27 replies to this topic

[Moby]

Short introduction of myself,
Iˋm a german mush lover and cultivator who invests quite some time in research and experiments.
All my posts here will have some context attached to them, Iˋm not gonna post grows to show what a cool guy I am with full pinsets, Iˋve done grows like that and I know what Iˋm able to do, theres no need to show my peepee around all the time.

What I post are lections - mistakes I made, experiments or stuff that I for whatever reason think is worth sharing.
People are welcome to join whenever they want.
_____________________

As start post of my thread I want to share an extraction method that Iˋve been working on for a while.
To be fair, a bigger dehydrator is needed but apart of that anyone can do it relatively simple at home.

So letˋs get started.

- Cracker dry, powdered mushs
- Vodka
- Silicone oven form
- coffee iso can or another container to keep liquid warm
- meat thermometer
- dehydrator
- Dextrose
- kitchen towel (please use one thats not been washed with softeners, that stuff that adds smell to fabrics, it will land in the final product that you ingest)
- container to catch the extracted liquid, a single use glove and a gram scale.
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The cracker dry powdered mushs go straight into the iso container, Iˋve used a very old food iso container that keeps food hot over hours, a coffee or tea iso can works too.




With a meat thermometer Vodka is heated in a household waterboiler until it reaches 140 fahrenheit and then poured over and mixed with the mush powder.



The mixture should be liquidy and not a paste



The container then is closed and chills for 4 hours, in that time the container or can gets swirled around a couple times.

After the extraction period its strained through a kitchen towel



Thats what the liquid looks like after the extraction



The filtered liquid then is filled into a silicone oven form for the evaporation process in the dehydrator.
Use a silicone form!! that stuff is sticky and not fun to work with in a glass bowl or something else!



I run the dehydrator at lowest setting (113 fahrenheit with my device) until all the liquid is evaporated

The remaining "resin" is then put into the freezer for 30-60mins until its solid and breakable.

Put some Dextrose on the table for the next step and get the gram scale ready.

Use a single use glove on one hand and break a piece of the extract out of the plate, you can break it easily by folding the silicone form in different directions.

The rest of the extract is put back into the freezer.

You only keep a piece of it outside because it warms up very fast and becomes extremely sticky and hard to weigh and roll.

Thats what it looks like when its at room temp



between your fingers it becomes even softer and starts sticking.

So the broken piece is then weighed quickly into 1g pieces and rolled in Dextrose to make it less sticky



After the Dextrose roll its formed into a small sausage and filled into capsules



You take step by step, piece by piece out of the freezer to make sure its easy to work with.



The capsules are then stored in the freezer!

Dosage depends on the potency of your fruits, Iˋd say 1-2 capsules for a medium dose, more for stronger doses.
Iˋve only done this extraction with cubes, if you use pans or other species then you should of course adjust the dosage and not use the same!

Theres no stomach issues at all, the capsules are easy to swallow or you can alternatively dissolve the extract in tea or coffee for a faster come up.

Doesnˋt taste like mushs, kind of sweet and sour.

Have fun, stay safe!


Edit:
The remaining mush powder in the kitchen towel is saved in a jar and also stored in the freezer, yet I haven`t done a second run on extracted powder but there has to be some magic left in it.
Gonna do a second run once I've collected a full jar

Edited by DickMoby, 16 October 2020 - 05:55 PM.

[FunG]

Awesome write up, I've never seen a extract method where the final product becomes a solid.

Thank you for providing a excellent read and experiment.

[Moby]

Awesome write up, I've never seen a extract method where the final product becomes a solid.
Thank you for providing a excellent read and experiment.

Cheers,
for me it's all about learning and sharing.

I can't stand the taste anymore and the stomach gives me a very unenjoyable experience, pure ethanol is expensive and tinctures taste horrible.
Couldn't find a good extraction so I had to make one.

I'm working on a pdf to make it downloadable, before tho I want to test how potent a capsule is that was sitting on room temp for two months, the waiting is almost done and ready to test

[Freaky]

That's good stuff DickMoby. I've always liked the extraction experiments.

 

Have you tried with other liquors/alcohols or have you found vodka to be the best? 

 

What is the dry weight you grind and the amount of vodka you heat? 

[Moby]

I have tried the same with plain water and pure ethanol.

 

Water didn't work, at least the one time I've tried it, didn't want to waste my time and resources for fourther experiments with water, it took a while and some recources to get to that point and the way I finally did everything.

 

Tho water is the better extraction liquid compared to ethanol.

 

Pure ethanol is expensive, Vodka is a mixture of water and ethanol and readily available everywhere.

Vodka is the cheapest available alcohol in germany, not sure about the states and other parts of the world.

I've not tried other liquors since Vodka is that cheap and also a clear liquid without added sugar, so that was the way to go.

 

With my little chemical input I assume that for an extraction it would be counter productive to use a liquid thats already partly saturated with added sugars and stuff that gives it a colour.

We want to pull out as many of the actives from the powder as possible and liquid can only hold a limited amount of solids before it becomes thick.

 

I can't tell you numbers of gram and ml of the used powder and Vodka, didnt measure.

