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What is with the geometric patterns?


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#1 bennylava

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Posted 26 December 2017 - 07:21 AM

Any sort of explanation for this? I've seen them, they were there on my most recent big trip. When I'd close my eyes, I could see all those geometric shapes and patterns and fractals that everyone always talks about. And that so many artists who have tripped, have created images of for us to view when sober. So while looking at them, I figured I'd try and understand it. Because I go to these places to learn. I thought I'd try to see what this part of psychedellics was all about. Couldn't figure anything out. They just sort of sit there, moving and changing. But somehow not moving or changing.

 

Is there any word on what they are, or what they are for? I finally gave up and just didn't find them very interesting. Its like yeah, they are there, but I'm not sure what I'm supposed to do with this. Paying attention to them didn't really get me anywhere, or teach me anything. At least not that I know of. I finally just wrote them off and opened my eyes and basically ignored them, because I didn't know anything about them or what should be done with them, if anything.

 

So does anyone have any idea on what they are, or what they're about?


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#2 Alder Logs

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Posted 26 December 2017 - 11:33 AM

For me, they're just beauty in the visual portion of the all that is.   The all that is is so far beyond the finite mind and its capacities, even of its form or means of functionality, that any understanding it is capable of will never come close to what is ultimately available.   When the mushrooms open our experiencing up beyond the body/mind's conditioned limitations, while any of the finite mind's filters still hold any power, there must be some squirming if mind demands definition and rational understanding.    If we can't trust life we can miss a lot of the beauty.    A child doesn't ask what the joy in living is for.    Can we get our own internal set and setting cleaned up enough to just be in the experience?


Edited by Alder Logs, 26 December 2017 - 11:34 AM.

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#3 bennylava

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Posted 27 December 2017 - 04:37 AM

Yeah I did that for awhile, and maybe I'm stunted when it comes to art appreciation. But I just didn't see any appeal. I watched them for awhile, but really I'd kind of gotten the gist of it by looking at all the artwork that others have done regarding them. Next time I'll see about paying even closer attention. But I just didn't find them all that interesting. The most interesting part was when I realized they were there and I was like "Oh hey look, its those things. Now I've finally seen 'em". I think they may actually have a function. It might have to do with the "helping" of your brain. When I was doing a bit of research on them, I ran across some ancient artwork that was basically the psychedllic fractals. The ancient culture would stare at these, and they said that different ones helped you in different ways. One was even said to aid the pineal gland in some way. One was supposed to help your memory in some way.

 

Maybe they knew a lot more than we do about certain subjects (as so many ancient cultures did) and they had somehow managed to figure out that certain shapes and patterns do help when you stare at them long enough. And since mushrooms seem to have uncounted curative effects, perhaps this is just another thing they do to help. If you sit there and stare at those, you get some kind of benefit. Just another theory.



#4 Alder Logs

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Posted 27 December 2017 - 12:20 PM

I don't know what to say here.  For myself, I see that it's best that I, as an idea of some entity, not be there, but more just be the being.   Not to see the visuals as such, nor have a healing as such, nor learn lessons as such.    In other words, to take any mentality of subject/object out of it, and even in that, it's not some something taking anything.  It's not really a doing when the doer is no longer in the mix.   That doer is our own bullshit idea about a doer.   What sees the visuals is not some art critic.  As just being, can I simply be immersed in the beauty of all that is arising?

 

The mundane me that comes down out being blown away would love to be the artist who could render that experience, but I could not attempt to paint it, knowing what has been lost in the translation.   That's okay, because I can see that being changes even what it is that would try to render it static, so as to have it.   The being is a letting be, and perhaps a thank you.   All the beauty and all the mystery does not go away on the come-down.    We just paint what we think was there over the top of it.   This existence is a masterpiece canvas which we have painted over.   Perhaps the mushrooms are a solvent with which we can wipe our amateurish attempt at painting away for a moment. 

 

What can be seen in our visual sense, and what is perceived in every way, can be outdone the instant we, that old hairy eyeball, is taken out of play.   I have come to learn that the mushrooms are one way, but one of many, and the ways all are unneeded once this is understood.   All the ways show a bit of what is here before, in an eternally here and now sense, it is what stands outside of time.   We cannot bring that thingless thing back into time.  It doesn't come out of time.  Time comes out of it.   It is prime being, and therefore is what we are, before what we think and believe we are.  

