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Study hints at modulating influence of secondary compounds in mushrooms vs pure psilocybin


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#1 Samwise

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Posted 14 April 2019 - 06:45 PM

An interesting study I'd not seen before now, thank you to Don Shadow for bringing this to my attention. I thought it may be of interest to others and so worthy of sharing.

 

Study:

 

Matshushima, Y., Shirota, O., Kikura-Hanajiri, R., Gosa, Y. & Eguchi, F. et al. (2009) Effects of Psilocybe argentipes on Marble-Burying Behaviour in Mice. Bioscience, Biotechnology, and Biochemistry, 73,8: 1866-8.

 

https://pdfs.semanticscholar.org/27db/ba7610194971742f8adf5a8dde8e3b06addb.pdf?fbclid=IwAR2ld6CQCuz3ax1mDPe4qO8sstDrMyrrS92AUiUy6eN4u7tEmIX0r5mvkBQ

 

Abstract

 

Psilocybe argentipes is a hallucinogenic mushroom. The present study examined the effects of P. argentipes on marble-burying behavior, which is considered an animal model of obsessive-compulsive disorder. P. argentipes significantly inhibited marble-burying behavior without affecting locomotor activity as compared with the same dose of authentic psilocybin. These findings suggest that P. argentipes would be efficient in clinical obsessive-compulsive disorder therapy.

 

...we obviously need to be cautious when attempting to extrapolate and infer from animal model studies (in this case an animal model of OCD), but I thought this was quite an interesting finding:

 

"In the experiments, when mice consumed P. subcaerulipes, it significantly inhibited their marble-burying behavior, but, unlike an equivalent dose of purified psilocybin, did not affect locomotor activity. Further, the mushroom was more effective than purified psilocybin in inhibiting the behavior, and lower doses were required. Based on these results, the authors suggest that the mushroom has the potential "to be efficient in clinical obsessive-compulsive disorder therapy".

 

This is at the very least suggestive that there could be secondary compounds in the mushroom that modulate or synergise with the psilocybin in mushrooms to some degree, beneficially in this case (even if it is the presence of psilocybin/serotonin precursors in the mushroom) and these compounds may be lacking when ingesting pure synthetic psilocybin. Much of the psilocybin mushroom potency data is out of date, and more research on the potential modulating influence of secondary compounds found in mushrooms (such as baeocystin/norbaeocystin and others) is certainly warranted.


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#2 TVCasualty

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Posted 15 April 2019 - 09:54 AM

I'd say that it's definitely the case that 'secondary' compounds found in mushrooms have an effect on the overall experience.

 

If that were not the case then tripping on one psilocybian species would be the same as tripping on another (at equivalent doses adjusted for relative potency). But anyone who has tripped on more than one species knows that that's not how it works in practice.

 

I would be very interested in trying a pure extract of baeocystin and/or norbaeocystin.


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#3 Samwise

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Posted 15 April 2019 - 12:09 PM

I'd say that it's definitely the case that 'secondary' compounds found in mushrooms have an effect on the overall experience.

 

If that were not the case then tripping on one psilocybian species would be the same as tripping on another (at equivalent doses adjusted for relative potency). But anyone who has tripped on more than one species knows that that's not how it works in practice.

 

I would be very interested in trying a pure extract of baeocystin and/or norbaeocystin.

 

I share this view, and it resonates with my own experiences, and those of many others on here and elsewhere. I was intrigued to learn recently that with regard psychedelic effect, mycologist Alan Rockefeller views all mushroom species as the same, that it's all purely down to psilocybin and it's all just external set an setting factors that give rise to perceived differences in experiential qualities between species. However in my experience, these differences are highly consistent and transcend set and setting factors. There is quite a marked difference between all the species I have sampled...take P. cubensis and Panaeolus cyanescens...these reliably induce quite distinct and consistent differences in effect for me. I can only assume Alan's views are based on a lack of experience of sampling the various species (ethnobotanist Kathleen Harrison and the Mazatec maintain there are differences between species, and I would consider them more informed authorities on psilocybin mushroom phenomenology).

 

But yes I too would be very interested to bioassay some baeocystin or norbaeocystin...speaking to LSD expert Dr David Nichols, he said it has different receptor affinities to psilocin, so it will likely produce its own effect, and it likely modulates the psilocin experience to some degree.


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#4 SteampunkScientist

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Posted 15 April 2019 - 02:41 PM

Different Species, Different Trips have been my experience as well - heck, different grows of the same species even, albeit more subtle.


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#5 Alder Logs

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Posted 15 April 2019 - 04:01 PM

When are two sets of sets and settings the same?


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#6 SteampunkScientist

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Posted 15 April 2019 - 04:54 PM

When are two sets of sets and settings the same?


Good point.

#7 TVCasualty

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Posted 16 April 2019 - 08:23 AM

When are two sets of sets and settings the same?

 

 

When you're cross-eyed. And maybe not even then...


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#8 Alder Logs

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Posted 16 April 2019 - 11:43 AM

If the train pulls out of the station at a different time, even it you are in the same seat, it's a different trip.






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