41 replies to this topic

[fahtster]

***The title should include Eatyualive as well as Azur, but Azur is original poster.

Hey party peeps! So here something else that some of you may find helpful, especially if you work with PE in monotubs. NONE of this is my work or my pictures, but I've gotten permission to post this here and most of the permissions for the pics from the people that did the method and posted results... some just have been MIA so I haven't gotten a hold of them, but they'll get their pic credited and if they want it removed later, I'll have a mod do so, no problemo.

So.... I'm basically going to copy and paste word for except to remove some offsite links to preparation of Azur's bulk mix etc., but the gist of the method will be here. I can act as sort of a caretaker of this thread... if you have any questions about this method, I'll hunt down my best answer.. just might take a hot second to do so, so bear with me.

On with the show! (Sorry the repost isn't exact, Azur--I don't know how to center shit lol)
And again if you guys are like, "we already do this" I apologize ahead of time.

By Azur and Eatyualive
CASING AT SPAWNING:

Medium polyfil during
colonization, pinning, fruiting



Polyfil In During Colonization:

For all you naysays about colonizing without taping holes. Mushrooms fruit when they're damn well ready. In a controlled environment, we have some options. But in a monotub, it's up to the mushrooms.

I used to grow GT and I'd put poly in as soon as I spawned. Leave town for a few weeks and come home and harvest. I only started covering holes during colonization because I was growing pe and using a casing layer.

So I thought I'd experiment a little and see if the constant fresh air has any impact on blobbing or pinning times.

Stick around for the ride.

Here are some useful Write ups of how I get down on Dung and Straw. Your method may be different but the idea is casing during spawning while colonizing your substrate with medium polyfil. No tape is used to colonize any of the tubs in this write up.

How Azur gets down on HPOO/link removed

How Azur gets down on straw/link removed


Azur's Bulk substrate recipe:
Spawn Ratio: 1:1
5.5 Quart Jars Spawn
5.5 Quarts Hpoo/Verm(50% ratio of each)

Azur's Casing Recipe per tub:
1 Quart Coarse Verm
1 Quart Coir


Procedure:

1. Pasteurize your bulk substrate.

2. Prepare your spawn and bulk substrates for spawning.



3. Once your substrate is cooled. It is time to spawn. Setup your tubs, spawn, bulk substrate on a large table for spawning. Turn off the ac 30 minutes prior to doing this work. Take a shower and wear a face mask.

4. I don't use liners, but if you do use a liner. Add a liner to the tub. Then dump your substrate into the tub.



5. Take your colonized spawn and dump that onto the substrate.



6. Break up all of your spawn very evenly.



7. Mix in your spawn with your substrate. Make the surface as even as possible.



8. Apply your 1/4" casing. Then place medium stuffed polyfil in all of your holes.



9. 7-14 days later






Grow Log
Look at this. You will see several examples below of tubs colonized with medium stuffed polyfil in all holes during colonization.
_______________________________________________________________________________

* Two Ape Tubs below. One with polyfil immediately at spawning. The other with tape at spawning



* PE tub built 10/03
* Oats and hpoo/verm/gyp. Cased with jiffy and poly in holes at spawning



* Hey. So i looked at that tub and another tub a few minutes ago. Here's what i found
*First Pic is a pe tub not cased and holes covered. It will be cased on Thursday and will be put to poly on probably Monday.
*Second pic is the pe tub from the post above that was cased and put to poly at spawning time. Notice how colonized the casing layer is. My guess/hope is that this tub will fruit a good week before the other. This is exciting


* Second pic is the tub that was spawned, cased, and polied at the same time.
* First pic is the other tub just cased.


* It's an area starting to metabolize.
* All my tubs do that with hpoo.
* Here are 3 tubs that are currently pinning that show a good example of it.



* Well not only with hpoo. Just that it happens with hpoo when there's not necessarily any problems.

* link removed

* 9th paragraph

* Colonized poo trays sometimes emit a little honey yellow, to as dark as Tobacco juice colored metabolite type waste on the top of the tray. So long as it colonized nicely & the metabolite waste doesn't turn into a gusher. It's good to go. Been there & done that a few times, especially with big bulk trays that had a strong cow/poo mixture in them. The stuff is commonly called MYC PISS. If it's fully colonized, add a casing cover & go for it. METABOLITES

* Tub 1 was closed holes at spawning and cased a few days ago. Put poly in today.
* Tub 2 was tub spawned, cased, and polied at the same time.