 

But as usual, I guess you had to be there.


Edited by Alder Logs, 27 December 2017 - 12:25 PM.


#5 firerat

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Posted 27 December 2017 - 12:44 PM

I think your major issue here is trying to attach meaning to everything.

 

They are hallucinations brought on by psilocybin. That's it. 

 

Just enjoy it man.


Edited by firerat, 27 December 2017 - 12:46 PM.

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#6 Alder Logs

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Posted 27 December 2017 - 01:15 PM

I like Terence's title, True Hallucinations.  Experience is real as experience.   I think it should be trusted on this side of the material/prematerial boundary (a made up line in the sand, to be sure).   But to find the real, stay open.    Find the essence of the experiencer, and see how it is perhaps more the true, then see that the experiencer is not the experienced or any story that has arisen from it.   The experiencer is on the scene first, and then the experiences come. 


Edited by Alder Logs, 27 December 2017 - 01:16 PM.


#7 firerat

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Posted 27 December 2017 - 01:21 PM

Well of course there's that...what you said Alder...


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#8 pharmer

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Posted 27 December 2017 - 06:47 PM

Somebody here, can't remember who, posed that those geometric ever-morphing forms are just distractions thrown in our path by the "gatekeepers' of the alternate or true reality. Like challenges we have to overcome to getting our own minds right about what the true reality is. Or that by recognizing that they are just cheap distractions, like platinum blonde hair, we are finally able to ignore them and ease further into the discovery of the "true" reality.

 

I don't know what to say about that. It's an interesting proposition and testable by someone who spends a lot of time at that threshold. Sadly that psychonaut is not me.

 

That said I've seen some badass beautiful mechanical looking geometric forms. Gorgeous colors of yellow gold and silver and platinum planes forming cubist ever morphing things that suggest life but are without life.

 

Go ahead. Try to digest that mess  :)

 

It took a large dose of refined cactus to get that vision.

 

And to Alders' point about being beyond an artists' ability to recreate it. Maybe not. I think with a ton of time and collaboration competent Photoshop video artists or graphics artists could reproduce the "image" of the image but it would be unaccompanied by the flood of whatever other hormones or neurotransmitter feel good chems that make the image so freakin' overwhelmingly beautiful to perceive. To me tripping is as much about "love" chems as anything visual or confusing.


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#9 Marleyahu

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Posted 27 December 2017 - 08:39 PM

Somebody here, can't remember who, posed that those geometric ever-morphing forms are just distractions thrown in our path by the "gatekeepers' of the alternate or true reality. Like challenges we have to overcome to getting our own minds right about what the true reality is. Or that by recognizing that they are just cheap distractions, like platinum blonde hair, we are finally able to ignore them and ease further into the discovery of the "true" reality.

 

I don't know what to say about that. It's an interesting proposition and testable by someone who spends a lot of time at that threshold. Sadly that psychonaut is not me.

 

This is a very cool explanation. I think the next time I eat 7 grams of mushrooms I'll be sure to try and overcome these great images I have grown to love to see if I can get to a different reality. Thus far the only way I have gotten to another reality was through DMT and these so called "gatekeepers" tried to keep me away for a long time until the last 2 times I had done it when they welcomed me right in. It was a very weird experience to say the least. 

 

I've seen geometric patterns and colors but I can't say I ever got close to this alternate reality on mushrooms but maybe I just haven't eaten enough. I do believe I'll be diving down that rabbit hole this weekend though!



#10 Skywatcher

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Posted 27 December 2017 - 10:46 PM

I'll offer another perspective, from my own unravelings. Not provable (what is), but as it was explained to me by Mescalito.

 

To me the teachers are sacred, and as such, they present themselves in sacred form. The geometric patterns are but one form revealed to me.

 

There is a perfection flawlessness in these geometric patterns.

 

Sacred Geometry, is a visualized pattern of all life and creation, in greatly simplified format. A diagram, if you will, of the most basic, perfect building blocks of all creation. The seed of life, the fibonacci spiral............................................................

 

The geometrics are of themself, teachings as well, in detail and form beyond our full comprehension in this state of being, but it is my belief that we do not need to fully understand to have learned or absorbed the teaching. 

