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What have I become?


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#41 bennylava

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Posted 11 January 2018 - 07:01 PM

Man that guy wrote a lot about bullshit lol.

 

Anyway on topic, yet another pattern is forming for me. Cause the same thing that happened to me on the last big trip before this one, is happening again. Which is, the more time I put between me and this traumatic experience, the more I heal and the less I think about it. I come back to normal mundane human reality. Which is were I like to be. As opposed to where I was, which clearly didn't suit me very well. The more I can just write it all off as nonsense, the better I feel. And with time, that gets easier and easier. Like its just best to put it all behind me. To forget about all that. 

 

I think its because the mushrooms basically peeled a layer away from my mind. And my reality was no longer anchored to any point of reference. And I had to fight to keep from being crushed under the weight of an unforgiving new paradigm of ultimate reality.


Edited by bennylava, 11 January 2018 - 07:05 PM.

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#42 Soliver

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Posted 13 January 2018 - 07:34 PM

Time is an amazing healer ... It's my personal belief that natural hallucinogens help to heal as opposed to building up time-related scar tissue, which covers the wound but not much else. 

 

Or at least that's what I want to believe  :)

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#43 OysterFarmer

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Posted 13 January 2018 - 08:55 PM

Time is an amazing healer ... It's my personal belief that natural hallucinogens help to heal as opposed to building up time-related scar tissue, which covers the wound but not much else. 

 

Or at least that's what I want to believe  :)

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The Joe Rogan podcast a few days ago had this meditator guy on there talking about old traumas sticking with us.  At least according to him part of the meditation process is letting go of these old but real wounds.

 

I myself got hit by a car when I was a kid and now I'm starting to wonder if some of my current aches and pains are just from holding on to that.



#44 OysterFarmer

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Posted 13 January 2018 - 09:03 PM

I also find the mushrooms on some level at least leave me a lot less able to tolerate people's bullshit.  Its my normative state to just walk away but if I'm 'cornered' its gonna come out.  Like just the other day I took a friends dog to the dog park and there is this alcoholic loud mouth there who had really got on my nerves on past trips.  I had just tried to ignore him with some success.  This trip though he got smart with me as soon as I opened the gate so I let him have both barells and told him the dog park is a happy place for happy dogs and happy people and not old alcoholics trying to make everyone miserable.  I also advised him he could shut the fuck up at any time during the 'conversation'.

 

It sounds kinda hard ass but you know I think it was something that someone needed to do at some point.  So I did it.  And I'd do it again but at least with him I don't think I will have too.  It had come up in another thread about dogs reactions to people when tripping.  Oddly enough even though I was buzzing a little none of the dogs in the park acted freaked out by me and in fact later the guys own dog came up and stood by my side and wouldn't leave.  I thought that was pretty funny.  I guess she figured I was top dog now.

 

I've lost so many layers of human ego things like this seem a lot more natural to me now.  Some people might say so the mushrooms make it harder for you to interact with people now but the reality is I never was interacting with them to begin with.

 

Think about the average conversation people have in passing.  "Hi how are you"  "Oh just fine"  "That's good"  How is your husband.  He's fine.  How are the kids.  They are fine too. 

 

Meanwhile zero information has actually been exchanged.  Likely the person isn't fine, husband isn't fine, someone could be losing their job, or house and they'll still say fine.

 

Maybe it seems neurotic or vaguely psychotic but I refuse to answer strangers questions as to how I'm doing.  Unless they want an accurate answer which would involve the fact I have both heart and kidney failure and my life is fairly well wrecked.  But they don't want that real answer they want a fake little answer out of me and that seems slightly wrong somehow to be coming at me demanding something from me.  I think you will find with most people into these fake little pleasantries there really is no depth there worth exploring.


Edited by OysterFarmer, 13 January 2018 - 09:08 PM.