* Annddd..we have lift off. One little pin on the tub that was spawned, cased, and polied at the same time


* The tub that was spawned and holes covered, then cased and then polied has not pinned yet


I'll keep ya posted

* Traditional tub has no pins. Looks to be slightly knotting up.
* Experimental tub is doing well.


*4 out of 5 tubs have a few tiny pins. Day 7, like clockwork


* Cased and polied the ape tubs i built a few days ago this morning. Wanted to case at spawning, but didn't have any casing. They were 90ish percent colonized.


* Tub 1 all straw with casing
* Tub 2 50/straw 50/hpoo&verm
* Tubs 3, 4, & 5 hpoo/verm 50/50
* All spawned 8 days ago and polied at spawning






* Fuck. I just picked 2 tubs and suddenly realized i was documenting this.
* So...
* Tub 1 all straw with casing layer
* Tub 2 half straw half hpoo/verm no casing
* Tub 3 hpoo/verm no casing


* 4 day old pe tubs.

Ok... it's Faht again lol.. that's the end of Azur's part of the original post... I'm running out of mb space with pics so I'll add his part tomorrow. For now I'll add some people's results using this. This method cuts PE pinning times down by about a week... which is pretty exciting for anyone that grows them. And people have had great results with this using regular cubes as well.

If you can please not post any responses yet until I get Eatyualive's section posted after this post, I'd appreciate it... it'll make it look much smoother. Thanks! Now here's some results...

Pics and words by Pastywhyte

Alright azur the results for my first clone run with this are in. The rest of flush 1 was just harvested and came in at 1299 making for a total wet weight of 3203. A bit low but nothing terrible considering this was just 5 quarts spawn. Should do better when I roll with 6 or 7 quarts spawn and sterilize the coir or even toss in some poo and other goodies. The pics of both harvests for this tub are. . .



I think that with a few tweaks I should get a more even pinset next time and my usual yield with this clone. I will post those results next time I run it. My other tub with the really early pin is also coming in really uneven, yet looks to be a great yield in the making.

At any rate this practice has lots of merit IMO. Thank you

Azur said:
Nice pasty. Yea. Not bad for 5 quarts.
The question though, is, how much time did you shave off?

Pastywhyte said:
At least a week

Pastywhyte said:
At any rate azur I wanted to post what became of that first tub I tried this on. You may recall that I felt my first flush yield was a touch low given the 5 quarts spawn I used. Well final dry weight came in at 10.5 oz, which was a bit low but only by a bit. Average for me with that clone and 5 quarts is around 11.5-12. So not bad given the speed of the method.

Anyway I decided to go for a second flush with this guy, usually this clone is a one and done deal. Most of the time I am lucky to see 3 mushrooms second flush with it. But I let it go to see if I could make up the shortfall. It did not disappoint.


Now that might look shit to some of you but for this clone I assure you its a miracle. Made up all the shortfall and then some. I was pretty shocked. Might even dunk it and see if a third is possible. I should be able to spare the space.

So IMO this is pretty solid. Great for the one and done guy as any shortfall in yield is more than made up for by speed. A week off pin time for this clone is kick ass and could represent a significant production boost. For those who ain't about that one flush and like to keep their tubs kicking around, its safe to say that there is only gain with it for them too. They benefit from a fast initial pinset and get that same yield over two flushes in less time. Killer.

I have a third tub I spawned but neglected to case at spawning. Its almost done 3 days later and I will case and slightly consolidate for the remainder of the week. Should be insightful

Azur said:
These tubs were spawned a few days after i got home from the romp...so probably around the 17th or 18th. They were a little slower as the temps have been cooler.


My casing is completely colonized little good wolf by the time they pin.

Pics of tubs done with this method by NDStepp84

Ok... I think that's good for today lol. Again, please wait to respond til after I've added Eatyualive's portion and I have more result pics to post as well. Lots of awesome eye candy. Eatyualive alone has a shit ton of great pics in his section. Pastywhyte also has some nice results with PE as well that are yet to come.

I'd like to thank Azur and Eatyualive and Pastywhyte and all the others that let me do this.. y'all rule! :)

Faht

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[fahtster]

Ok.. so here we go with Eatyualive's portion of the original thread and his procedure. Again there's some offsite links that are removed--not sure if he has the write-ups here or not, but I'll let him chime in if he does and he can link them within the site or make a quick write-up/description of the links. The same with Azur... both those guys said they were having trouble logging in a while ago, but are members here.

ATTN Eatyualive: I did cut down on a few examples due to upload restrictions, tried to grab the best ones I could find any "grouped" pics. Sorry.

