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Critiques invited on this storage tek idea

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#1 shoomer

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Posted 13 March 2017 - 11:55 PM

As I've said before, I lost my 2+ zips of my 1st grow from 3 yrs ago to bad storage practices that I do not want to repeat so I have been doing some research and planning this method to preserve the form as well as actives.

 

Oven drying - I don't have a dehydrator but I do have an elec oven that I can dial down to 140 (checked w/ turkey probe) for initial dry in 3-4 hrs. Caps are cracker but stems still pliable.

​MGSO4 desiccant - I've seen Damprid and Dryrite, but I'll trust MGSO4 over either of those as on the off chance some does infest the product, laxatives may be inconvenient but are never toxic

​dry ice - While I haven't researched this in depth for interaction, i do know of the non-reactive nature of CO2 and it's natural way to purge oxygen by being heavier and forcing all other gas out of a vertical container with the lid off.

 

​vacuum sealer - the salvation army had a foodsaver w/ lid attachment and 2 boxes of bags for $15 so it will be my huckleberry

​The plan is oven dry, desiccant finish, dry ice in a jar/bag (I still need to research how much solid CO2 phases into how much gas), add boomers, wait for DI to "melt", vac seal w/ food saver (no oxy absorber), and stick in the freezer.

​Any tweaks/caveats that members would like to alert me to about this "deep storage" tek idea?

​I'm at the desiccant step ATM.



#2 Spliff

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Posted 14 March 2017 - 08:51 AM

Three years in storage! Good lord, I don't even know how that effects the quality of the contents, but I assume the worst.

 

Have you looked into soaking in honey? Just get a jar and dump some in. Not so sure about 2+ zips worth...

 

Three years!?!



#3 riseabovethought

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Posted 14 March 2017 - 10:22 AM

Yeah.  Im trying an experimental theory out right now comparing freshy -honey to dried, ground, and mixed -honey.  Im unsure as to which is better, for I hope to find what works better for me.  Some people then freeze it, or at least refrigerate it.  The freshy honey takes longer to settle out and pour off the water, but I only freeze the dried, ground, and mixed honey and keep the freshy honey at room temp, still not sure if that was a good idea :unsure: but Im on a honey -kick ATM.  Im curious about pickling and hemp oil has been suggested as well for it potential...making coconut oil, fish oil, and flax seed oil IMHO, other potential allies.  I'd really like to see which might be the holy grail of storage, but I feel like the jury is still out since we all just eat em up too quick to find out. :ph34r:


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#4 Alder Logs

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Posted 14 March 2017 - 11:33 AM

How about any of these in a properly aligned scale model of the Great Pyramid?   I told the story somewhere around here about the peyote buttons that stayed alive for years, though turning snow white, sitting on a wood attic shelf, in an 18 inch tall, corrugated cardboard pyramid. 


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#5 shoomer

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Posted 14 March 2017 - 12:24 PM

Three years in storage! Good lord, I don't even know how that effects the quality of the contents, but I assume the worst.

 

Have you looked into soaking in honey? Just get a jar and dump some in. Not so sure about 2+ zips worth...

 

Three years!?!

Maybe closer to 2.5 yr., but long enough.

 

I like doing bulk (at least for boomers) only once in a while as it's almost all personal stash.

 

Some I like to give away infrequently to the less adept with the story, "This guy I know visited me....." when someone is in dire need of re-alignment. That's why I want to preserve form as much as possible.

New forms and the usage tutorials thereof pretty much jump up and down while screaming that you have more than a casual acquaintance of the art; and CYA keeps the bars away. ;)

 

Honey is in my future as I see this run eclipsing the last 2 zip one and that will allow me to experiment a bit as I love the color of blue honey and mead making has me well acquainted w/ the anit-microbal nature and oxy deprivation angle leaving light degradation being the only question I still have about it.

 

Right now the easiest way I see along my proposed path it to put a chip of dry ice in a jar, put dried boomers in a mylar sack an inch or 2 shorter than the lid lip w/ folded top (from coffee, potato chips, etc.) in the jar, wait for the DI to "melt", and then use the food saver to vac out the CO2 from the jar to cut the oxy exposure. I know Nitrogen has been suggested in other threads, but I like the weight/purge effect of CO2 and it is used often in the food industry for the same reasons.

 

Thank you both for your time and suggestions though!

They are much appreciated.

 

 

How about any of these in a properly aligned scale model of the Great Pyramid?   I told the story somewhere around here about the peyote buttons that stayed alive for years, though turning snow white, sitting on a wood attic shelf, in an 18 inch tall, corrugated cardboard pyramid. 

....the grains of wheat sprouted, the stargate was found, and the pyramid was discovered to be the universal sign for the porta-potty. :P

 

Much as I think there might be something to pyramid power, the jury is still out. :wink:

 

In all seriousness though, is this your kind way to tell me my aspirations are unreasonable?