I see it would be better to share something with a clear recipe, gonna update that in the new year, don't think I'll do another extraction this year.

The mixture should be liquidy and easy to mix, not a paste.

Edited by DickMoby, 17 October 2020 - 05:11 AM.

[FunG]

Any idea how many mg's of psilocybin are in a .1 of the extract moby? Like would .1 contain 0.10mg of actives?

If I lived in Germany I'd gratefully yield myself to some research studies lol

[Moby]

i could only throw stupid and wrong numbers around.
Cube varieties have different potential to produce more or less actives, even within the same variety the potency of different strains varies.

Even if I knew the amount of psilocybin in the used mushrooms for this extraction, I wouldn't know how much of it got lost during the extraction (evne though I purposely used low temps for the whole procedure) and how much of the actives are still left in the remaining stored mush powder.

I got two newly developed psilocybin test kits from a german university.
The tests show relatively accurate the percentage concentration of the tested sample.

Yet I'm not sure what to test with those tests because I got a little list with stuff that I want to test.

Most likely I'll test fruits of an isolated culture that are dried at different temps.
The "have higher temps an impact on the actives" debate is out there since forever.
People on another platform have thrown a wide range of numbers paired with insults and stuff in the manner of "you're an idiot with outdated information" because I'm sure even temps below 160 fahrenheit influence the potency.

They threw numbers in the range of 160-428 fahrenheit (428 fahrenheit is the melting point of psilocybin) and said all different things on the same thread but everything directed at me to shut me up.

Man people are funny and moronys..
should they throw their mushs in the oven on those temps and eat whats left when they're dry..

Anyways.
I'm thinking about temps of 113 fahrenheit and 176 because those are the lowest and highest settings of my dehydrator and test the fruits for their psilocybin content to see how much difference there is or if there is any at all.

Gotta isolate a culture before that tho and a true isolation takes 25+ transfers.
Alternatively I could transfer some rapidly growing myc and fruit it over some generations until the pinset is even.

Tho at the moment I gotta be careful and not promise any more things, too many projects right now.
Something will happen with those tests but not in the next couple weeks.

Edited by DickMoby, 17 October 2020 - 08:48 AM.

[Severian]

What proof is the vodka? % alcohol?

[Moby]

What proof is the vodka? % alcohol?

So the last comment was updated.

The vodka was 37,5% alcohol

[Severian]

Hmm, pretty low content relative to most extractions I've seen

 

Curious how the effect would be different for a higher concentration of alcohol.

 

 

also, are those test kits available for public purchase? If so, could you share the source? I'd be interested in testing at some point in the future.

Edited by Severian, 17 October 2020 - 10:29 AM.

[coorsmikey]

Do you mind if I move your thread over to Psychedelic Kitchen with the other extraction threads?

Thanks for sharing!

[Moby]

Hmm, pretty low content relative to most extractions I've seen

 

Curious how the effect would be different for a higher concentration of alcohol.

 

 

also, are those test kits available for public purchase? If so, could you share the source? I'd be interested in testing at some point in the future.

 

Yea I'd be interested in that question aswell, I'm sure people could also just mix ethanol with destilled water down instead.

Without testing the different extracts it's hard to say anything and with all the wrong info out there and peoples opinions that are sold as facts I don't want to feed that storm of bullshit with more guessing.

 

I might be able to get a couple more tests once the first two delivered some data.

To your question, those tests are newly developed and currently in the prototype phase, that doesn't mean they are inacurate, just yet not too practically because of the way they work.

I'm one of the lucky first people to get some to test and give feedback about them.

 

Do you mind if I move your thread over to Psychedelic Kitchen with the other extraction threads?

Thanks for sharing!

 

I actually thought about posting it there but decided to put it in my thread to have everything at one spot and make it easier to edit things over time if needed and also to make it easier to follow the stuff I do if someone is interested.

 

I could repost it there for the (very unlikely) case (just joking lol) that people won't click on my thread.

 

Edit:

I just realized that it's not possible to edit the main post anymore so I can't copy the extraction part with the picture links to repost it in cosmic kitchen

Edited by DickMoby, 17 October 2020 - 12:49 PM.

[Freaky]

I wonder how a higher proof would do also, why I asked if he'd tried other alcohol/liquor - shine or something pure grain high proof.

 

Great info on the process.

[Moby]

Psychedelic kitchen tho lol, not cosmic kitchen.

Higher ethanol concentrations.
Water is the better liquid to extract, the ethanol is only there to keep everything "preserved" until all the liquid is evaporated.
I can't go into any details because I don't understand why it is how it is but the mixture of water and ethanol does the trick.

Maybe a higher ethanol content keeps more actives intact until the end of the evap but it's hard to tell without testing

[coorsmikey]

The higher proof alcohol is more selective and gives a “Cleaner” final result. Where as the more water that is use the more of the alkaloids are brought along.

There quite a bit of talk about this here in this discussion.

Edited by coorsmikey, 18 October 2020 - 12:52 PM.

[Moby]

I checked your post and did read a big part of page one and the last page, forgive me for not reading everything.

Interesting to see the parralels of thoughts, there even is a guy who wants to do tests like I want lol
You've done something similar with the evap.

