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Different Rye Grain Variants and Their Respective Growth Rates


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#1 DarkPassenger

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Posted 09 October 2020 - 04:58 AM

So, I have had several successful PF Tek grows now, and I have decided to initiate my journey into rye grain bulk substrate grows.

For my first test, I am using Weyermann Rye Malt.

**Of note, check your local businesses when looking to purchase grain. It not only supports your local economy, which is critical under the current pandemic, but you will save a ton of money. I purchased 5 lbs of Weyermann Rye Malt for a grand total of ~$9.00.**

My second test, in parallel, is using Rahr White Wheat Malt.

My third test is using a chocolate rye malt.

I used distilled water and the requisite amount of gypsum for the these tests based on data obtained from the book:

"The Psilocybin Mushroom Bible: The Definitive Guide to Growing and Using Magic Mushrooms" by Dr. K Mandrake PhD. (Review forthcoming when I have tangible results on the various methods outlined in this book).

My objective is to determine rates of mycelial growth through qualitative observation. Data on incidents of contamination will be performed after I have multiple data sets as I would obviously not want to skew the test data based on a single data point.

For these tests, all innoculation methods will remain the same as will the environmental factors (to the best of my ability I will attempt to maintain environmental conditions the same that is). All work performed in a freshly sterilized glove box using 10% bleach solution.

Pressure cooker used: Instapot Duo Evo Plus.

Amount of distilled water, gypsum and sterilization times based on the aforementioned book.

So, what are your grain recipes? Which types of grain do y'all use? Any unique ingredients that you add, in addition to the gypsum, to increase growth rates that you would care to share? Any data points on why malt rye works best for you?

I would love to hear what others are doing with regard to bulk substrate grows using rye malt grain. For the time being, I plan to only use grain and to not jump into using birdseed and the like. At least until I have concrete results on use rye malt.

For standardization, I have currently only been using APE for my spore of choice.

Next week, I plan to begin the same three grain tests using psilocybin azurescens.

I will also use the same substrate and pasturization methods. For pasturization, I will be using a "GasOne 200, 000 BTU Square Heavy- Duty Single Burner Outdoor Stove Propane Gas Cooker."

Would love to hear your thoughts on this topic!

Mush Love,

DP

#2 coorsmikey

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Posted 09 October 2020 - 09:30 AM

I'm surprised to see that you aren't including an unmalted rye in your experiment. I wish you much success as a lot of us have found malted rye a little more challenging and problematic. So it will be nice to see some good data and results.


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#3 PJammer24

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Posted 09 October 2020 - 10:11 AM

I would give winter rye or winter wheat a fair shake... I have not experiemented with anything malted but have had great results with a few different grains. I am out in the cut with multiple feed stores within a short distance.

 

Winter Rye and Winter Wheat are my go to choices... You will want to make sure that you don't get rye grass seed by mistake. The ole sandman likes to do a mix of the wheat with milo (sorghum).

 

I have had good success using popcorn, it seems to colonize most quickly. I have had good success using wild birdseed but you will want to avoid getting the cheaper brands. I have had issues with cheapo brand bird seed that is much dirtier than the higher priced stuff. I used a bag a friend picked up for me, since I don't drive, on some spawn recently and a high percentage went bad. I have also had good results using raw oats, I would not attempt to use a sweet feed...

 

millet will work just fine, almost any feed grain really will give you good results. I would suggest steering clear of field corn due to the starches. Popcorn can get starchy also but if you prepare it properly, you can work around this.

 

Good luck!! 


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#4 pastyoureyes

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Posted 09 October 2020 - 11:48 AM

I'll place my bet on the white wheat malt but that's just a guess. I've used spent grains from brewing that was a mix of wheat and barley mixed with vermiculite. I used the vermiculite because my grains were milled.

My daily driver is whole oats from the feed store. $15 for 50 lbs is much cheaper than what you are using. The only way I'd use homebrew grains is if I made beer first.
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#5 pastyoureyes

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Posted 09 October 2020 - 11:53 AM

One experiment I'd like to try is doing a cereal mash with the whole oats and seeing if I get a beer that is drinkable and still be able to use the spent grains for cultivation. I'm thinking some kind of oatmeal whitbier.
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#6 DarkPassenger

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Posted 09 October 2020 - 09:30 PM

Coorsmikey,

Appreciate the input! Just ordered some non-malt for baseline analysis.

