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Unfettered Capitalism


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#1 Alder Logs

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Posted 01 June 2018 - 10:27 AM

Economic Update

 

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#2 onediadem

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Posted 01 June 2018 - 06:24 PM

I am not an economics major, so excuse my lack of knowledge. I have a question..

 

If I open a business, how does this work? Are they talking privately owned businesses or government-owned business? I am little confused about the 20 dollars an hour pay and 5 dollars an hour profit. If it supposed to go back into things that benefit the people, wouldn't that be government owned profit? Sorry, I got lost in that. 



#3 Alder Logs

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Posted 01 June 2018 - 06:54 PM

He's only saying, "if."    In our unfettered version of capitalism (unfettered for only the corporate rich) the foxes are running the chicken house.   For the most part, Richard Wolff would like to see worker own coops as the main business model, where the workplace is more of a democracy, and all the workers have a say in how the business would be run.  There are great examples of such businesses being quite successful.  But of course, starting any business where one is in competition with giant corporations with their lobbies in Washington, DC, you aren't going to have much of a chance.  

 

If you open an business, it better be one where you are unique.   As soon as you are a blip on the radar screen, the big money will be there soon to buy you out.   Then they will do whatever it takes to make profit the only end that matters.    We live under a corporatized government, which is exactly how Fascism's founder, Benito Mussolini, defined Fascism.   Your business will not get to operate in the "unfettered" field of play.   Fetters will likely be an issue from the start.   Success in business these days is when you get to sell out what you've created and go do something new.  


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#4 onediadem

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Posted 01 June 2018 - 07:29 PM

Ahhh. I must have missed the co-op part. That makes a lot more sense now. Thank you Alder!



#5 pharmer

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Posted 01 June 2018 - 07:45 PM

ooooooooooooh, you're getting closer Alder

 

We live under a corporatized government, which is exactly how Fascism's founder, Benito Mussolini, defined Fascism.   Your business will not get to operate in the "unfettered" field of play.

 

Why is it that you can understand the definition of Facism but keep defining facism as unfettered Capitalism?????

 

Big business, as in big enough to influence government and in bed with government at the same time is not Capitalism. Capitalism, as defined by capitalists and not closeted Socialists, is little people conducting business doing their best to stay out of the great eye of Sauron on the Potomac hopefully making enough honest dollars to expand into middle size busineses and actually accumulate some capital to re-invest or spend as they please EXCEPT IN BUYING FAVOR FROM THE GOVERNMENT AT WHICH POINT THEY ARE NOT CAPITALISTS ANYMORE

 

^^^^^^^ That is the definition capitalists like me use to define ourselves. But nobody wants to know what we think or say. They want to stay with the mantra. I suppose because it feels good to do so. But so does banging somebody else's wife until you get caught or get a guilty conscience - or so I'm told.


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#6 Alder Logs

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Posted 03 June 2018 - 12:36 PM

In the interest of doing some fettering:

 

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#7 Alder Logs

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Posted 13 June 2018 - 10:13 AM

So, once a capitalist takes advantage of any cooperative venture organized through any kind of governmental action, it is no longer capitalism?   Want to sell your wares?  Cool, build the infrastructure to move your product to its purchasers.   Hire protection to keep away thieves and fire.   Will the Pinkertons do a better job of protection than the cops?   Is the so-called private sector less affected by corrupting pressures?  

 

How long will any "honest dollar" stay honest, whether self-regulated, or under the scrutiny of a mutually appointed panel?   When there are no limits on the acquisition of capital, and hence, its power to affect the markets through which it's raised, how long does any market remain free and equitable?  

 

Just as this world cannot have a pure communism, it will never have any fair capitalism.   Whether the regulation of the economy comes from the players or the population at large, capital must be regulated or we will see exactly what we have now; a market regulated by the winners in a market, for the benefit of the winners who compete in a market. 

 

It is much as Mort Saul said so many years ago, and I have never forgotten: 

 

Government:

of the people,

by the corporations,

for the rich.  

