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Myco bag specification help


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#1 Jrotten

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Posted 20 May 2020 - 01:12 PM

I've decided to give bags another go because I'm in an extreme contamination season and situation for the next 3-6 months.  I ordered some 8"x5" 3mil .2micron filter myco bags.  Does that sound like what I'd want? There were mylar options, thicker options, larger filter options, etc.  Last time I tried bags I just screwed them up in the PC every time before I got anywhere, but I have some cool experiments going right now and I'd like to give them the best chance of success.

 

Recommendations are welcome.



#2 Cuboid

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Posted 20 May 2020 - 03:01 PM

Thickness of material and filter pore size are the same as ones I'm currently using. Overall size sounds small but depends what you are using then for. Good size for inoculating a lb or 2 of grain in maybe? The ones I have are nearer 10" x 20" and hold 4lb of sawdust based substrate + spawn without coming up past the filter patch.

Are they polypropylene? Mine are and survive PC'ing well. I've even reused them. YMMV as my PC is wimpy and only goes to about 12.5 PSI not the recommended 15 PSI.

TS Trade 10 PCS PVC Mushroom Spawn Grow Bag High Temp 10×20"
by TS Trade
Learn more: https://www.amazon.c...U_z0yXEbNG45SHZ

Edited by Cuboid, 20 May 2020 - 03:05 PM.


#3 pastyoureyes

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Posted 20 May 2020 - 03:04 PM

I use 5x4 bags (next size down from 8x5) with a .2 micron filter for grain spawn. I assume you are making grain bags from the filter size you have chosen. If you are planning on making substrate bags go with .5 micron.

If you need any help preparing your bags I can help you out.

#4 Jrotten

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Posted 20 May 2020 - 04:06 PM

I use 5x4 bags (next size down from 8x5) with a .2 micron filter for grain spawn. I assume you are making grain bags from the filter size you have chosen. If you are planning on making substrate bags go with .5 micron.

If you need any help preparing your bags I can help you out.

My immediate plan was to take grain jars and inoculate substrate in the bags in front of a flow hood and impact seal them, then just cut the bags down when it's time to case and fruit.  Now that I have clean cultures on agar going (still new to me) I had considered doing a Blue Helix LC to sub also.

 

Is .2 just not enough GE for colonizing a bulk substrate?  My goals aren't to produce tons of yield, I'm just experimenting with my first  selected clones and some Ps. Semperviva/Hoogshagenii.  I'd like to start working to develop/improve some cultures.

 

The bags I have in the cart now are described: 

All in One Mushroom Grow Bag/Farm-Mushroom Spawn/Sealable Spawn/Myco Bags,Large Size 8" X 5" X 19",0.2 Micron Filter, 3 Mil Polypropylene,for Substrate Autoclavable (50)

Edited by Jrotten, 20 May 2020 - 04:10 PM.


#5 pastyoureyes

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Posted 20 May 2020 - 06:09 PM

I've not used the .2 microns for substrate. I know .5 works.
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#6 Jrotten

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Posted 20 May 2020 - 06:51 PM

I've not used the .2 microns for substrate. I know .5 works.

I've got both coming...  So about that help... :)

 

if my intent is to sterilize bulk, and spawn with grain... What would you suggest or can you point me to idiot/JR proof instructions? 



#7 pastyoureyes

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Posted 20 May 2020 - 07:36 PM

I tried to simplify my notes for idiots like us
Grain Prep
gallery_150062_1521_1162743.jpg
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#8 pastyoureyes

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Posted 20 May 2020 - 07:47 PM

Microbes Oat Prep tek is what I've based my process on
https://mycotopia.ne...s-oat-prep-tek/

Edited by pastyoureyes, 20 May 2020 - 07:48 PM.

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#9 pastyoureyes

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Posted 20 May 2020 - 07:50 PM

I pasteurize my substrate and load into the bags at the same time I spawn.

If you've made bulk subs before there isn't much difference when using bags.
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#10 p2p

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Posted 20 May 2020 - 11:20 PM

if you are going to use a supplemented substrate, then sterilization in PC is a more secure way than just pasteurization.

Unsupplemented substrate can be simply pasteurized.