 

I believed these intense geometric forms, evolving and morphing in intensity, while experienced in the deep states of ecstatic peak, to be God, as revealed in that instant. They become infinite, in as deeply and intensely you study and look into the depths of them, they continue as a fractal to ever evolve.

 

I also believe I do not have to understand or even place meaning, to simply be enthralled by the beauty. Appreciation without the need to dissect is one of my teachings, and i would imagine this to be true for all.


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#11 bennylava

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Posted 28 December 2017 - 12:14 AM

 


 

This is a very cool explanation. I think the next time I eat 7 grams of mushrooms I'll be sure to try and overcome these great images I have grown to love to see if I can get to a different reality. Thus far the only way I have gotten to another reality was through DMT and these so called "gatekeepers" tried to keep me away for a long time until the last 2 times I had done it when they welcomed me right in. It was a very weird experience to say the least. 

 

I've seen geometric patterns and colors but I can't say I ever got close to this alternate reality on mushrooms but maybe I just haven't eaten enough. I do believe I'll be diving down that rabbit hole this weekend though!

 

 

Reminds me of this vivid dream I had once. Lots of people were trying to walk by this grim reaper looking character that had a big mask on. Walking up a sloped, wide stairway towards this light. The grim reaper looking guy would swing his sythe at the people and they'd cry out as they were hurled back and out of the area. When I got there it just went straight through me like it had no substance and he said lightheartedly "Oh you can go on through". There's that nonchalant attitude of all these characters again. As if all this seemingly important stuff is just no big deal.



#12 Marleyahu

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Posted 28 December 2017 - 12:22 AM

This is almost how my DMT trip was except it wasn't a figure not allowing me through it was light not allowing me through. I was being blinded so not to see what was beyond the light until I persisted and it finally allowed me inside to this other realm of existance. If you haven't read it I made a post abiut this experience. Here is the link about my first experience. I haven't made one about my 2nd one yet but it seemed significantly easier to access this dimension the second time.

https://mycotopia.ne...s-i-talking-to/

Edited by Marleyahu, 28 December 2017 - 12:23 AM.


#13 bennylava

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Posted 28 December 2017 - 09:31 PM

This is almost how my DMT trip was except it wasn't a figure not allowing me through it was light not allowing me through. I was being blinded so not to see what was beyond the light until I persisted and it finally allowed me inside to this other realm of existance. If you haven't read it I made a post abiut this experience. Here is the link about my first experience. I haven't made one about my 2nd one yet but it seemed significantly easier to access this dimension the second time.

https://mycotopia.ne...s-i-talking-to/

 

Yes I remember that particular thread. Was there anything else there? Other DMT trip reports will often describe bizarre alien landscapes. Or some manner of scenery? Some people are so astonished by what they see, that they have to be told by whoever is there, to focus.

 

The actual death experiences, seem to be a lot more tame than DMT. I've done a lot of reading and just general research on NDE's. Primarily the ones where all brain activity stopped. That way, no one can say that it was just a hallucination generated by their brain. With zero brain activity, you are not capable of having a hallucination or dream of sorts, that is generated by the brain. It would be like asking a computer that is unplugged to start up Firefox and let you browse the web. Yet the people still had these experiences with a dead brain with no measureable activity.

 

There are even some that completely defy any medical explanation. Where as far as we can tell, a miracle happened and they came back to life. Where the brain had completely stopped functioning for way longer than it should be able to and still be started back up again. Something like 4 minutes without oxygen and its over. But there was one guy that was dead for 42 minutes and he miraculously recovered. And came back talking about this experience that he had while he was dead. Lots more people who were down for less time than that, but still had an unexplainable recovery. 15 minutes, 20 minutes, the numbers vary. And they'd report similar experiences.

 

So to get to the point, their experiences all seem a lot more tame than DMT to me. They'd report going to some lush landscape or perhaps a forrest, where all their friends and family were there. Mainly deceased relatives, who appeared young. If they were expecting a deity, it would be there. Depending on their religion. But there wasn't this wacked out, extremely strange and astonishing experience. Then again maybe that is what happens after they've been there awhile, and they're ready for it.



