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Wet vs. Dry Potency Differences


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#21 Cryingblackoil

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Posted 24 August 2006 - 06:37 AM

Ah :)

#22 Hippie3

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Posted 24 August 2006 - 06:46 AM

10g fresh is like 1 or less grams dry. No wonder dry shrooms work better for you.


yeah, big diff between 10 fresh grams and 3 dry,
as 3 dry is the rough equivalent of 25 fresh or so

#23 Killjoy

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Posted 24 August 2006 - 02:23 PM

Found this a few years back, this link brough it up...

by Jochen Gartz, from Journal of Basic Microbiology, 1994, 34(1):17-22.
...
Table 1
Amount of indole alkaloids in fruiting bodies of different species by using pure methanol as solvent (%, dry weight).

<table border="5" width="600"> <tbody><tr> <td width="">Species</td> <td align="center">Psilocybin</td> <td align="center">Psilocin</td> <td align="center">Baeocystin</td> </tr> <tr> <td>P. semilanceata</td> <td align="center">0.98</td> <td align="center">-</td> <td align="center">0.34</td> </tr> <tr> <td>P. bohemica</td> <td align="center">0.85</td> <td align="center">0.02</td> <td align="center">0.04</td> </tr><tr> <td>P. bohemica (cultivated)</td> <td align="center">0.93</td> <td align="center">0.04</td> <td align="center">0.02</td> </tr> <tr> <td>P. cubensis</td> <td align="center">0.63</td> <td align="center">0.11</td> <td align="center">0.02</td> </tr> <tr> <td>G. purpuratus</td> <td align="center">0.34</td> <td align="center">0.29</td> <td align="center">0.05</td> </tr> <tr> <td>I. aeruginacens</td> <td align="center">0.40</td> <td align="center">-</td> <td align="center">0.21</td> </tr> <tr> <td>P. cyanescens</td> <td align="center">0.32</td> <td align="center">0.51</td> <td align="center">0.02</td> </tr> <tr> <td>
</td> <td align="center">
</td> <td align="center">
</td> <td align="center">
</td> </tr> </tbody></table> Table 2
Concentraction of alkaloids by using acetic acid for extraction of the dried mushrooms (%, dry weight).

<table border="5" width="600"> <tbody><tr> <td width="">Species</td> <td align="center">Psilocybin</td> <td align="center">Psilocin</td> <td align="center">Baeocystin</td> </tr> <tr> <td>P. semilanceata</td> <td align="center">0.97</td> <td align="center">0.15</td> <td align="center">0.11</td> </tr> <tr> <td>P. bohemica</td> <td align="center">0.60</td> <td align="center">0.21</td> <td align="center">-</td> </tr><tr> <td>P. bohemica (cultivated)</td> <td align="center">0.65</td> <td align="center">0.28</td> <td align="center">-</td> </tr> <tr> <td>P. cubensis</td> <td align="center">0.45</td> <td align="center">0.25</td> <td align="center">-</td> </tr> <tr> <td>G. purpuratus</td> <td align="center">0.24</td> <td align="center">0.35</td> <td align="center">0.01</td> </tr> <tr> <td>I. aeruginacens</td> <td align="center">0.32</td> <td align="center">0.05</td> <td align="center">0.15</td> </tr> <tr> <td>P. cyanescens</td> <td align="center">0.20</td> <td align="center">0.61</td> <td align="center">-</td> </tr> <tr> <td>
</td> <td align="center">
</td> <td align="center">
</td> <td align="center">
</td> </tr> </tbody></table> Table 3
Results of the mushroom extraction of six species using aqueous mixtures of methanol and ethanol (%, dry weight).

<table border="5" width="600"><tbody><tr> <td width="">Species</td> <td align="center">Psilocybin</td> <td align="center">Psilocin</td> <td align="center">Baeocystin</td> </tr> <tr> <td>P. semilanceata</td> <td align="center">0.80</td> <td align="center">0.15</td> <td align="center">0.11</td> </tr> <tr> <td>P. bohemica</td> <td align="center">0.60</td> <td align="center">0.21</td> <td align="center">-</td> </tr><tr> <td>P. bohemica (cultivated)</td> <td align="center">0.65</td> <td align="center">0.28</td> <td align="center">-</td> </tr> <tr> <td>P. cubensis</td> <td align="center">0.45</td> <td align="center">0.25</td> <td align="center">-</td> </tr> <tr> <td>G. purpuratus</td> <td align="center">0.24</td> <td align="center">0.35</td> <td align="center">0.01</td> </tr> <tr> <td>I. aeruginacens</td> <td align="center">0.32</td> <td align="center">0.05</td> <td align="center">0.15</td> </tr> <tr> <td>P. cyanescens</td> <td align="center">0.20</td> <td align="center">0.61</td> <td align="center">-</td> </tr> <tr> <td>
</td> <td align="center">
</td> <td align="center">
</td> <td align="center">
</td></tr></tbody></table>

Banzai, any particular strains you find the potency higher in, or... I'd imagine some difference in strain and cin to cybin ratios... Those numbers and hippies comment on psilocin being lost during drying Cubenesis 50% more potent fresh vs. dry..
Pan Cyan's are even more so...
Any one notice a loss of potency in dry cyan's? Seems they have less psilocybin than cubes...
I would think some of the psilocin has to stay in the dried shrooms to account for thier higher potency?