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#45 coorsmikey

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Posted 13 January 2018 - 09:57 PM

The “Hi how are you” is adopted by people like me and most likely you no matter how much you don’t want to hear that. Say that drunk guy in the Happy Park? Or the guy you say “hi how are you” to and this stranger gives you this fucking sad and depressing story when you’re at the park trying to pull your own mind out of darkness, you go there to be in a happy place, not to listen to people’s drunken Raves or the real problems they may have. A simple “what’s up.” Is most likely a better choice cuz that doesn’t imply “bullshit”.
When I say Hi, Hows it going it’s not a serious question, when someone says it to me I don’t take it’s as here is someone that wants to hear all my problems and bullshit. It is a simple acknowledgement beyond eye contact to say “don’t worry about me, I am not that drunk asshole or I ain’t gonna unload all my negativity on to you. It’s just a code that has been adopted to acknowledge you’re a friendly in the same space of the Bubble. Much different than when your sitting by the campfire with close people you have seen in a long time and they say .........”So Mikey how are you! Like what really going on?” Rarely anyone want to hear my problems and my problems are mine. More so I am more embarrassed of my problems and don’t want to share them with someone that don’t know me or care.
You give me a friendly not quite a handshake in the park and say “how’s it going” please don’t unload all your bullshit on me, I have my own already, simple move on and take care of the loud drunk guy. ( I was the quiet one that said “how’s it going just to say I’m a friendly) and I will do the same, I won’t unload my bullshit on you. After so many “Hi How are you”s we’ll gain some trust with one another and starting talking. Might even realize that we are a lot alike. Now if I do the “Hi how are you” and the other person gets all weird on me, next time I’m gonna not make that mistake again and may react a lot like you did to the drunk guy that was being loud, but didn’t have any bullshit to soften the blow. He was just straight to the point and that’s annoying. I would probably act much like you. I’m not gonna unload on the “Courtesy Bullshit” that we have adopted as a code to filter out people I don’t want to speak with.
Sorry a bit of a ramble. But I just felt the need to to defend some of the bullshit we dish out in order to help protect us from heavier bullshit.

Edited by coorsmikey, 13 January 2018 - 10:10 PM.

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#46 Soliver

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Posted 13 January 2018 - 10:26 PM

It's an odd position for me to be in, but I completely agree ... 100% ... with both of these viewpoints. 

 

Plenty of time I'll say "how's everything" or some such bullshit, not really caring.

 

On the other hand, sometimes when someone asks the same to me, I'll purposefully unload a cubic mile of psychic bullshit on them just because they asked, and I'm in need of some lightening.

 

If you think about it, what we're seeing is a universal balancing of bullshit negativity.  If you can take it, someone will dump it on you.  Otherwise, if you're overloaded, you do the dumping.  Life is a great balancing act.

 

Some would suggest "the good LORD won't burden you with more than you can handle," but I'd respond "terminal cancer?" ... all the same, from an emotional perspective, the theory holds.

 

:)

 

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#47 SteampunkScientist

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Posted 14 January 2018 - 09:35 PM


What hurts us is our own taking a thing personally. We, the person, must remain guarded, when it is how we identify. If and when we see we are much more than our ideas of self, and that the ideas are and were never more than a constantly changing set of ideas, what is there that someone else's ideas could threaten?


All problems are personal.
~Mooji


Alder, is that not also an idea? The idea that we are ideas?

I have no idea... ;P

#48 Alder Logs

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Posted 14 January 2018 - 10:15 PM

Why do you snipe?   The idea here is that ideas are fine and good, as such.    The pointing is to finding one's being in what is, rather than some wild ass guesses conceived out of our personal ideological constructs, our idealized self deceits.  Instead of our being, it is the illusion of being something.   

 

We find a direction to first know ourselves coming from the sages of the ages.   It can be found by anyone who makes the determined decision to find it.   Since what we are is not a thing, not an object, not an idea or collection thereof, but the active happening of awareness, it is a discovery in awareness.  It is the awareness of ourselves as awareness itself, being as it is, indefinable beyond our own honest an unadorned being of it.  

 

I do hope there are those who are inspired toward their own discoveries by what I write of it here.



#49 onediadem

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Posted 14 January 2018 - 10:48 PM

Hopefully that doesn't involve stacking expired teenage transexuals in your basement like cordwood, but if you end up making soap out of Alder, we'll all understand.

 

 

 

 

I would pay good money for a bar of Alder.


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#50 coorsmikey

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Posted 15 January 2018 - 12:44 AM


Hopefully that doesn't involve stacking expired teenage transexuals in your basement like cordwood, but if you end up making soap out of Alder, we'll all understand.