I enjoy the experimentation with growing more than the actual journey I think. Crazy, I know. Can explain in more detail at another point in time.

Long story short, I am hoping to treat my depression. I've been deemed "treatment resistant"... Have tried over 15 anti-depressants, none of which worked, over the course of the last 15+ years.

Keep getting delays for a Sprovato referral from my doctor and my insurance keeps saying that they never received the referral. Suspect at best. So much for supporting veterans mental health.

Anyways, if I am to remain on this planet for much longer, I need a treatment that actually works. Hence, the reason I am here on Mycotopia.

I weaned myself off of my cymbalta, which was a bitch, don't get me started. Horrible withdrawal. If anyone needs some advice on THAT topic, message me. The brain zaps suck.

In short, this is literally my last shot. If psilocibin doesn't work... Well... I tried my best.

Mush Love,

DP
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#7 coorsmikey

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Posted 09 October 2020 - 09:57 PM

Well you have found the right place I hope. Just keep in mind that it may take some time also, don't give up if you don't get the expected results right away. It's the journey and transformation does the healing more than just taking a dose and feeling human again. That kind if thing doesn't happen over night.


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#8 pastyoureyes

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Posted 09 October 2020 - 10:08 PM

Psilocybin delivers on the promises that SSRI'S fail to in my experience. On top of that you've found yourself a hobby which goes a long way toward not feeling depressed. So it really is a one two punch when you cultivate. You wont suddenly have a perfect life but there will be some relief.

I highly suggest starting cakes so you can get some "medicine" asap.
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#9 DarkPassenger

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Posted 09 October 2020 - 10:29 PM

Pastyoureyes

Had 3 grams (dried) APE last weekend from personally grown PF Tek (much better than my original pics would illustrate) and it was quite a journey. Lots of introspection. Unfortunately, the results have not decreased my depression BUT I didn't necessarily expect it to on the first try.

I have some time. Less than a year though. Late May 2021 is my expiration date. And I am okay with that. I am currently wrapping up some things so that my wife and 2.5 year old will hopefully be okay.

My date is set. Get busy living, or get busy dying, right?

Any failures that I experience will be learning points, but the clock is ticking, and any and all failures ultimately come at a price, which I shall shoulder.

Best,

DP

#10 coorsmikey

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Posted 09 October 2020 - 10:42 PM

Awe man then.... You are gonna need a 10-14gr trip out in nature ether alone or with a good copilot. Not sure where you are located but those good days/nights are running short in the northern hemisphere. Setting a date that short is limiting the opportunities. Shit May 21 I'm hoping for some Ovoids to be fruiting and I will be lucky if I get one or two smaller healing sessions in before then. No way you can anything more than a glimpse in that time. It will literally take me that much time to finish comprehending what happened with my last experience. "Its just so much much bigger than me". 


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#11 DarkPassenger

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Posted 09 October 2020 - 11:02 PM

I know Coors. Not much time. But the date is set. No changing it, unless things change for the better. I sincerely have much work to do. I must be efficient and I have to learn quickly. I will be relying on each and everyone on this website to assist me. But any failures will be my own. That is the beautiful part of this situation... Modern medicine has failed me, and many others, but I won't go down without a fight. I have the capacity to alter my future, with some help.

22 veterans + 1 (on hold for now)

I will maintain a journal as I proceed until May next year, at which point I will hand over my files to Mycotopia for someone else to hopefully carry the torch forward.

Best,

DP

#12 pastyoureyes

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Posted 10 October 2020 - 12:56 AM

I'm missing something, why is may 2021 your expiration?

#13 TVCasualty

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Posted 10 October 2020 - 11:54 AM

I know Coors. Not much time. But the date is set. No changing it, unless things change for the better. I sincerely have much work to do. I must be efficient and I have to learn quickly. I will be relying on each and everyone on this website to assist me. But any failures will be my own. That is the beautiful part of this situation... Modern medicine has failed me, and many others, but I won't go down without a fight. I have the capacity to alter my future, with some help.

22 veterans + 1 (on hold for now)

I will maintain a journal as I proceed until May next year, at which point I will hand over my files to Mycotopia for someone else to hopefully carry the torch forward.

Best,

DP

 

 

To paraphrase an old saying... If you want to make god laugh, tell Her your plans.


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#14 DarkPassenger

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Posted 22 October 2020 - 03:23 AM

Test Results after roughly 12 days:

 

Weyermann Rye Malt - Failure; no visible mycelial growth (to include contaminants, so my sterile technique appears to be sound).