#14 Marleyahu

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Posted 31 December 2017 - 02:34 AM

 

This is almost how my DMT trip was except it wasn't a figure not allowing me through it was light not allowing me through. I was being blinded so not to see what was beyond the light until I persisted and it finally allowed me inside to this other realm of existance. If you haven't read it I made a post abiut this experience. Here is the link about my first experience. I haven't made one about my 2nd one yet but it seemed significantly easier to access this dimension the second time.

https://mycotopia.ne...s-i-talking-to/

 

Yes I remember that particular thread. Was there anything else there? Other DMT trip reports will often describe bizarre alien landscapes. Or some manner of scenery? Some people are so astonished by what they see, that they have to be told by whoever is there, to focus.

 

The actual death experiences, seem to be a lot more tame than DMT. I've done a lot of reading and just general research on NDE's. Primarily the ones where all brain activity stopped. That way, no one can say that it was just a hallucination generated by their brain. With zero brain activity, you are not capable of having a hallucination or dream of sorts, that is generated by the brain. It would be like asking a computer that is unplugged to start up Firefox and let you browse the web. Yet the people still had these experiences with a dead brain with no measureable activity.

 

There are even some that completely defy any medical explanation. Where as far as we can tell, a miracle happened and they came back to life. Where the brain had completely stopped functioning for way longer than it should be able to and still be started back up again. Something like 4 minutes without oxygen and its over. But there was one guy that was dead for 42 minutes and he miraculously recovered. And came back talking about this experience that he had while he was dead. Lots more people who were down for less time than that, but still had an unexplainable recovery. 15 minutes, 20 minutes, the numbers vary. And they'd report similar experiences.

 

So to get to the point, their experiences all seem a lot more tame than DMT to me. They'd report going to some lush landscape or perhaps a forrest, where all their friends and family were there. Mainly deceased relatives, who appeared young. If they were expecting a deity, it would be there. Depending on their religion. But there wasn't this wacked out, extremely strange and astonishing experience. Then again maybe that is what happens after they've been there awhile, and they're ready for it.

 

 

Sorry its taken me so long to respond to this. I honestly forgot about it until scrolling through the forums tonight. I would kind of relate it to what you were just talking about though, like a NDE. I can't say for sure because I haven't had a NDE but both of my DMT trips where I "broke through" as they say weren't these amazingly extravagant experiences with awesome geometrical patterns that everyone talks about and tiny little machine elves that run the world that Terrence Mckenna talked about. I saw geometrical patterns that no explanation I could ever give would do justice too yes but it wasn't until I came back from my breakthrough that I saw these patterns.

 

While I was with this other entity I was speaking with I was somewhere that resembled space like I said in my experiences thread. I was in that same place both times although the second time everything seemed brighter and I was there longer. I still didn't see the entity that I was speaking with though which I actually think I have the answer to now. I say have the answer too but it is simply an answer that helps me come to terms with what I met. It's nothing more than my theory on what I encountered.

 

From what you're describing as a NDE, I would say that when I had broken through to the other side it was even more tame than what those people who had NDE's encountered are describing, but when I came back it was much less tame. Geometrical patterns everywhere, noises that sounded like a CD skipping extremely fast for at least a few minutes but felt like forever and then when it did calm down enough that the noises went away I still found it hard to focus on anything and understand it or even say something coherently for the next 5 minutes while coming down. 

 

On a time scale according to my babysitter at the time, my 2nd visit went,

 

30 Seconds in starting to travel to space

 

1 minute in he said my eyes were completely shut and he thought I was sleeping. I assumed that was when I arrived at the entities doorstep

 

He told me my eyes were shut until around 8 minutes and I'm assuming this is when I was talking to the entity

 

I started making noises again shortly there after 8 minutes which is when I assume I was coming back to my body

 

I gave a thumbs up that the CD skipping had stopped after opening my eyes around 9 minutes and that was when tried to start writing down the experience. Had to make corrections after coming back to baseline. 

 

At 14 minutes I was able to actually speak coherently 

 

I was completely done hallucinating and back to baseline at 21 minutes.

 

This was the longest I had ever tripped on DMT before. 