I would pay good money for a bar of Alder.
Soliver has two patents on the concept. Beware of infringement violations if you go that route!
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#51 Juthro

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Posted 15 January 2018 - 01:09 AM

It sounds kinda hard ass but you know I think it was something that someone needed to do at some point.  So I did it.



Opinions are free, and mine is worth every penny that you paid for it... But here it is anyway.

It sounds to me like you've got a long ways to go before you even know what your ego looks like. Acting like a dick to force a confrontation is not the standard actions of an enlightened soul. There were plenty of other ways to deal with someone you would rather not talk to or deal with.

And I will give the bit of advice, you should be careful with that move, cuz sooner or later someone is going to stand up when you say shut up, and they are going to recline your damn teeth.

Even someone who can't win can make you wish you hadn't asked them to dance.
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#52 Alder Logs

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Posted 15 January 2018 - 10:56 AM

 

I would pay good money for a bar of Alder.

 

There you go, driving the market pressure for my eventual rendering.   

 

When my body has become soap, will I experience and know that onediadem has gotten me all worked up in a lather?  


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#53 Trian3

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Posted 15 January 2018 - 02:07 PM

 

 

I would pay good money for a bar of Alder.

 

There you go, driving the market pressure for my eventual rendering.   

 

When my body has become soap, will I experience and know that onediadem has gotten me all worked up in a lather?  

 

 

ROFL!  This should go in Daily Lulz!


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#54 onediadem

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Posted 15 January 2018 - 03:25 PM

 

 

Hopefully that doesn't involve stacking expired teenage transexuals in your basement like cordwood, but if you end up making soap out of Alder, we'll all understand.
 



I would pay good money for a bar of Alder.
Soliver has two patents on the concept. Beware of infringement violations if you go that route!

 

 

 

Well, I think soliver and I are in pretty good standing, and I am sure he would cut me a deal. I really wasn't planning on infringing upon anyone's idea at all. I just want some Alder soap from whoever makes it. In twenty years it will be worth a fortune like Billy Beer.


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#55 Alder Logs

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Posted 15 January 2018 - 04:06 PM

 

Well, I think soliver and I are in pretty good standing...

 

 

Better hope he doesn't ever get too hungry, or all deals are off.


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#56 bennylava

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Posted 18 January 2018 - 01:07 AM



 

 

It sounds to me like you've got a long ways to go before you even know what your ego looks like.

 

I have had a idea of what mine looks like, and at first glance it looks nasty. Real freakin' nasty. But I have to believe its there for a reason, or I wouldn't have it. Humans wouldn't have egos. Just got to recognize what it is, why it exists, and how to keep it on a short leash. Mckenna said its how you even know to put the food in your mouth instead of into the mouth of whoever is sitting across the table. So that sounds pretty darn useful and necessary. But it gets too big for its britches, as my mom would say to me sometimes. Gets to thinking that it is king sh1+. If you think about it that way, an ego is just like anything else in the world. Its fine, it just needs to have limits imposed upon it, by the user.

 

An anthill can get too big and cause problems. A building can do it. A car can do it. A storm can do it, an ego can do it. Upon further contemplation, I think during my extreme duress I was beginning to glimpse something, to barely understand something. Hard to define, but its something like:

 

You have to learn to be happy in whatever state you are in. Doesn't matter the state, you're just fine. Anything else is just something you're imposing on yourself. Something you are making up and inventing for yourself to live in. Even in death, you'll be fine. Like it was trying to show me that there wasn't any real difference between life and death... or something along those lines. That either dead or alive, I exist and nothing can change that. That is the brutal unforgiving new reality thing. It was kind of like it was saying "Yeah, you're here, and you can't even tell whether you're dead or alive. What does that tell you?" Like it was trying to lead me to some kind of conclusion, some kind of revelation. Reminds me of Pink Floyd lyrics: "I had a fleeting glimpse, but now its gone". Cause during the awful part of the trip, I could almost see it. I could almost look at it, and understand it, but I was too afraid and already too freaked out so I hid instead. I hid in the best and only way I knew how.

 

If there was someone on the other side watching, they were probably like "Look at this little guy, he's running away, he's hiding. Like a little mouse frantically escaping into his hole in the wall".