Edited by shoomer, 14 March 2017 - 12:30 PM.


#6 Spliff

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Posted 14 March 2017 - 06:05 PM

It just seems a lot of really technical and over the top steps to be taking. At least to me. But hey I have never needed to store so much for so long.

 

I assume you will be doing this for individual portion sizes, otherwise you will need to repeat everything each time you dip into the store.

 

What about extracting psilly into crystals?


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#7 Alder Logs

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Posted 14 March 2017 - 07:31 PM

 

In all seriousness though, is this your kind way to tell me my aspirations are unreasonable?

 

No, just thought that anything to preserve by any means other than in a freezer, one might consider pyramid power.   What I witnesses was a mind-blower.  The peyote buttons lived well on no light and no roots, turned snow white and thrived.  I wish I could remember how many years they were up there.  There was a lot of dust on that cardboard pyramid.


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#8 shoomer

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Posted 14 March 2017 - 08:49 PM

It just seems a lot of really technical and over the top steps to be taking. At least to me. But hey I have never needed to store so much for so long.

 

I assume you will be doing this for individual portion sizes, otherwise you will need to repeat everything each time you dip into the store.

 

What about extracting psilly into crystals?

 

I thought the initial crisp and desiccant part were pretty standard.

I'm just throwing neutral atmosphere and jar vacuuming into the mix and the result will go into the freezer w/o having to worry about freezer burn from oxy.

 

I looked at the extraction process a bit but I seem to remember a vacuum pump being used for low temp evaporation so I'm not sure it would be less involved.

I'll do a search to make sure I'm recalling correctly.

 

 

 

In all seriousness though, is this your kind way to tell me my aspirations are unreasonable?

 

No, just thought that anything to preserve by any means other than in a freezer, one might consider pyramid power.   What I witnesses was a mind-blower.  The peyote buttons lived well on no light and no roots, turned snow white and thrived.  I wish I could remember how many years they were up there.  There was a lot of dust on that cardboard pyramid.

 

I'm not trying to get around the freezer part, just adding a few things to it for longevity.

Sounds like it'd make a good home experiment if there was a way to quantify the potency loss outside of perceived results from use.

Are there any potency tests that would be available to the layman?

 

On a side note, I think pyramids have many more uses than we assume.

In fact, the ones (and attendant structures) of Gobleki Tepi in Turkey kicked the academically "correct" age of "civilized humans" right out the door as carbon dating of the structures point to them being erected during the wane of the last ice age.

 

I'm also wondering if there really is one in Antarctica as Goggle Earth shows and why John Kerry took a visit to there right after Obama's last presidency win.

 

Every day teaches me how much I don't know. :wink:



#9 Alder Logs

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Posted 14 March 2017 - 09:40 PM

Before you accept that Gobleki Tepe was purposefully buried, or precisely when, read Worlds In Collision, by Velikovsky, remembering that it was not yet discovered when Velikovsky was alive.   I would also set aside accepted ice age theory until considering the evidence of an axis shift, considering further what was happening in the northern latitudes in Siberia and Western Alaska as the ice receded from Western Europe and Eastern North America.


Edited by Alder Logs, 14 March 2017 - 09:45 PM.


#10 shoomer

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Posted 15 March 2017 - 12:56 AM

Before you accept that Gobleki Tepe was purposefully buried, or precisely when, read Worlds In Collision, by Velikovsky, remembering that it was not yet discovered when Velikovsky was alive.   I would also set aside accepted ice age theory until considering the evidence of an axis shift, considering further what was happening in the northern latitudes in Siberia and Western Alaska as the ice receded from Western Europe and Eastern North America.

I'm hip to the theories of a pole shift decreasing the eastern ice shelf and accumulating on the west although I haven't research relevant sources. From what I gleaned of the chapter listing of WIC it seems the author and I might share some theories in common since I don't think the present go around of civilization has been the only one.

 

Back to the storage issue.

I find MGSO4 to be a bang up desiccant and after 12 hr. have finally gotten absolute cracker crispiness, so now it's on to sourcing dry ice. Once that's done I think I'm set for the experiment.

 

Did you know of a potency test outside of dosing?

 

 

It just seems a lot of really technical and over the top steps to be taking. At least to me. But hey I have never needed to store so much for so long.

 

I assume you will be doing this for individual portion sizes, otherwise you will need to repeat everything each time you dip into the store.

 

What about extracting psilly into crystals?

 

You got me thinking w/ the individual packets. That would be a good tweak but it also looks suspiciously like a franchise procedure.

For later reseal recharges I figured I'd cheat w/ some aquarium hose Gooped to a tight fitting jar/lid and just use vinegar and baking soda for CO2 replacement before vac'ing most of it out.

 

EDIT: BTW......present first flush @ about 35% represented is 9g+ dry so i don't see how ending up w/ 2 zips is that hard.