 

If you would use pasteurized substrate, then a micropore tape would be enough, no need for expensive bags.

 

0.2 micron is used for grain. 0.5 microns is more suitable for substrate.


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#11 Jrotten

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Posted 20 May 2020 - 11:36 PM

I’ll be sterilizing, but I’ll probably do some pasteurizing also. I have an enormous spore load and very warm conditions with insect issues to boot. I’m actually pasteurizing in some food saver bags right now for a quick experimental mini grow.

I still can’t even buy alcohol to clean tubs with, bleach is hard to come by so I’m using pool shock to clean things. It’s a mess. Anything that limits the transfers and the need for disinfectants is very useful right now. The bags aren’t any more expensive than day a turkey tin or Tupperware. And I can use them either way. It’s just another tool to learn and out in the tool bag right now.

#12 pastyoureyes

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Posted 21 May 2020 - 07:12 AM

if you are going to use a supplemented substrate, then sterilization in PC is a more secure way than just pasteurization.
Unsupplemented substrate can be simply pasteurized.
 
If you would use pasteurized substrate, then a micropore tape would be enough, no need for expensive bags.
 
0.2 micron is used for grain. 0.5 microns is more suitable for substrate.


What do you mean by supplemented?

#13 Severian

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Posted 22 May 2020 - 07:18 AM

I’ll be sterilizing, but I’ll probably do some pasteurizing also. I have an enormous spore load and very warm conditions with insect issues to boot. I’m actually pasteurizing in some food saver bags right now for a quick experimental mini grow.

I still can’t even buy alcohol to clean tubs with, bleach is hard to come by so I’m using pool shock to clean things. It’s a mess. Anything that limits the transfers and the need for disinfectants is very useful right now. The bags aren’t any more expensive than day a turkey tin or Tupperware. And I can use them either way. It’s just another tool to learn and out in the tool bag right now.

 

 

CatsnBatst turned me on to 5% vinegar with a drop of dish soap as a disinfectant.

 

As far as the filter patches go- I'm 90% certain the ones I have are .5 micron, and I've been using them for grain spawn; but when I've filled the bags about an inch below the filter patch, there is a noticeable uncolonized dry spot beneath the patch- So I'm thinking that .5 is too big for proper moisture content for grain spawn. 

 

Though, I want to stress that this is a hypothesis based on a few observations and is in no way tested or proven.

 

 

edit: p2p beat me to it.


Edited by Severian, 22 May 2020 - 07:21 AM.


#14 Cuboid

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Posted 22 May 2020 - 05:16 PM

 

if you are going to use a supplemented substrate, then sterilization in PC is a more secure way than just pasteurization.
Unsupplemented substrate can be simply pasteurized.
 
If you would use pasteurized substrate, then a micropore tape would be enough, no need for expensive bags.
 
0.2 micron is used for grain. 0.5 microns is more suitable for substrate.


What do you mean by supplemented?

 

 

Supplemented in this context usually taken to mean the addition of a proportion of something relatively highly nutritious (protein rich/nitrogenous) to bulk substrate. So you may for example have hardwood saw dust/chip substrate but with 20% wheat bran or rice bran added to it. 



#15 Jrotten

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Posted 27 May 2020 - 10:14 PM

I have 3 different species in bags now.  Semperviva/Hoogshagenii was my first experiment.  I might have panicked a bit and killed one of them, or it's contaminated.  It's definitely slower than the other two, but I decided it needed to be mixed up better on day 2 and hopefully it's just recovering slow.  I have my first cubes that I ever started MS with the intention of trying to improve instead of just harvesting.  They are 3 different clone cultures from a Costa Rican strain from the Arenal Volcano region.  That part of Costa Rica is one of my absolute favorite places on earth.  And finally I'm trying pan cyans again.  I've never been successful with pan cyans, but hopefully the bag gets me passed the colonization stage.

 

The pans I will have to crumble to trays.  The cubes I could get away without casing.  The Semperviva are going to have to be cased and the cubes I will want to.  I would like these to fruit in the bag and just use it as a liner.  Is it as simple as cutting the bag down and throwing my casing layer on it and done or is there some detail or technique I'm missing?






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