Paradox
©
Fisana

Jump to content


Photo
* * * * * 1 votes

First grow log: Exploring a new hobby


  • Please log in to reply
130 replies to this topic

#41 MrModeon

MrModeon

    Mycophiliac

  • Free Member
  • 62 posts

Posted 07 April 2017 - 03:55 PM

Thanks for the encouraging words everyone!

 

Did make one change though, my temperature sensor in the incubator was mounted at the top (because heat rises) and set at 26.6C (80F) but I realized that the bottom was actually a lot hotter, around 30C (86F). I moved the temp sensor to the bottom so the bottom is now at 26.6C and the top is a little colder. Seemed not to have done any damage though, as a lot of jars showed growth on the bottom. 


  • Arathu likes this

#42 Arathu

Arathu

    Dirtmaker

  • OG VIP
  • 5,223 posts

Awards Bar:

Posted 07 April 2017 - 04:22 PM

Heat, especially uneven, has definitely caused me troubles. Good catch and attention to detail............

 

Personally I like things a bit on the cooler side for my work......the mid 60's F but there is range that works well.....

 

As was predicted for me when I began, I make the same prediction for you....a sea of fungi are in your future.... :meditate:

 

More great vibes coming atcha........

 

A


Edited by Arathu, 07 April 2017 - 04:23 PM.


#43 Cuboid

Cuboid

    Mycophage

  • Free Member
  • 126 posts

Posted 07 April 2017 - 04:26 PM

What species is it? I thought I'd read 30 degrees C was optimum for Ps.Cubensis?

#44 Arathu

Arathu

    Dirtmaker

  • OG VIP
  • 5,223 posts

Awards Bar:

Posted 07 April 2017 - 04:39 PM

What species is it? I thought I'd read 30 degrees C was optimum for Ps.Cubensis?

Any time I crossed into the 80's F  the green beast was the winner.......this is not to say that others don't have different experiences.

 

I found the mid the to upper 60's F to work very well......again I'm just expressing experiences not anything "optimum"

 

The fungi themselves have the final word and I've learned to listen to them......... :cool:

 



#45 MrModeon

MrModeon

    Mycophiliac

  • Free Member
  • 62 posts

Posted 07 April 2017 - 05:17 PM

Heat, especially uneven, has definitely caused me troubles. Good catch and attention to detail............

Personally I like things a bit on the cooler side for my work......the mid 60's F but there is range that works well.....

As was predicted for me when I began, I make the same prediction for you....a sea of fungi are in your future.... :meditate:

More great vibes coming atcha........

A

Yeah, I'm already planning a better setup for my incubator with more circulation to allow for a more even temperature over the height of the jars. Can't justify spending the cash on that right now though, so many other neat stuff I need to buy  :sleep: Next on the list is a SAB, agar, petri dishes etc. Want to try to isolate a good producer  :cool: 

 

Thanks for the vibes! Sending some right back at ya.

 

What species is it? I thought I'd read 30 degrees C was optimum for Ps.Cubensis?

It's Cubensis but as Arathu mentioned, 30C allows contaminants to grow a lot easier as well. But I'm also taking account that there might be 'hot spots' and the myc itself generates some heat. So if I'm measuring 30, there might be spots where it's 32. I'd rather be on the safe side and have my highest measurement around 26.6C.

 

There's another temperature controller in the mail and when that arrives, I might try to do some jars at 29-30 to see how it goes. If they don't contaminate, I might move the whole production to that range. It's my first batch so I'm trying not to experiment too much yet. 


Edited by MrModeon, 07 April 2017 - 05:19 PM.


#46 fahtster

fahtster

    Mycotopiate

  • OG VIP
  • 1,670 posts

Awards Bar:

Posted 07 April 2017 - 05:28 PM

Nice first post.. I'm just here for the pron. :)

Faht
  • CatsAndBats and tailsmcsnails like this

#47 CatsAndBats

CatsAndBats

    [^._.^]ノ彡 & /|\( ;,;)/|\

  • OG VIP
  • 8,954 posts

Awards Bar:

Posted 07 April 2017 - 06:21 PM

FWIW, I've successfully grown cubes under 60f several times now. It takes patience.

