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Help with fruiting


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#1 TheArchangel

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Posted 31 December 2018 - 10:50 PM

Hi,
 
I was wondering if you could give me some little info about the next step with this project.
I have three (24oz) 5-grain Jars that are 96-99% colonized and 6 pf tek jars that are about 65% colonized.
When the 5-grain jars are fully colonized, do I have to birth them, break them to tiny pieces and mix with a casing mix (Coco Coir, Vermiculite, Hydrated Lime, Gypsum, ph buffers, ph stabilizers, mineral water.....casing mix content) I got  so they can fruit whenever they're ready? Or Can they be treated like normal pf tek jars whether by letting fruit in-vitro or birth then wait for fruiting etc?
 
I got one or two other questions but may be best to wait for some clarification.
 
Thx

Edited by TheArchangel, 31 December 2018 - 10:53 PM.


#2 MysticalMyco

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Posted 01 January 2019 - 06:23 AM

Are you saying 5 grain jars that are just simply 100% colonized jars of whole grain that are not blended into a powder?

If so there are many ways to do that. Most people, like me, break them up and put mix them up and put them into a pasturized substrate. Let them colonized the substrate and then begin fruiting conditions. If your clean in you technique and keep the soil fairly hydrated you should get no less then 3 flushes (harvests). It's up to you of you case with this method. I don't case but many do.

The other viable way if you used wide mouth jars is kinda like the last steps of PF Tek. You birth the whole colony of mycellium and put a semi-thick casing layer. Coco Coir/vermiculite are good for this because the mycellium would tear through that causing growth.

In either regard you will know they are about to pop off and pin once you see a bunch of there tiny white bumps call knots. Once you see those your more then likely gonna succeed.

Good Luck.
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#3 Deleena24

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Posted 01 January 2019 - 11:38 AM


Hi,

I was wondering if you could give me some little info about the next step with this project.
I have three (24oz) 5-grain Jars that are 96-99% colonized and 6 pf tek jars that are about 65% colonized.
When the 5-grain jars are fully colonized, do I have to birth them, break them to tiny pieces and mix with a casing mix (Coco Coir, Vermiculite, Hydrated Lime, Gypsum, ph buffers, ph stabilizers, mineral water.....casing mix content) I got so they can fruit whenever they're ready? Or Can they be treated like normal pf tek jars whether by letting fruit in-vitro or birth then wait for fruiting etc?

I got one or two other questions but may be best to wait for some clarification.

Thx


When you say casing mix I am going to assume you mean bulk substrate.

#4 TheArchangel

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Posted 01 January 2019 - 01:59 PM

Thanks for the replies.

These are the three jars in question. I have not seen any more mycelium growth after about 7 days, and in the past 2 weeks what very little they've grown has been slow. So I think it's time to move to the next step with them.

I'm thinking to birth them, break them up and mix them with the bulk substrate I got, picture attached. It contains Coco Coir, Vermiculite, Hydrated Lime, Gypsum, ph buffers, ph stabilizers, mineral water.

I plan to use some baking containers that are 15.5"x11"x2.5". I'll put a layer of substrate on the bottom, put the chopped mycelium on top then add a second layer of substrate. It'll be fruiting in the martha and was wondering if I had to spray the container with water once finished prepping or if just keeping the inside of the martha at about 85-90% humidity is fine.

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#5 MysticalMyco

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Posted 01 January 2019 - 02:30 PM

Jars 1 & 3 appear contaminated, definitely #3. Looks like a black pin set type mold. Unless there is some weird shadow cast on that jar I'd be carful with those.

With very few exceptions "If it ain't white it ain't right". Yellowing & Bluing are exceptions. The colors that should raise your eyebrows are green, grey, black, brown.

Double check those and report back.

Good luck
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#6 MysticalMyco

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Posted 01 January 2019 - 02:31 PM

Jar 1 may just be moisture but it looks like there is one pitch black grain in the middle towards the top.

#7 Deleena24

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Posted 01 January 2019 - 02:44 PM

Although your method seems fine, I would highly advise against spawning grain that isn't 100% colonized.

If they have really stalled, as you think, give them a nice shake. If they don't recover within a couple days, you will have your proof of contamination, whether it was bacterial or fungal. You wont have wasted good supplies and time on a project destined for failure.

If the mycelium recovers, which it may, then you know it wasnt a contamination, and all it took was a little patience and no wasted effort. The grain in those jars come packed really tight, that might be a reason they slowed.

I've bought those same exact jars before (the company is in the midwest, right?), and I know shaking is hard. You need to bang the shit out of them on a tire or thick rubber soled boot from multiple angles, side to side and both the tops and bottoms need to be hit,but it will eventually break up enough to mix some colonized grain into those uncolonized areas. Make sure you keep checking the lid is staying on tight, I've had one almost come off during this process.

Btw that 5 grain mix is just WBS. I bought them before I knew better. Nothing wrong with em, LOL just overpriced and overstuffed, which makes colonization slow.

Edited by Deleena24, 01 January 2019 - 02:48 PM.


#8 Deleena24

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Posted 01 January 2019 - 03:02 PM

Trust me on this, As you can see, I have experience with these jars.

I bought them before I got my cheap PC and discovered a much better myco supply site. PM me if you want to know which one.

I ended up using all of them except 3 for sclerotia, since the cubes took FOREVER to colonize them without a shake, and even with a shake took at least double the time of any other of my spawn

The Mexicanas took 10 weeks to fully colonize without a shake, which I didnt do to half of them bc there were already stones the size of silver dollars. The other half, which I beat the crap out of after week 6, colonized the rest of the jar within 3 days of doing so, and then started producing stones like crazy.

