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#1 stoogie

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Posted 09 September 2019 - 12:53 PM

Hello people, 

 

Have been wondering about doing an LED grow, surprised that searching did produce masses of results from the forum with all sorts of info - have i missed any good threads? Have done some google searching but to get some basic info but if anyone can recommend any good sources of websites, books or films that would be great. Understand there is a bit of a divide on going LED but the idea of less heat and less electric sounds like a deal breaker. What sort of temp would the tent run at if it was in a 12-15c environment, would it need a heater in there too? Thinking of setting up a small sized tent to do up to 4 plants. Again any suggestions or ideas are very much appreciated. 



#2 Spark

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Posted 21 October 2019 - 09:49 AM

mars hydro


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#3 Shroomn

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Posted 10 January 2020 - 08:09 PM

I have built many custom led arrays for my saltwater aquariums and indoor tomato plants - lol - I'm actually serious, tomatoes.  The heat off an led build is fractional compared to halogen, for instance.  I know, used them both.  You just need a good heat-sink and a fan or two for the intensity it appears you are seeking.  There's a lot to consider, so I would recommend taking a look at Rapid LED.  Bought all my led supplies there, and their focus is in line with what I think you are trying to accomplish.

 

Many growers are now moving to full spectrum COB leds.  You would need 2 - 4 of these per plant.  I have a couple that run about 30w per bulb, that's it!  They radiate heat at ~90F, not too much different than your desired temp?  There are also a ton of great pre built led lights on ebay and amazon.  Blue is for growth, red is for flowering, you need UV, etc.  But again, as the tech. is evolving, full spectrum COBs are very popular.



#4 dpwishy

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Posted 15 January 2020 - 08:33 PM

I switched from hps to LED. I wish i went sooner. I run 2 gavita 1700e's and I absolutely love them. Another light I was looking at was the fluence spydr 2i, but there is a 50 day lead time after payment to get it built. Thats the main reason I went with the 1700e's, both are comparable in strength and efficiency. Dont go by the company claiming this light compares to a 600 or 1000 watt hps, go by how many watts it draws from the wall. You will see most draw 100-250. A true 1000 watt hps replacement will be 600+ at wall watts

It's a whole different ball game, kinda gotta relearn a lot of stuff. Grow temps need to be higher, 85f with humidity around 75-80% to stay inside vapor pressure deficit. These are wacky numbers for hps growing. Also the lights cant be used without c02, it's just to much light for a plant and they wont be able to handle the par without c02.

The advantage is electricity. I'm running higher par than a 1000 watt hps, but only using 680 watts at wall per light/ My cost to run 2 of these lights in a 5x9 on a 20 hour on schedule, a ac running 20 hours a day, heater coming on for the other 4. 2 humidifiers, a dehumidifier, exhaust fan and scrubber, 3 circulating fans, c02 controller and environment/light controller and the electricity for it all is only 100 us dollars every 30 days.


Edited by dpwishy, 15 January 2020 - 08:39 PM.

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#5 Shroomn

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Posted 15 January 2020 - 09:22 PM

Damn impressive, dp!  You got it.  Wish I lived next door.   :victorious:



#6 Sicshroom

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Posted 19 January 2020 - 08:23 AM

LEDs have been my shit for 7 or 8 years, the heat is very controllable as you see here I have 3 sets of lights a 150w on top a 300w in the middle and an led shop light for things that like less intense light on the bottom. When I water twice a week i leave one corner of the tent open to vent humidity but my temps have never gone above 90. In the tent with the lights I have 200 invested and I've been using this set up for 3 years now. I can't grow mj right now due to renting and living in a urban environment, to many factors to list that cause me anxiety but check out the growth of my cacti in my sic cacti thread and you can see a grow log send me a p.m. and I'll send you more photos if you like. But LEDs are great

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#7 dpwishy

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Posted 19 January 2020 - 12:40 PM

I still need to run an ac while lights are on even in winter with LED to maintain the right temps. They do give off heat for sure, and you will still need to have some sort of hvac system if you want to keep things in the right range. There is about a 30-40% saving in hvac compared to hps but you will still need to provide it if you are trying to maintain the right temps. My lights start to auto dim when they reach 90F, before I had my ac system dialed in, they were self dimming almost daily, so they can produce some pretty intense heat and go to far if not checked.