 

Rahr White Wheat Malt - Successful growth, giving it another week, perhaps less; preparing to layer in monotub with coir:horse poo: vermiculite (1:1:1)

 

Chocolate rye malt - TBD - not ready to grade this as a failure yet, but initial indications do not look good; no visible mycelial growth. Anticipate failure.

 

Since initiating this test, I have also done the following:

 

  • Taken PJammer's recommendation in trying Winter Wheat; soaked and autoclaved; preparing to noc tomorrow.
  • Taken coorsmikey's recommendation in using an unmalted rye; preparing to autoclave now; just waiting for my millet jar to finish sterilization in the PC.
  • Generated my first APE LC, using Karo, and although I have observed slow mycelial growth - it is growing within the LC.
  • Previously generated organic honey LC (x3), after 1.5 months, show no sign of growth - graded as a fail.
  • Two agar dishes inoculated in glove box; the first using spore print using Stamets' agar "scrape" process; the second, using a live tissue transfer from previous APE PF Tek grow; both show good growth, no contaminants thus far.

More to follow...

 

DP


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#15 DarkPassenger

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Posted 27 October 2020 - 08:40 PM

The Mocking Malt

My chocolate rye malt experiment is gaslighting me... It looks exactly the same as when I first inoculated it.

It just looks like regular 'ole chocolate rye malt sitting in a mushroom bag LOL....the funny thing is, I don't want to throw it out. I am curious to see what, if anything, will happen.

I'm not sure how it happened but I'm more interested in this bag of chocolate rye malt than I ever thought possible.

Are the spores simply dormant?

Did they just go POOF and evaporate?

Are they gathering their forces to ultimately overtake, by all appearances, the indomitable chocolate rye malt?

The bag just sits there mocking me.

I naturally suspect that this experiment is a failure but I am not ready to fold just yet... too stubborn I suppose.

It's starting to keep me up at night so this might be becoming a problem. Then I keep waking up at the crack of dawn to take a look, each time with the hope that just a tiny bit of mycelium will be found stretching it's "legs."

Anyone else have a hard time with letting go hahaha?

DP

#16 pastyoureyes

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Posted 28 October 2020 - 12:39 PM

Pics would help but maybe the rye wasn't hydrated enough?
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#17 FunG

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Posted 29 October 2020 - 05:36 AM

Rye/millet/hemp hearts is where it's at.

I'm surprised no one else uses hemp hearts in with their rye...wbs kinda defeats the use of hemp hearts since it has enough small seeds in it but hemp hearts contain a natural occurring chemical that increases the strength of psilocybin and I cant for the life of me remember what it's called.

#18 pastyoureyes

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Posted 29 October 2020 - 09:39 PM

Rye/millet/hemp hearts is where it's at.
I'm surprised no one else uses hemp hearts in with their rye...wbs kinda defeats the use of hemp hearts since it has enough small seeds in it but hemp hearts contain a natural occurring chemical that increases the strength of psilocybin and I cant for the life of me remember what it's called.

Tryptophan?

#19 TVCasualty

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Posted 03 November 2020 - 02:10 PM

I'm surprised no one else uses hemp hearts in with their rye...wbs kinda defeats the use of hemp hearts since it has enough small seeds in it but hemp hearts contain a natural occurring chemical that increases the strength of psilocybin and I cant for the life of me remember what it's called.

 

I'm ...skeptical.

 

Psilocybin is psilocybin, and I've not heard any mention of the existence of more potent isomers nor any mention of MAOI's in hemp hearts so it would be really helpful if you remembered the name of that chemical. If you mean tryptophan then that's debatable since a lot of people have supplemented their grows with quinoa or straight tryptophan (including myself) and eventually quit bothering since there was no noticeable boost in potency above the same strain grown on the same substrate minus the tryptophan.

 

I (among others) concluded that it was a waste of time and money, and that the best way to achieve significantly higher per-dry-gram potency would be to grow one of the much stronger woodlover species, which incidentally achieve their spectacular potency while growing on plain ol' wood.


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#20 DarkPassenger

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Posted 14 November 2020 - 06:52 AM

@TVCasualty @pastyoureyes,

What are some good baseline grain to water ratios that you would recommend?

I feel like I am having a hard time dialing in the right amounts for injection port, sealed 32 ounce Ball jars... I had been using 300g grain to 250 mL distilled water...

Any assistance would be greatly appreciated.

DP




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