker splotches at the base of the flower


I have been looking into getting seeds from india and other countries through other seeds avenues.

peace

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  • pepperbox2.jpg

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#38 Heirloom

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Posted 03 March 2017 - 01:21 AM

"scott_1971_h


Posted Yesterday, 10:28 PM


Heirloom Spores, on 02 Mar 2017 - 6:53 PM, said:



"I got an email that assured me that the Hungarian are not of the Przemko or Norman low morphine varieties, they failed to comment on the pepper box though.

Good. Dont want you going 'Claytons' on us."


Claytons? Is that a vendor/

If you meant claymores , I don't have much use for them .

I am feeling better about the seeds I got and got more on the way from vendors and experienced growers here..

I feel like the Universe loves me and the source of all life wants me to be happy

#39 scott_1971_h

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Posted 03 March 2017 - 08:27 AM

@ Scott the pepperbox are supposed to be somniferum, sold as breadseed poppy . I think only somniferum are used for
edible seeds. The pic on the seed packet does show a lot of hairs.

I'm thinking of getting some of the Danish Flag and a few more, I got 5 types now. Thought about putting some out in
guerilla grows.

I feel like I need about 10 -15 grams of opium for a years supply of pain killer or the equivalent in dry pods.
I hate the risk of scoring pods but it would be a good way to get a small sample to test.

I will get a vacuum pump to evaporate pod tea much faster, Steampunk has a thread on DIY that shows making a vac chamber.
A vac chamber could be used for other things to like drying cactus extracts , drying mushrooms and so on. I can get a vac pump for about $50  at a tool shop nearby.
 

Yes Somnis are the only ones with edible seeds. I have seen the odd hairy somniferum, they're not common but not all that rare IYKWIM.

I always feel like I need every bit of 'material' I can lay my paws on, and always run out. And yes, vac. pumps are great for drying stuff off at a nice low temperature. Wasn't there something in the Kratom thread about oxidation?

Scoring pods would leave the very-difficult-to-explain-away scars. Do you know how to make green tea?


Edited by scott_1971_h, 03 March 2017 - 08:28 AM.


#40 scott_1971_h

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Posted 04 March 2017 - 06:43 AM

@ Scott the pepperbox are supposed to be somniferum, sold as breadseed poppy . I think only somniferum are used for
edible seeds. The pic on the seed packet does show a lot of hairs.
...
I will get a vacuum pump to evaporate pod tea much faster, Steampunk has a thread on DIY that shows making a vac chamber.
A vac chamber could be used for other things to like drying cactus extracts , drying mushrooms and so on. I can get a vac pump for about $50  at a tool shop nearby.
 

Where is Steampunks vacuum thread? I've tried searching and only got more and more confused :-((






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