 

I think after writing this down I will make that trip report I was talking about. Use this timescale as an outline. I understand the connection between your NDE talk because a lot of people think that DMT is released in the brain after death and that makes sense as to why you focus on the ones where brain activity ceased completely but all I can really do is talk about my side of the experiences and can't compare it to any NDE's because I have never had one. I sure hope I never have the experiences to make any comparisons between the 2 either!

 

Thanks for the great conversation and enticing me to make my 2nd DMT trip report.



#15 tailsmcsnails

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Posted 01 January 2018 - 06:56 PM

Any sort of explanation for this? I've seen them, they were there on my most recent big trip. When I'd close my eyes, I could see all those geometric shapes and patterns and fractals that everyone always talks about. And that so many artists who have tripped, have created images of for us to view when sober. So while looking at them, I figured I'd try and understand it. Because I go to these places to learn. I thought I'd try to see what this part of psychedellics was all about. Couldn't figure anything out. They just sort of sit there, moving and changing. But somehow not moving or changing.

 

Is there any word on what they are, or what they are for? I finally gave up and just didn't find them very interesting. Its like yeah, they are there, but I'm not sure what I'm supposed to do with this. Paying attention to them didn't really get me anywhere, or teach me anything. At least not that I know of. I finally just wrote them off and opened my eyes and basically ignored them, because I didn't know anything about them or what should be done with them, if anything.

 

So does anyone have any idea on what they are, or what they're about?

 

A parable, if I may.  I went to a counsellor once, because my ex would push and push and push my buttons, until I lost my shit and went berserk.  Of course, once I went berserk, he had "won".  Counsellor taught me a trick.  She explained that we have a rational, adult brain, and an instinctive, lizard monkey brain.  When I could feel my rage building, ask myself "Which brain am I using now"- the answer didn't matter.  Just asking the gramatically framed question would tip me back into using my adult/rational brain and short circuit the rage,  She was right, it worked, and I never lost my shit again.

 

Reading this, all I could think is that if you can ask these questions, framed like that, while you're in the experience- you're not taking enough.  You are in the way, all the way.

 

"I'm shown all this senseless beauty but can't figure out what it's for so I'm going to ignore it" doesn't seem like you are swimming with the current, but struggling for no good reason.

 

Not lecturing or judging, but I guess imagining what I would tell me if I said such things.


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#16 Marleyahu

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Posted 02 January 2018 - 07:37 PM

A parable, if I may.  I went to a counsellor once, because my ex would push and push and push my buttons, until I lost my shit and went berserk.  Of course, once I went berserk, he had "won".  Counsellor taught me a trick.  She explained that we have a rational, adult brain, and an instinctive, lizard monkey brain.  When I could feel my rage building, ask myself "Which brain am I using now"- the answer didn't matter.  Just asking the gramatically framed question would tip me back into using my adult/rational brain and short circuit the rage,  She was right, it worked, and I never lost my shit again.

 

Reading this, all I could think is that if you can ask these questions, framed like that, while you're in the experience- you're not taking enough.  You are in the way, all the way.

"I'm shown all this senseless beauty but can't figure out what it's for so I'm going to ignore it" doesn't seem like you are swimming with the current, but struggling for no good reason.

 

Not lecturing or judging, but I guess imagining what I would tell me if I said such things.

 

So you yourself don't like to speculate on what these types of things are during or after your trip? You just like to "swim with the current" as you've said. I understand the want to just relax and enjoy the visuals but I also enjoy questioning the things that I have seen. Not trying to be rude by any means Im just curious to know if you ever do think anything about these types of visuals or even the feelings that you have while on these substances



#17 tailsmcsnails

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Posted 03 January 2018 - 12:04 AM

A parable, if I may. I went to a counsellor once, because my ex would push and push and push my buttons, until I lost my shit and went berserk. Of course, once I went berserk, he had "won". Counsellor taught me a trick. She explained that we have a rational, adult brain, and an instinctive, lizard monkey brain. When I could feel my rage building, ask myself "Which brain am I using now"- the answer didn't matter. Just asking the gramatically framed question would tip me back into using my adult/rational brain and short circuit the rage, She was right, it worked, and I never lost my shit again.

Reading this, all I could think is that if you can ask these questions, framed like that, while you're in the experience- you're not taking enough. You are in the way, all the way.
"I'm shown all this senseless beauty but can't figure out what it's for so I'm going to ignore it" doesn't seem like you are swimming with the current, but struggling for no good reason.