I even asked customer service to only fill the jars 3/4 or even 2/3 and leave space at the top so I can shake them. They didn't do it on any order. They all came PACKED to the rim.

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#9 TheArchangel

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Posted 01 January 2019 - 08:40 PM

The black spots are part of the mix ingredients, no problem there.

I just shook the hell out of it and it broke off all over. I can see now that there was a huge amount that was not colonized.

I was thinking to discard the non-colonized portions had I chose to go that route but now I prefer to wait since this jar is far behind and hope for the best.

Deleena24 I had a feeling you knew these jars. I'll send you a PM, thx.



#10 PJammer24

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Posted 01 January 2019 - 08:56 PM

The black spots are part of the mix ingredients, no problem there.
I just shook the hell out of it and it broke off all over. I can see now that there was a huge amount that was not colonized.
I was thinking to discard the non-colonized portions had I chose to go that route but now I prefer to wait since this jar is far behind and hope for the best.
Deleena24 I had a feeling you knew these jars. I'll send you a PM, thx.


Trying to discard parts of a jar that didn’t fully colonize is asking for trouble... they usually don’t finish because their is a contaminate and you are just going to introduce the contam, usually bacteria, to your substrate...

I shake my jars after I see a decent amount of growth and not just when they seem slow... they colonize faster that way.

Good luck!!


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#11 jkdeth

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Posted 01 January 2019 - 09:07 PM

I agree with the other thoughts here. Jars 1 and 3 are likely bacterial. If you've managed a shake, Give it some time. Mycelium can win against bacteria, but I wouldn't spawn unless it does fully colonize. If they don't recover from the shake, the myc lost and probably would have if you'd spawned it.
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#12 TheArchangel

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Posted 02 January 2019 - 01:07 AM

Here are pictures of a jar I just inoculated. There are some black seeds of some kind and other smaller black grains of some sort that is what you are mistaking for contamination. I thought the same when I first noticed it when the jars were about 35% colonized as it alarming when you see it on the white mycelium. Also the pictures may not look the greatest but these jars look real nice with a very whitish clean looking mycelium.

Thanks for the advises. I'm trying to learn this.

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Edited by TheArchangel, 02 January 2019 - 01:07 AM.


#13 jkdeth

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Posted 02 January 2019 - 02:14 AM

Understood. I wasn't going by black seeds though.
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#14 MysticalMyco

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Posted 02 January 2019 - 04:58 PM

Most people clean those sunflower seeds out. Some people dont. If you wish to remove them in the future rinse your grains in large pot, open pressure cooker, or a 5 gallon bucket. When you rinse all the funk floats to the top including bugs, grass, dirt, and sunflower seeds. Bird seed should always be rinsed anyway and that when most people remove the sunflower seeds.

Edited by MysticalMyco, 02 January 2019 - 04:58 PM.


#15 Deleena24

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Posted 02 January 2019 - 05:05 PM

Most people clean those sunflower seeds out. Some people dont. If you wish to remove them in the future rinse your grains in large pot, open pressure cooker, or a 5 gallon bucket. When you rinse all the funk floats to the top including bugs, grass, dirt, and sunflower seeds. Bird seed should always be rinsed anyway and that when most people remove the sunflower seeds.


Those were bought pre sterilized from a website.

#16 MysticalMyco

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Posted 02 January 2019 - 05:14 PM

Oh shit I missed that. Yea disregard last statement.

#17 Deleena24

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Posted 02 January 2019 - 05:26 PM

The black spots are part of the mix ingredients, no problem there.
I just shook the hell out of it and it broke off all over. I can see now that there was a huge amount that was not colonized.
I was thinking to discard the non-colonized portions had I chose to go that route but now I prefer to wait since this jar is far behind and hope for the best.
Deleena24 I had a feeling you knew these jars. I'll send you a PM, thx.

Trying to discard parts of a jar that didn’t fully colonize is asking for trouble... they usually don’t finish because their is a contaminate and you are just going to introduce the contam, usually bacteria, to your substrate...

I shake my jars after I see a decent amount of growth and not just when they seem slow... they colonize faster that way.

Good luck!!


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
I generally shake at about 20% myself for cubes, but they generally say not to shake once stones are formed in Mexicanas, so I tried not to. Some people, including Stonesun, dont shake their stone producers at all anymore, and say it sometimes stalls healthy uncontaminated spawn.

For the cubes, I waited to shake bc I thought it might not be possible because of how damn tight they were packpacked.

I eventually got so frustrated I just had to try, and it was hard as hell.

I definitely dont recommend the company, but the widemouth quart jars with straight sides all the way up are really nice. I searched and ordered a case of them LOL.

Edited by Deleena24, 02 January 2019 - 05:27 PM.


#18 PJammer24

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Posted 03 January 2019 - 03:37 PM

I have been told that the sunflower seeds increase risk contamination, possibly in the same way as unchopped straw, and that it is best to strain them out... I did that for a while... Then I said to hell with it, started leaving them in, and have seen very little difference if any...


Edited by PJammer24, 03 January 2019 - 03:39 PM.

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#19 TheArchangel

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Posted 03 January 2019 - 03:54 PM

Understood. I wasn't going by black seeds though.

 

What were you referring to bud?

 

 


I definitely dont recommend the company, but the widemouth quart jars with straight sides all the way up are really nice. I searched and ordered a case of them LOL.

 

Can one re-use these jar lids Deleena24? Some of them look a little rusted.



#20 Deleena24

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Posted 03 January 2019 - 04:01 PM

Once, maybe twice, then they're too rusty to hold a seal with any confidence, and the filterdisk loses its integrity.

But yes once shouldn't give you any problems.




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