#57 Alder Logs

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Posted 18 January 2018 - 11:13 AM

Could it be there is no other sides beyond the ones we imagine?    All the seeing was yours, as the seeing itself.  If the little guy trying to hide is known in your seeing, who are you; the made up little guy, or the very source of the seeing itself?  

 

We, as the picture of ourselves we call, "ego," call the greater seeings we experience, "glimpses," after we submerge back into our believed in self images.  

 

I argue against the idea of integrating the experience, as I see this as finding a means to accommodate a more true seeing to fit into our false seeing, which likely is why some of us seek these glimpses in the first place.    While the ego might make us feed ourselves first, a greater seeing in a given tense, may show us that it is precisely the proper time to feed the perceived one across the table.  

 

The ego is pretty much a personal image that is set up between an imagined version of past, and an equally imagined future, made up of imprecise deductions.   Only the present which seemingly sits in between the two false imaginings holds any actuality.   The trip that blasts the unreal perceptions from the foreground and leaves us standing in the eternal now could be trying to show us the dream we call the waking state.   

 

What we have become started with the acquisition of language based thinking.   The blast of presence, wherever and however it arises in experience, shows more of what's true than does what living in the soup of descriptions the ego identity takes as its world.   The trick may be to not become a replacement for what was not genuine in the first place.  

 

Can becoming cease?    Can we see from unchanging perceiving what seems to be so, and act accordingly?   The seemingly so will continue to unfold, but we needn't be its victims.   It's all in the perspective we choose.   Our versions of a somebody will of necessity be swept in the currents of time.   As the watching, are we ever wounded?   Yes, these bodies all die.     Free of the imposed identity of the ego, we see we'll be fine.   The seeing, being now, is always on the scene before any thought, in and of separation.



#58 Juthro

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Posted 18 January 2018 - 11:33 AM

It sounds to me like you've got a long ways to go before you even know what your ego looks like.

 
I have had a idea of what mine looks like, and at first glance it looks nasty. Real freakin' nasty. But I have to believe its there for a reason, or I wouldn't have it. Humans wouldn't have egos. Just got to recognize what it is, why it exists, and how to keep it on a short leash. Mckenna said its how you even know to put the food in your mouth instead of into the mouth of whoever is sitting across the table. So that sounds pretty darn useful and necessary. But it gets too big for its britches, as my mom would say to me sometimes. Gets to thinking that it is king sh1+. If you think about it that way, an ego is just like anything else in the world. Its fine, it just needs to have limits imposed upon it, by the user.


You make some good points Benny, but you need to know my comment wasn't directed at you.

#59 Alder Logs

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Posted 18 January 2018 - 11:48 AM

 

You make some good points Benny, but you need to know my comment wasn't directed at you.

 

I wondered about that, but the quote he used and edited down pointed to your post, Juth.  I just took it all as a discussion of ego in terms of the question in the thread title.   I think Ben must know it was not aimed his way, and was developing the conversation along the same identity lines. 

 

Identity and ego is totally central to becoming.   Becoming, as a thing, is hugely important as a means of seeing what the ego identity is, and more importantly, isn't.   Are we an ego, or do we, as what we actually are, seem to have an ego?   When the ego is really looked at, what is it made from?    It becomes, but weren't we truly here first?   And, was it a "we," or is it an "I?"    Is the I dependent on the we, or is it the other way around?

 

I love these questions, because of how they point beyond what is made up in our minds, to what stands alone in the original position (which is not a position at all, but contains an illusion of positioning). 


Edited by Alder Logs, 18 January 2018 - 11:50 AM.

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#60 bennylava

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Posted 18 January 2018 - 08:38 PM

Yeah I saw that it was directed at another member, but thought I may be able to add something to the conversation there.

 

As for what is the ego, well its clearly part of us in some way. Some integral part, another block in the lego set. And you see what happens if you temporarily remove that block. The whole lego set appears to change in some profound way. Ego may become a word, 100 years from now, that is defined better. I remember when the term "self esteem" was a big deal, but now if you watch psychiatrists on youtube, they seem to have a good deal of disdain for that term. Saying that its a poor choice of words and generally leads people down the wrong path if they try to pursue its definition and apply it to themselves. I think its possible that ego could become that way some day.

 

Ego seems to be like some kind of temporary definition of yourself. But what if you're not temporary? Then it will be a crude tool usable only in the short term. It would have no long term viability.


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