Anyway, here we go!

EAT'S LAB ADAPTATION:

Bulk substrate recipe for 4 tubs:
* 3 bricks coir
* 6 quarts verm
* 1 quart gypsum
* 2 quarts comppost/manure

Casing Recipe(4 tubs):
* 1 brick coir
* 2 quarts Coarse verm
* handfull of gypsum

Procedure:

* 5 quarts oat spawn used per tub. Below is a link to a summary of procedure for bulk subs I use. This is a different recipe though.EZ Bulk Subs 123/link removed
* Grain was prepped using Cornmeal Plate Liquid Inoculation(CMLI)/link removed



*cleaned the tub with bleach wipes, put polyfil stuffed medium in each hole. placed a 30 gallon trash bag as the liner



* Dumped my pasteurized sub mix from the turkey tin after it was cooked in the oven. EZ Oven Pasteurization 123/link removed



* Broke up 5 quarts of oat spawn.



* mixed it up nice and even. made sure the top was as level as i could get it by eye



* added the casing about 1/4" depth per tub.



* This is an image of the tubs colonizing with medium polyfil in all holes.



* NO DIAL IN NECESSARY.
* The tubs are already dialed in without doing anything.. Medium polyfil was left in all holes for the duration of colonization, pinning, fruiting. At no time was any polyfil adjusted or removed. in the image below you can see the sides of the tub showing ge. The fan was turned on once colonization of the casing was 30-50%(tubs 1-4 below, tubs 5-8 were colonized with the fan on). The light source was turned on. So tubs 1-4 colonized in a dark closet.Tubs 5-8 colonized in diffused natural daylight coming in through the blinds with a fan on.



*Round 1:Tubs colonized with no fan during colonization. fan turned on at pinning.

* Tub 1: AA+



* Tub 2: AA+



* Tub 3: AA+



* Tub 4: AA+



* Tub 5: AA+



*Tub 6: AA+



*Tub 7 AA+



* Tub 8: AA+



* Tub 9: AA+



*Tub 10: AA+



*Tub 11: AA+



2nd flush



* Tub 12: Penis Envy Clone



Tub 13: Stropharia



Another tub of AA+



Eatyualive
some tex multispore using this method.



Eatyualive
more awesome grows using this method. these are all tex orange cap.



I forgot to mention, the last 2 tubs of the tex oc were done in 13 days from spawn to harvest. tub 2.

Ok... so that's Eatyualive's portion of the original thread... here's some more results:

by Stareatclouds
AA+ with no liner, spawned/cased/fruited 19 days ago. My average for regular cubes in 66's was 29 or so. I'm sold on this method for sure.

n

PE
I got a mix of blobs and small, mutated fruits. This is 11/29, 23 days after spawning.


After picking the blobs and weird fruits clean, I dunked for an hour in tap water. The second flush came in relatively strong, full of fruits only. This is 12/14, roughly 38 days after spawning.

I think I'll let it go for a third flush.

Midnightmarauder


Second flush of APE using this method.
I think doing it this way also may help curtail the development of trich.

Dhearic


Kinda disappointed with the size of the fruits but that's what you get with MS :shrug:

All in all I'd say I'm quite pleased. A little over a month ago I had a fully colonized plate of Wikidzon and now I have 3 tubs fruiting. Speed rocks!

DrEarnhardt
I harvested most of my tub 2 nights ago. There was a good bit on one side that needed more time and will be harvested today. The tub was very dense with fruits. I got 40 grams dry not including the side shown in the pic below. I'll know how much that is tonight. I've soaked the substrate and will try to get another flush, although I don't expect anything.

16 days from spawn to harvest. Thanks, Azur for the tek

Pasty
PE run with casing at spawning is pretty well done. Coir case is still finishing up and one of the coir case tubs is weak but, such is ms. Regardless the coir performed far better than I expected blob wise, only a few blobby fruits in either coir case tub. Given how bad the coir shit the bed with my last go of it, I am nearly ready to suggest that switching to a veg state after some tropisims associated with pinning have occured, is a major contributor to blobbing. I am curious now as to how a mixed PE tub with no top layer/casing would perform if the spawn run occurs in a high GE state. I need to run a few clones now.

Jiffy case


Coir case


Yeah the coir is a bit of a wild card, I really wanna get to the bottom of it. Coir tubs are both a little behind schedule but at least one looks to be giving a decent pull^^^^


Anyway I will stop clogging up this thread. I am sold on this method and it has me excited about future experiments with PE.