#48 Arathu

Arathu

    Dirtmaker

  • OG VIP
  • 5,223 posts

Awards Bar:

Posted 07 April 2017 - 06:36 PM

FWIW, I've successfully grown cubes under 60f several times now. It takes patience.

Absolutely.........slow but definitely works......a word of caution in that regard...PE did not do well, repeatedly........I failed miserably...... :blush:

 

A


  • CatsAndBats likes this

#49 MrModeon

MrModeon

    Mycophiliac

  • Free Member
  • 62 posts

Posted 08 April 2017 - 09:55 AM

Okay guys, I just got some stuff delivered so I did a test run. Hopefully this will help me not mess up the big batch. The WBS that I’m using took quite a long time to colonize so I’m not expecting big results, just some lessons.

What I used:

• 1.6qt plastic filter box I had left over from a growkit
• 2 250ml (1/2pint) jars of WBS that are left over from my initial spore innoculation
• Coco brick 82g
• Vermiculite 250ml (1/2pint)
• Gypsum 1 teaspoon
• Water 640ml

I wanted to use a recipe with coffee grounds but I don’t have those here and I’m too lazy to go to the store. I mixed the coco, vermiculite and gypsum and added boiling water until at field capacity. I then placed the bucket with the mix in another bucket with hot water from the tap. That should be around 60-70C so I figured I could use it as a ‘semi-pasteurization’ (couldn’t hurt right). Proper pasteurization was just too much work for such a small quantity. I then let that cool over about an hour until it was room temp. I shook the WBS jars ferociously and gave them a quick smell test. Nothing weird about the smell so on we go. I cleaned the box with alcohol, lined it with a piece of garbage bag, cleaned that with alcohol as well and waited for it to dry. I then mixed everything in there (which was fun). A slight press to make the surface even and then I put the lid on. The box is now in my laundry closet (which is around 21-25C depending on how much stuff is on).

 

Let me know if there’s something I could be doing better!

 

Picture time:

The finished box

photo_2017-04-08_16-49-48.jpg

Day 5 growth update

photo_2017-04-08_16-49-52.jpg

And for the mushroom porn enthusiast, a nice close up of rhizomorphic growth

photo_2017-04-08_16-49-55.jpg


  • fahtster and Arathu like this

#50 Arathu

Arathu

    Dirtmaker

  • OG VIP
  • 5,223 posts

Awards Bar:

Posted 08 April 2017 - 04:48 PM

:cool:

 

We need the "popcorn" emoticon back........

 

I'm watching...and those jars of seed look GREAT!

 

A


  • MrModeon likes this

#51 fahtster

fahtster

    Mycotopiate

  • OG VIP
  • 1,670 posts

Awards Bar:

Posted 08 April 2017 - 09:57 PM

:cool:

 

We need the "popcorn" emoticon back........

 

I'm watching...and those jars of seed look GREAT!

 

A


I agree.. :popcorn:

Faht

#52 MrModeon

MrModeon

    Mycophiliac

  • Free Member
  • 62 posts

Posted 09 April 2017 - 07:52 AM

Small update today: 

 

The jars looked like they were ready for some action so I've given them all a shake. Quite a workout, anyone tried using a paint shaker for that? Don't want to have to do this often  :dry: Hopefully they'll recover nicely. 

 

In other news: I bought a tent / greenhouse and ordered some kitty litter boxes. Figured I might as well, else I'll have to chuck a lot of WBS because I don't have enough propagators. It's all coming together now. 

photo_2017-04-09_11-33-59.jpg


Edited by MrModeon, 09 April 2017 - 07:53 AM.


#53 Arathu

Arathu

    Dirtmaker

  • OG VIP
  • 5,223 posts

Awards Bar:

Posted 09 April 2017 - 07:36 PM

Me too.......a smaller one and the larger one................... SCHWEET!