I checked the extract capsule that I put on room temp, it's actually sitting there since 4. august ( I had a different date in mind) so it already sits about 2,5 months outside of the freezer, gonna test it in the next days to get an answer on if it's necessary to store it in the freezer for short periods.

Hhm not sure how to interpret "cleaner", does it mean lower dose = less extracted actives ?
I see it's really hard to answer those questions for everyone because nobody here has the opportunity to test the things in a lab.

Another thing that's sitting in a shelve here for some months now is mush powder in glycerin, that stuff is used for some plant extractions.
It's very thick and acts similar to honey - pulls visible the whole air out of the mush powder over time and replaces it with glycerin. - osmosis ?

It thickened like crazy and probably needs to be filled into another container with more glycerin.
Any idea how to seperate the mush powder out ? Glycerin is soo thick that it won't run through a kitchen towel.

Fresh mushs in Vodka that was frozen for a couple hours to bust the mushs cell walls and put back to room temp is also sitting here since months.

Gonna post some pictures tomorrow, takes a long time to upload pics through vpn to directupload.net and make a longer post with the tablet, my laptop died a couple days ago

[Moby]

I decided to put some pictures together to make the uploads less of a headache.

 

That's the crushed mushs in glycerin

 

 

Those were put into a coffee grinder for just a few short rotations to break them but not powderize, even though I yet don't know how to separate the mushs from the glycerin, it will be alot easier when it's not a paste with powder.

If anyone has an idea how to separate the glycerin out, I'm open for suggestions.

 

Bottom picture is after I added some more glycerin because it was almost fully absorbed.

 

 

Another thing here is fresh mushs that were put into Vodka and frozen for some hours

 

 

The mushs were put into the Vodka right after cutting them, before they bruised, they still bruised like crazy, even though there was alcohol present.

 

Later I decided to add more fresh mushs to the jar, liquid had to be poured out to make space for more fruits

 

 

The after the freezing present blue color was completely gone in the jar with mush pieces in it.

The separated liquid "bruised" dark blue and changed into a dark brown.

 

This last picture is from today 21st oct. the freeze was on 18th june.

There has to be something in the mushrooms that broke down the blue color (or reversed the reaction?)

________________________

 

Here are the tests, I decided to isolate a culture and compare the potency of fruits dried at the lowest and highest setting of my dehydrator.

 

 

Gonna do that once I got room here, currently fruiting a depressed TAT culture to get spores from it, it's pinning since almost two weeks now so that takes forever.

Theres 4 more depressed cultures that will take similar long.

 

Three of these cultures are albinos, gotta find the right point to swab them to really be able to collect spores, in the speed they're growing right now, I expect them to be in the end phase when they drop spores for about a week and because I won't see the transparent spores when they drop, I will have to swap them every day with fresh swabs until I definately collected some.

 

The whole thing is two pains in the ass and will take a while.

To test if I was able to collect spores, I'll have to test each swab right away on agar to see if theres visible growth.

The MS culture from the germinated spores then will be fruited to have a normal growing culture that gives me some prints as real backup.

 

This procedure for three albinos, Kape is not an albino so I can just wait until theres spores visible and then harvest and print.

 

Tomorrow I get Hericium and Versicolor, gonna give these a shot indoor and really looking forward to test Freaky's old spores

[FunG]

I too noticed the color change when doing a hot water extraction moby...

After steeping in a coffee filter the water turns blue, once bottled it turns dark blue then upon giving it oxygen it turns brown....

I want to figure out a way to keep the liquid smurf blue. I think honey may be the only way and then I'll just have blue honey....the only preservation agent I know of thatll keep the oxygen at bay.

[Moby]

I too noticed the color change when doing a hot water extraction moby...

After steeping in a coffee filter the water turns blue, once bottled it turns dark blue then upon giving it oxygen it turns brown....

I want to figure out a way to keep the liquid smurf blue. I think honey may be the only way and then I'll just have blue honey....the only preservation agent I know of thatll keep the oxygen at bay.

 

Please tell me if I'm wrong!

 

The way I interpret your comment with.... this.... way.... to.... comment... is not really positive.

My post wasn't at all thought to prove anything, I purely commented my observation that the liquid with mush pieces turned into a brown while the separated liquid without mush pieces turned into a saturated - dark blue/dark brown mixed color.

 

The first Extraction is a actually proven method that I've invested quite some time and recources into.

The part from yesterday tho is still pure experimental and not to share any method or to prove anything.

 

Please tell me if I interpreted your comment in a wrong way and give me or us the opportunity to grow as a human.

Text can often be interpreted in different ways, I refuse to use facebook or whatsapp because of that exact reason and regular wrong interpretations on both sides.

Online communication (for me) is not the easiest thing to do.

[FunG]

I'm confused moby, what do you mean you interpreted what I said negatively?

Your method for extraction is awesome, I said I've never seen a extract in a solidified form.

My method (the common one) is just a hot water extraction where the final product stays as a liquid.

Question for you, when you begin the alcohol soak with fresh mushrooms does the vodka pigment blue by just placing the tissue into the liquid? Cause I'd love to make up some blue vodka :)