Not lecturing or judging, but I guess imagining what I would tell me if I said such things.


So you yourself don't like to speculate on what these types of things are during or after your trip? You just like to "swim with the current" as you've said. I understand the want to just relax and enjoy the visuals but I also enjoy questioning the things that I have seen. Not trying to be rude by any means Im just curious to know if you ever do think anything about these types of visuals or even the feelings that you have while on these substances
Nothing about tripping for me is relaxing or what i would consider recreational, i usually describe it as 'hard'. If you are interested I have written up a few trip.reports here. Other trips did not translate well, so were unsharable.

Anyway, I have thought a lot about the visuals associated with mushrooms, dmt and acid, and qiestioned and conversed with the intelligences one meets 'out there' about them. I guess what i mean is that we may as well ask what our existence means, as what they do, because I think the visuals existed first.

I still think you maybe need to take more
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#18 Marleyahu

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Posted 03 January 2018 - 12:29 AM

I think it is very relaxing to trip. It is always very enlightening for me and it helps me a lot with my depression. More so when I do mushrooms or acid though. DMT isnt really relaxing but it does still seem to still help with my depression. Do you mean take more DMT as in do more at once? Or continue to do it more often. I made another trip report after this one. It seemed to be quite similar when I blasted off. I went to the same place and spoke to the same type of being but this time I questioned more. I did a little less than half a gram of DMT my second time and that is a pretty big dosage. It was the longest DMT trip I've ever had.

https://mycotopia.ne...-been-in-space/

That is the link to the trip report for it if you want to read it. After that trip I began to question weather or not this thing was actually another being or just something I fathomed up in my head tof comort myself. It is all in there thought if you want to read it. I have done a lot of DMT though as well as a lot of other hallucinogens these were just the 2 times that I actually did a large enough dose to actually have an out of body experience. I've always been a little timid to do a bunch at once until recently. However I think after my last trip I am going to be done for a while with DMT though. Not that I'm afraid to or anything j just think I need to stew on this and take a little break for a bit. Focus on my other hallucinogens.

Asking what our existance means is something I do to myself all the time as well though. I just like thinking about this kind of stuff. Especially while hallucinating. I'd like to read your trip report if you would send the link.

#19 tailsmcsnails

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Posted 03 January 2018 - 03:25 AM

I think it is very relaxing to trip. It is always very enlightening for me and it helps me a lot with my depression. More so when I do mushrooms or acid though. DMT isnt really relaxing but it does still seem to still help with my depression. Do you mean take more DMT as in do more at once? Or continue to do it more often. I made another trip report after this one. It seemed to be quite similar when I blasted off. I went to the same place and spoke to the same type of being but this time I questioned more. I did a little less than half a gram of DMT my second time and that is a pretty big dosage. It was the longest DMT trip I've ever had.

https://mycotopia.ne...-been-in-space/

That is the link to the trip report for it if you want to read it. After that trip I began to question weather or not this thing was actually another being or just something I fathomed up in my head tof comort myself. It is all in there thought if you want to read it. I have done a lot of DMT though as well as a lot of other hallucinogens these were just the 2 times that I actually did a large enough dose to actually have an out of body experience. I've always been a little timid to do a bunch at once until recently. However I think after my last trip I am going to be done for a while with DMT though. Not that I'm afraid to or anything j just think I need to stew on this and take a little break for a bit. Focus on my other hallucinogens.

Asking what our existance means is something I do to myself all the time as well though. I just like thinking about this kind of stuff. Especially while hallucinating. I'd like to read your trip report if you would send the link.

I actually thought we were talking about mushrooms (do more)... My attention span is oh look a bird!

If you look at my profile on here i think my posts are linked from there?

#20 Marleyahu

Marleyahu

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Posted 03 January 2018 - 08:29 AM

Haha. Well @Bennylava was at first but I kind of highjacked his thread I guess and brought up my DMT experiences. If I have an out of body experience as crazy as the one I had on DMT on mushrooms I would say I ate a shit load of mushrooms.

I'll be sure to get on and read your trip report though.

Edited by Marleyahu, 03 January 2018 - 08:32 AM.





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