 

Boomers ARE NOT the only thing I'm contemplating for long term storage and this seems (except for the freezing) a way to extend the life of many foodstuffs. :wink:


Edited by shoomer, 15 March 2017 - 12:59 AM.

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#11 sparrow95

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Posted 25 March 2017 - 11:05 AM

I tried desiccant and found it didn't do much.
I fan dried for 2 days to get out most of the water.
One day in the fridge on a plate finished drying to cracker consistency.
Put them in a Mason jar and filled it with C02.
Made a C02 generator by drilling a hole in the top of a milk jug and putting a plastic tube in it.
Vinegar and baking soda makes C02. Put the top on and the gas comes out the tube into the Mason jar. It's heavier than air so it stays there.
Should last well I think.
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#12 CatsAndBats

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Posted 25 March 2017 - 11:29 AM

Or alcohol:

 

https://mycotopia.ne...thanol-extract/

 

One can also lock up the goodies in chocolate to stem oxidation. Still requires cracker dry material, as any moisture will seize up the melting chocolate (and it'll probably ferment).

 

The traditional and probably most used method is drying and then vacuum packing material, it'll last indefinitely unless it's exposed to UV light.

 

IMHO.


Edited by catattack, 25 March 2017 - 11:33 AM.

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#13 shoomer

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Posted 25 March 2017 - 12:27 PM

I tried desiccant and found it didn't do much.
I fan dried for 2 days to get out most of the water.
One day in the fridge on a plate finished drying to cracker consistency.
Put them in a Mason jar and filled it with C02.
Made a C02 generator by drilling a hole in the top of a milk jug and putting a plastic tube in it.
Vinegar and baking soda makes C02. Put the top on and the gas comes out the tube into the Mason jar. It's heavier than air so it stays there.
Should last well I think.

 

​Aces!

Sounds very similar to my proposed tek except for the absence of vacpac/ freezing. The reason  I was thinking of adding neutral atmosphere (co2, N) and then sucking most of it out is just to replace all atmospheric (to the container) oxygen and cut out the oxidation concern completely.

Then it's just heat and light to worry about.

 

Please keep us "up to date" on your foray into this tek type as I think we can keep boomers (and other things) for years w/o significant degradation w/ oxy deprivation, neutral atmosphere, and freezing temps.

​EDIT:     YTD is 40+g dry so far and 1st flushes from some cakes are just coming in.


Edited by shoomer, 25 March 2017 - 03:29 PM.

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#14 shoomer

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Posted 30 March 2017 - 01:50 AM

I've graduated to using masons w/ the tube and canister vinegar/baking soda combo since I'm not having an easy time sourcing dry ice and the harvest is.....abundant.

​The seal-a-meal also contributed as it's bag seal is too lossy and I had to hack it to get the jar attachment to work, though it does work well for that now.

I only have the wide mouth attachment so that means pints or quarts, and I'd like the versatility of using standard mouth sizes (and smaller jars too) so I'll have to get the regular mouth attachment.

​Once that's accomplished I hope to use 1/4 pt. jars w/ a standard serving and compare every 3 mo. for efficacy of the tek.



#15 scott_1971_h

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Posted 19 April 2017 - 12:11 AM

As I've said before, I lost my 2+ zips of my 1st grow from 3 yrs ago to bad storage practices that I do not want to repeat so I have been doing some research and planning this method to preserve the form as well as actives.

 

Oven drying - I don't have a dehydrator but I do have an elec oven that I can dial down to 140 (checked w/ turkey probe) for initial dry in 3-4 hrs. Caps are cracker but stems still pliable.

​MGSO4 desiccant - I've seen Damprid and Dryrite, but I'll trust MGSO4 over either of those as on the off chance some does infest the product, laxatives may be inconvenient but are never toxic

​I'm at the desiccant step ATM.

Have you thought of NaOH as a dessicant in case you cant get MgSO4? Or CaCl


Edited by scott_1971_h, 19 April 2017 - 12:12 AM.

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#16 shoomer

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Posted Yesterday, 10:42 PM

I have no issues scoring a 2-3 lbs. bag of MgSO4 (Epsom salts) from the drugstore as I use it for other growing pursuits so it's easily @ hand and I dry in the oven when I bake a pizza (400+ F) to make the anhydrous desiccant.

​I might try others but I like the fact that should the desiccant  taint the product (infinitesimally small) there are no adverse reactions due to that.



#17 scott_1971_h

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Posted Yesterday, 10:46 PM

I think Gypsum would be similar.



#18 jkdeth

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Posted Yesterday, 11:00 PM

Just a thought that crossed my mind, has anyone considered the oxygen absorbers used for long term grain storage? Might not be feasible for small jars.

#19 CatsAndBats

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Posted Today, 09:47 AM

https://www.uline.co...ets-Gram-Size-2

post-147940-0-49551000-1492958789.png

 

@jkdeath Maybe these?

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Edited by CatsAndBats, Today, 09:47 AM.






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