Edited by dpwishy, 19 January 2020 - 12:41 PM.

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#8 el_ronhub_bird

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Posted 31 January 2020 - 04:49 PM

So this is my first foray into growing with LED lighting. These plants are a week into flower and have been under this light for a total of 3 weeks. That means they only took 2 weeks to veg under this thing! So far, I'm pretty impressed but i will reserve judgement until harvest. The light is a Spider Farmer sf4000. It's lighting up a 4x4ft area. It is marketed as being able to replace 1000w HID. Like I said, I can't say for sure, but it seems like it could. I'll know for sure in a couple months. But this light is VERY powerful. And it doesn't put off a lot of heat, especially compared to HID lighting. So this is pretty much just an experiment to see how LED technology is coming along. Like i said, so far, I'm impressed

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#9 Shroomn

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Posted 31 January 2020 - 05:01 PM

Those certainly appear to be getting good lighting - well done.  There are inexpensive fairly reliable light meters out there if you want to understand the strength of your lighting.  I grow a lot of vegetables that require different amounts of lux, so I picked up one of these.  It's also good to help understand if your lighting is the right distance from your plants.

 

Cheers.


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#10 dpwishy

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Posted 01 February 2020 - 11:28 AM

The light is a Spider Farmer sf4000. It's lighting up a 4x4ft area. It is marketed as being able to replace 1000w HID.

They all claim this, only way to really tell is to go by the watts drawn from wall. A true 1000 watt hps replacement is normally in the 600's watts at wall. Always go by at wall watt draw

 

There are inexpensive fairly reliable light meters out there if you want to understand the strength of your lighting. I grow a lot of vegetables that require different amounts of lux

Lux is the measure of visible light to humans. This doesnt factor out the same way as a par meter, which measures photosynthetic active radiation, what the plant takes, not how bright something is to humans. When you start getting into led which are dialed in specifically for photosynthetic radiation, a lux meter will be really miss leading. This is because its not about the brightness but how focused par is to plant, visible light levels wont answer this. Cheapest par meter I could find was 150 by hydrofarm.


Edited by dpwishy, 01 February 2020 - 11:35 AM.

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#11 el_ronhub_bird

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Posted 01 February 2020 - 12:48 PM

It pulls 438 at the wall. Judging with my own eyes, it is not as bright as a 1000w, but it's damn close. It is brighter than a 600w though. Regardless, it's very powerful and so far I'm having fun playing with it.

My biggest problem with LEDs is that my whole style of growing is based around air cooling HID lamps. Air cooling is not possible or necessary for LEDs so if i make the switch to LEDs, I'll have to completely revamp my whole setup. So for now, I'll just wait to see results with my own eyes. If I'm that impressed by it then I'll consider making the change

Edited by el_ronhub_bird, 01 February 2020 - 01:05 PM.

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#12 dpwishy

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Posted 01 February 2020 - 05:35 PM

It pulls 438 at the wall. Judging with my own eyes, it is not as bright as a 1000w, but it's damn close. It is brighter than a 600w though. Regardless, it's very powerful and so far I'm having fun playing with it.
My biggest problem with LEDs is that my whole style of growing is based around air cooling HID lamps. Air cooling is not possible or necessary for LEDs so if i make the switch to LEDs, I'll have to completely revamp my whole setup. So for now, I'll just wait to see results with my own eyes. If I'm that impressed by it then I'll consider making the change


I guess it matters on how strong the light is. I have to heat my room if lights are dimmed 50-70%, once I go above 70%, I need to start acing the room to stay low to mid 80's