 

So, who was that Marx guy?   What did he really say?   Why don't most of us know?

 

 

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Edited by Alder Logs, 13 June 2018 - 02:36 PM.

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#8 August West

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Posted 13 June 2018 - 09:22 PM

So, who was that Marx guy?   What did he really say?   Why don't most of us know?

 

 

A lot of people are busy trying to make ends meet. A lot of people aren't very deep thinkers. A lot of people just don't care. Government school doesn't really care that you learn anything about economics ('else you may realize schooling is bad economics). Most people don't know anything about any economics - Keynes, Austrian (not the country), Marxist or otherwise. If you want to learn about Marx, you have to be intrinsically motivated...just like pretty much every other subject.

 

Have you studied Marx? I have - a little. A very little. He doesn't always seem to be a clear thinker. In what little I've studies, his social critique (class, capitalism) is valuable. His economics, not so much. Anecdotally, he didn't really like working class people and had a capitalist benefactor.



#9 Alder Logs

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Posted 13 June 2018 - 09:32 PM

Did you listen to the lecture? 



#10 August West

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Posted 13 June 2018 - 10:32 PM

Nope. Listened to a bit of the first one you posted but not that last one.


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#11 guyakaguy

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Posted 14 June 2018 - 06:09 AM

I like Richard Wolff's lectures and his Economic Update program. He takes different points from Marx's Das Kapital and applies them to modern economic issues. He also uses it, along with his own extensive economic knowledge, to critique what most of us like to call capitalism (it's actually fascism wearing the mask of capitalism). There aren't nearly enough people critiquing "capitalism" nowadays - or really at any point in the modern era.

Marx's economic ideas were, at the time (mid-1800s), at least a little bit more hypothetical, if not tongue-in-cheek in my opinion, but it amazes me how some aspects of all 5 volumes of Das Kapital apply to our current economic situation. It's like it took some of us over 150 years to realize that Marx did have a point, as well as a relevant critique of "capitalism".
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#12 Alder Logs

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Posted 14 June 2018 - 09:13 AM

Part of that lecture is Richard Wolff's pathway to becoming the Marxian economist he is.   It was much like how Howard Zinn became the historian he is, trying to learn inside a curriculum that didn't teach the parts he wanted to specialize in, like in Zinn's case, what happened, and in Wolff's case, Karl who?  Verboten!

 

I found that part of RW's lecture to be most important to why we're in the situation with this capital thing being the ruling factor in American life.   It's so much a knee-jerk reaction to the New Deal by to powers of capital.   What needs to be seen is that capital hasn't done itself any favors by blindfolding the masses is seeks to exploit, as it has, in doing that, blindfolded itself and everyone to its own cancerous behavior.   Elevating the monetary unit above human needs and values is akin to a parasite killing its host organism. 



#13 Alder Logs

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Posted 08 July 2018 - 03:56 PM

Richard Wolff with Chris Hedges: The Coming Collapse of the American Economic System

 

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#14 GORF

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Posted 11 July 2018 - 07:44 AM

Doomed we all are

My future was doomed in the 60s by nuclear war, in the 70s by global cooling and mass famine.
In the 80s it was ozone depletion, in the 90s it was globalist in the 00s it was terrorism and drugs
Now its nazis and slavery again.

I guess eventually it will get me and make me dead. :)

#15 Alder Logs

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Posted 11 July 2018 - 10:00 AM

Political reality is important, but it is not the only, or ultimate, reality.



#16 Alder Logs

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Posted 29 August 2018 - 11:31 AM

Is it time to stop letting unfettered capitalists define socialism?

 

 

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#17 Alder Logs

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Posted 04 September 2018 - 09:56 AM

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#18 Alder Logs

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Posted 22 October 2018 - 11:14 PM

Richard Wolff takes on Jordan B. Peterson


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#19 Alder Logs

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Posted 27 October 2018 - 12:48 PM

I think this contains excellent analysis.

 

 

Richard D. Wolff Interviewed by Abby Martin

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#20 TVCasualty

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Posted 29 October 2018 - 07:12 PM

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