Ok! That should about do it. Thanks, again to everyone that contributed. :). Go ahead and feel free to respond/post!!

Faht

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[happy4nic8r]

Nice write up, collection, repost Fahtster.

 

I have a collection of Eats in my big computer, this one will go there as well.

 

Thanks. Happy:)

[llamabox]

Nice. I used to have a tek here just wrapping the tub in saran wrap till ready to trigger fruiting.

[fahtster]

Hey Llama... Yeah, I think the idea here is that the tubs are put into fruiting conditions and cased when the tub is made and kept in fruiting conditions.  When they say "medium poly" in the holes, that means they're medium stuffed tightness.  So basically this is saying the exact opposite of taping up holes during colonization.  Or maybe I'm missing what you're saying...

 

faht

[llamabox]

No I think I missed that. Thanks for the info Faht

[fahtster]

yeah, the title's a little confusing...  probably should say taped holes vs medium stuffed holes in mono tubs/spawning at casing... but that's super long lol.  Long story even longer, medium stuffed holes won.  At least in speed.  normally fruited tubs are great too.. just something some peeps might wanna try if they are looking for speed and especially if you fucks with PE in mono's.  I know when I was doing PE, I would have given my left testi for a shaved week off their pin times. lol  :)

 

faht

[sandman]

Looks like I got some good reading ahead of me.

[Hash_Man]

Phenomenal

thanks Fahts, good timing
with sharing this.

[MLBjammer]

I have been doing this with Sandbags for a couple years now.  It definitely speeds things up, usually 2-3 weeks from spawning to first harvest with cube strains.  But I do not case cubes in general.  But I might in honor of Fahtster.

 

Great thread, Faht!

[Hash_Man]

Yea Jammers bags came to mind.

Years ago I should have suspected FAE is key.
When once (reference link only: below) I made larger filter patch (medium polied) on bags early in colonizing at one point cut the whole tops off the bags and solved that fricking problem of the slowness LOL. So i got close to concluding the value of early air exchange but never continue to experament, at that time I did cover the 50/50 ratio aspect of what we're seeing here, I guess 'following through' makes the difference in being a mere Hacker or a 'Heavy Hiter' in the hobbiy LOL

So yea, the combination coir and casing with concideration with frequent air exchange all the way through has got a big vote from my camp.




https://mycotopia.ne...vitro-bags-log/

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[fahtster]

nice, man!  Yeah, back when I started doing tubs, I'd keep them in indirect fans and "burped" them every-other day.. people were freaking out because I was allowing for some gas exchange during colonizing.. it fixed the bacterial problem I was having during fruiting (the problem was probably more to do with my pasteurizing method than fruiting... or I had bacteria from my clone tissue)... still not the same as azur's, but even back then, I saw no problems from giving them a little TLC right from the get-go. It's a definitely an avenue worth checking out.

 

faht

[hyphaenation]

Good to see you around Fahtster.

In Bulk We Trust!

[CatsAndBats]

nice, man!  Yeah, back when I started doing tubs, I'd keep them in indirect fans and "burped" them every-other day.. people were freaking out because I was allowing for some gas exchange during colonizing.. it fixed the bacterial problem I was having during fruiting (the problem was probably more to do with my pasteurizing method than fruiting... or I had bacteria from my clone tissue)... still not the same as azur's, but even back then, I saw no problems from giving them a little TLC right from the get-go. It's a definitely an avenue worth checking out.

 

faht

 

 

Goddamn right! Preach it brother. Killing bacteria and giving aerobic fungi fresh air from the get go! I got a couple of these going too. Brilliant.

[fahtster]

Good to see you around Fahtster.
In Bulk We Trust!

You too, Hyphae! It's been a hot minute.

Faht

[fahtster]

And since we are on the topic, this would probably work well in a situation where you have questionable spawn (questionable being bacterial and you may not want to expand the jar via G2G, but think you can still get fruit from at least one flush). Doing this method should stunt bacterial growth with the fruiting conditions and you can still get a fast flush and not lose questionably bacterial jars/work.

Faht

[MLBjammer]

I think I have probably succeeded with lots of iffy spawn because I allowed air exchange from spawning. I actually started doing it out of laziness but quickly found that it was the way to go--at least with cubes. I will throw up a few pics of my Sandbags if I have some decent flushes here in the next few days.

[fahtster]

Oh hell yeah.. I'm all 'bout dem pics!

Faht

[CatsAndBats]

We are a voyeuristic bunch aren't we?

[MLBjammer]

I don't know what you are talking about.  I only spy on my neighbor with cheap binoculars, lol.