EDIT-- Numbers are from dry shrooms... so some of it does stay in them.. now just need to find out the same data for fresh now to compare...

Coool thread!


#24 Killjoy

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Posted 24 August 2006 - 02:26 PM

one more ??

any factors other than genetic that effect the potency, or ratio of cybin to cin?

#25 BuckarooBanzai

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Posted 24 August 2006 - 09:42 PM

I don't really have experience with a bunch of different strains, honestly. It seems really disingenuous to say "this one rocks, that one sucks." All of them have been really good to me, over the years, before I even knew there was such a thing as different strains.

I have done MANY years more hunting than growing.

When you hunt them in fields, they are all pretty much the same. You couldn't ID one wild strain visibly from fruit, or spore print. You don't see so many penis envy caps out in the field.

Truth is, to me, we are splitting hairs. All these strains are just tiny variants, or location differences, of the same mushroom: Psilocybe cubensis.

Genetically, they are all damned near identical.

I think the biggest difference in potency is in the mind of the grower/consumer. When you go in, eating your own babies, expecting to have a really good time...a really good time is what you are likely to get.

If you want a measurably different potency, go for the wood lovers. Otherwise, if you want a harder trip, just eat another gram or two.

The great thing about growing them yourself is that you have enough to eat until you are...full. You can ALWAYS eat more.

That said, I'd never, ever, ever choose dry anything over fresh...

#26 waylitjim

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Posted 24 August 2006 - 10:23 PM

If you want a measurably different potency, go for the wood lovers.


< Ears perk up :D

#27 Lazlo

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Posted 24 August 2006 - 11:51 PM

Ha ha ha ha...

I guess this doesn't make sense after reading you guys' posts, but I've never been able to trip from freshies, and believe me - I've tried.

Ate 10g fresh once and got a headache. Dried shrooms from the same batch, side by side, and went nuts from 3g. Maybe it's my body? Who knows, but my vote goes for dried, extracted is even better :)

soliver


I agree. I've not once had a poor trip with dried specimens versus wet ones, unless the mushrooms were consumed right after the harvest. Within and hour of picking them off of the substrate. This is with cubensis now. Anything after a few hours of harvest is a complete waste for me for tripping. I might as well eat Shitake's and expect the same results.

I remember you and I discussing this once before Soliver.

#28 Lazlo

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Posted 24 August 2006 - 11:55 PM

I will have to approach my next fresh adventure more scientifically. But I will have to say that I didn't think the fresh trip was that much stronger. But I have been wrong many times, and will be wrong in the future. I should have some fresh ones in the next few days. I will post a report maybe.


Do you recall me mentioning this in your Hawiian thread? Eat some mushrooms a few hours after harvest and let me know the results. I'd bet you'll be disappointed.

#29 Sky Rayven

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Posted 25 August 2006 - 01:44 AM

This seems simple to me. Fresh is better!! As for all you people that can't stand the taste???? I love the taste, and, I always have trouble stomaching things. I love the taste of fresh.

STICK TO FRESH...its better!

Fresh means FRESH!!

Happy Stargazing:dance:

#30 Hippie3

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Posted 25 August 2006 - 07:58 AM

my experience does not match yours, lazlo.
my very first homegrown trip
was just a solitary medium sized freshie
off a quart of rye done oss&oeric style.
picked it right off the rye, popped it in my mouth
and 20 minutes later i knew homestead had indeed
sent me good spores.

#31 Lazlo

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Posted 25 August 2006 - 11:04 AM

They work with me if I eat them right off of the substrate, but if I eat them a few hours after harvesting, they don't do anything to me. I can't figure it out for the life of me. Well maybe a half day or so after harvesting.

#32 Sidestreet

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Posted 25 August 2006 - 11:15 AM

I remember some discussion about the higher baeocystin content in fresh vs. dry. Somebody asserted that visuals have more presence with freshies, and that the baeocystin may be the reason why. Can anyone comment?

I've only had one real trip with freshies-30 grams-and the visuals were pretty intense for how high I felt.

#33 Cryingblackoil

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Posted 26 August 2006 - 09:29 AM

Hehe, Waylit

#34 Hippie3

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Posted 26 August 2006 - 09:38 AM

They work with me if I eat them right off of the substrate, but if I eat them a few hours after harvesting, they don't do anything to me. I can't figure it out for the life of me. Well maybe a half day or so after harvesting.



that is odd indeed. maybe there's some chemistry involved
that temporarily 'locks up' the magic but i surely don't know
what mechanism would be involved.




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