Growing under led, temps and humidity should be different. There is a lot of infrared light in hid lighting which equates to heat, this is why we grow at 76-78 under those. Led should be at 84-86f and 75%-80% humidity to stay within vpd. This equates to the same heat felt on the leaf surface given the difference in hid to led. This was a big difference for what I was used too, i went from always needing an ac, to sometimes needing heat while things are young and lights are dimmed. Also, I stopped needing dehumidifiers and started needing cool mist humidifiers to maintain that RH. It changed the whole air system to my setup, I can no longer have an outtake fan and filter in tent, it would always be sucking out rh and was impossible to maintain those levels given. I now have the tent sealed, a small fan shooting the ac  or heat air (depending on growth stage) in the bottom, it creates positive pressure in tent, the air escapes from seems but not fast enough to kill RH, levels are controlled by automation. The fan and scrubber is now outside the tent in the room the tent is in exhausting the dirty air outside the ac vent once its scrubbed. I also noticed a huge increase in the need for magnesium going to led, I had to put 1 gram of Epsom salt in every gallon of feed, I now use Mag AMP by cutting edge solutions just for ease.

It's been a huge learning curve for me too, hopefully leaning on each other we can make this a little easier. I would really appreciate your feedback and knowledge learned as you progress, it really is the new frontier. Good luck. Blessings, brother.


Edited by dpwishy, 01 February 2020 - 05:58 PM.

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#13 Shroomn

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Posted 01 February 2020 - 06:49 PM

 

The light is a Spider Farmer sf4000. It's lighting up a 4x4ft area. It is marketed as being able to replace 1000w HID.

They all claim this, only way to really tell is to go by the watts drawn from wall. A true 1000 watt hps replacement is normally in the 600's watts at wall. Always go by at wall watt draw

 

There are inexpensive fairly reliable light meters out there if you want to understand the strength of your lighting. I grow a lot of vegetables that require different amounts of lux

Lux is the measure of visible light to humans. This doesnt factor out the same way as a par meter, which measures photosynthetic active radiation, what the plant takes, not how bright something is to humans. When you start getting into led which are dialed in specifically for photosynthetic radiation, a lux meter will be really miss leading. This is because its not about the brightness but how focused par is to plant, visible light levels wont answer this. Cheapest par meter I could find was 150 by hydrofarm.

 

 

Couldn't agree more that par is a more effective measurement.  But as you stated, those meters are not cheap, and I am.  lol.  I'm just trying to make sure I'm in the ballpark...and kinda thought EL was trying to do the same, just get a better idea.  I also use the fc (foot candle) measurement with my meter, which I am certain you know is lumens, not lux. 

 

Also like your idea of checking the watts because the marketing is very deceptive.  A few years ago I bought a "130W" led - it pulled 60W.  But doesn't the quality of the leds matter here to?  i.e. higher cri, same watts, but more usable lights for the plants.



#14 el_ronhub_bird

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Posted 11 February 2020 - 01:11 PM

The growth produced by this Spider Farmer is amazing! The plants in the back of the room have stretched a little too close to the light so i am in the process of folding over the tops. Then I'll put a scrog over them to keep em from popping back up. So far i really like this light! If the yield is as good as it seems it will be, i just might have to buy a couple more

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#15 Sicshroom

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Posted 11 February 2020 - 04:10 PM

Fucking beautiful

#16 el_ronhub_bird

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Posted 14 February 2020 - 10:43 AM

So even if it turns out that this Spider Farmer is a shitty budding lamp, it's definitely a good vegging lamp! This fan leaf is as big as any leaf I've ever grown under HID

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#17 el_ronhub_bird

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Posted 14 February 2020 - 10:56 AM

I rearranged this room a little bit. I'm gonna leave this screen on here at least until the stems of these plants harden so the bent tips don't pop back up. Maybe I'll leave it on until harvest. Anyways now I'm cleaning up the underside of the canopy. These plants are 3 weeks into flower. And sorry for hijacking this thread, I just want to show you people what this LED light is capable of, because I am brand new to LEDs myself so even I don't know what they're capable of. I'm showing you guys as i go along.

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#18 el_ronhub_bird

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Posted 14 February 2020 - 11:09 AM

To all the happy couples here at Mycotopia, happy Valentine's day! You make me sick, go fuck yourselves! Have a nice day
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#19 Misfit

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Posted 14 February 2020 - 11:18 AM

Looking good brother. Gonna be watching this one.

#20 Shroomn

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Posted 15 February 2020 - 12:40 AM

Seriously, El.  Well done.  Time (and testing) will tell, but visually it appears you've nailed the LED lighting required.






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