 

A



#54 MrModeon

MrModeon

    Mycophiliac

  • Free Member
  • 62 posts

Posted 10 April 2017 - 03:59 PM

Jar update:

photo_2017-04-10_22-48-01.jpg

They seem to be recovering nicely. Really excited to see how fast they'll colonize the whole jar  :wub: 

The 'cake' I made is also showing white spots all over. Sorry for the bad photo quality, it's hard to get a good one through the lid.

photo_2017-04-09_21-45-46.jpg

 

I was lying in bed yesterday thinking about the bags I'm going to be sterilizing (shrooms seem to be the only thing on my mind as of late  :meditate: ). I planned to use the tyvek sleeve tek, basically tyvek in the top of the bag folded like an accordeon. An idea popped into my head though:

 

Would it be possible to take an air-port syringe (with some polyfill in there), stick it through the microfilter, tape it with some gentle tape and pressure cook with it in there? The syringe would allow clean air exchange during the sterilization and afterwards I would just remove it. That should give me perfect sterilization and no chance of contaminating it while trying to close the bag. Any thoughts? I'll give it a whirl when my finals are done but I would like to hear what you guys think  :happy: I tried it out with a regular plastic bag and it let through enough air that I couldn't pop the bag so that's one part?

 

Edit: I did search for it online btw, but I couldn't find anyone having tried it. 


Edited by MrModeon, 10 April 2017 - 04:09 PM.


#55 CatsAndBats

CatsAndBats

    [^._.^]ノ彡 & /|\( ;,;)/|\

  • OG VIP
  • 8,954 posts

Awards Bar:

Posted 10 April 2017 - 04:17 PM

 

:cool:

 

We need the "popcorn" emoticon back........

 

I'm watching...and those jars of seed look GREAT!

 

A

 

 

 

 

 

:cool:

 

We need the "popcorn" emoticon back........

 

I'm watching...and those jars of seed look GREAT!

 

A


I agree.. :popcorn:

Faht

 

 

 

michael-jackson-popcorn-eating-im-just-h



#56 CatsAndBats

CatsAndBats

    [^._.^]ノ彡 & /|\( ;,;)/|\

  • OG VIP
  • 8,954 posts

Awards Bar:

Posted 10 April 2017 - 04:27 PM


 That should be around 60-70C so I figured I could use it as a ‘semi-pasteurization’ (couldn’t hurt right). Proper pasteurization was just too much work for such a small quantity.

 

If one would like to get 'proper' flushes/results, one should do all steps properly IMHO.

 

Pasteurization happens at those temps if they are held at that temperature (measured from the center of the sub) for a minimum of 2hrs, but ideally much longer IMHO. It takes two hours at those temps to kill off the competitors, if one goes longer it further protects the substrate from contamination from future microbial competition.


Edited by CatsAndBats, 10 April 2017 - 04:28 PM.


#57 tailsmcsnails

tailsmcsnails

    "DOOR"

  • Gold VIP
  • 526 posts

Donator


Awards Bar:

Posted 10 April 2017 - 04:57 PM

t takes two hours at those temps to kill off the competitors, if one goes longer it further protects the substrate from contamination from future microbial competition.

 

why why why??? Is it because it also kills spores that haven't hatched yet?



#58 CatsAndBats

CatsAndBats

    [^._.^]ノ彡 & /|\( ;,;)/|\

  • OG VIP
  • 8,954 posts

Awards Bar:

Posted 10 April 2017 - 05:24 PM

 

t takes two hours at those temps to kill off the competitors, if one goes longer it further protects the substrate from contamination from future microbial competition.

 

why why why??? Is it because it also kills spores that haven't hatched yet?

 

 

 

Longer pasteurization times allow for thermophillic bacteria to continue to reproduce and occupy more of the substrate with their extremely hardy endospores which helps protect the substrate from competitor spores.

 

You can read all about it here:

https://mycotopia.ne...-poo/?p=1227470

 

and I think I cover it here:

https://mycotopia.ne...-cubensis-bulk/


  • Ferather and tailsmcsnails like this

#59 MrModeon

MrModeon

    Mycophiliac

  • Free Member
  • 62 posts

Posted 10 April 2017 - 06:16 PM

 

That should be around 60-70C so I figured I could use it as a ‘semi-pasteurization’ (couldn’t hurt right). Proper pasteurization was just too much work for such a small quantity.

 
If one would like to get 'proper' flushes/results, one should do all steps properly IMHO.
 
Pasteurization happens at those temps if they are held at that temperature (measured from the center of the sub) for a minimum of 2hrs, but ideally much longer IMHO. It takes two hours at those temps to kill off the competitors, if one goes longer it further protects the substrate from contamination from future microbial competition.

 


I agree with following the steps but as I indicated, this was just a test to get my motions right. Even so, I was roughly following this tek which mentions:

At this point your coir can be used as a sub. The hot water, and steam has probably killed off anything malicious living in there. But this is not guaranteed. So here is your choice. You can either use the coir straight from the bucket, and spawn to your sub, or you can load it up in an oven bag and pressure cook it to make sure that it is sterile. I recommend PCing it, just for optimal success rates.

On a more personal note: I believe in trying your own stuff, seeing what does and doesn't work so you feel confident that you're not doing unnecessary work. Should this box fail miserably, then I'll feel a lot better about the time I have to spend on my pasteurization.  :sleep: 
 

Longer pasteurization times allow for thermophillic bacteria to continue to reproduce and occupy more of the substrate with their extremely hardy endospores which helps protect the substrate from competitor spores.
 
You can read all about it here:
https://mycotopia.ne...-poo/?p=1227470
 
and I think I cover it here:
https://mycotopia.ne...-cubensis-bulk/

The links you mentioned are about poo right? I don't see coco coir mentioned anywhere. I believe I've read in multiple places that pasteurization is not really necessary for coco coir. Also that those bacteria are not present on coco coir (but I'm not very sure about that). Please correct me if I'm wrong though, I'm here to learn!  :tinfoil: 

 

Edit: Searching also led me to this:

posts.PNG

 

2nd Edit: I think this thread made me doubt the presence of the bacteria. Not real conclusive though.


Edited by MrModeon, 10 April 2017 - 06:27 PM.


#60 CatsAndBats

CatsAndBats

    [^._.^]ノ彡 & /|\( ;,;)/|\

  • OG VIP
  • 8,954 posts

Awards Bar:

Posted 10 April 2017 - 07:31 PM

 The hot water, and steam has probably killed off anything malicious living in there.

That's a red flag right there. :biggrin:

 

 

 

On a more personal note: I believe in trying your own stuff, seeing what does and doesn't work so you feel confident that you're not doing unnecessary work. Should this box fail miserably, then I'll feel a lot better about the time I have to spend on my pasteurization.  :sleep:

 

 

Of course one should try things and experiment, however it's not like you're the first member that has tried to skip "unnecessary work" or to try to pull off grows without proper pasteurization or sterilization (whichever is applicable). The bigger trap there is that if you are successful IMHO. I mean I could probably pull off a successful bulk grow skipping all sorts of steps and many growers have and will, however I'm trying to help set you up for success, and ignoring the empirical data and experience of the many growers that came before us is unwise.

 

 

The links you mentioned are about poo right? I don't see coco coir mentioned anywhere. I believe I've read in multiple places that pasteurization is not really necessary for coco coir. Also that those bacteria are not present on coco coir (but I'm not very sure about that). Please correct me if I'm wrong though, I'm here to learn!  :tinfoil: 

 

Edit: Searching also led me to this:

attachicon.gifposts.PNG

 

2nd Edit: I think this thread made me doubt the presence of the bacteria. Not real conclusive though.

 

 

Pasteurization is a process utilized to kill mesophillic microbes (in our case for mushroom substrates, not milk :tongue:). Bacteria (or their endospores) covers virtually every surface on earth, but the bacteria that we want to kill is the kind that thrive at the same temperatures that we and the desired mycelium do. Don't forget mold spores! Improperly treated substrates can harbor mold spores that are parasitic and can destroy an entire grow and compromise that space for a long time.

 

A couple extra hours at the proper temperatures using flawless technique is so much easier to do than the amount of cleaning that one has to employ after waking up to mold spores covering a substrate. Once it sporulates, yer fucked. That means that a parasitic mold that favors eating mycelium has just covered the entire area with billions of spores, just waiting to germinate on it's next 'victim'.


Edited by CatsAndBats, 10 April 2017 - 07:34 PM.





Like Mycotopia? Become a member today!