731 replies to this topic

[fahtster]

Yeah me too... based on how a 16qt Colombian rust spore bin is doing, these next f1 tubs are going to be fun to watch. I think I’m going have some CRS and PE sporelating at the same time very soon. gonna do a rusty Richard double swab attempt as well.. the red spore PE is my goal this season

Faht

[Moby]

A rusty PE would be great!

 

I've seen you at the beginning of the LPEU thread on shroomery, got a print of them here.

Is the mystery solved what it is ?

 

Not sure which one to use for experiments in early 2021, either LPEU, Moby Dick or Rusty Whyte as leucistic part 

[fahtster]

I think it’s just a leucistic PE uncut.. ppl love it over there and it puts out massive flushes contrary to regular peu.. which I’m not a fan of personally.. took like fooooooreeeeever to fruit for me.. like even longer than regular PE and it was pretty lack luster.



But the guys that worked on the LPEU really hit it out of the park with that one. I’ve got some RW dried out and waiting to be put to some grain.. another one I’d like to throw some pe genes into.. from what I hear and see, RW also likes to blob a bit and take a while to fruit but is pretty up there in potency, so idk if PE genes would do a whole lot.. it’s fun to think about though :). Don’t know anything about moby.. I’ll have to look into that. But I’d suggest LPEU from what I’ve seen others do with it.

Faht

[thafunkyone]

Hey man.

 

Like I said, I'm always open for exchanges and willing to talk about things.

I tried hard to have a conversation with you and asked questions about your points which you completely avoided over multiple comments.

 

We could have had a nice conversation about the topic but exchange without exchange is just a game and nothing productive.

 

Hippie3, RR, Workman and many other people have made crosses that are out there since like 10-15 years now.

 

Back then alot of things were just plain speculation and turned out to be wrong over time.

 

To correct things that are wrong has nothing to do with attacking, like I said, I tried hard to have a conversation to change your mind based on things we know now but that wasn't possible so at some point it got actually frustrating and there was nothing left than to clearly say that things are wrong.

 

This is not to act like a smartass or to win a debate, its to avoid wrong info from being shared and you mentioned 20 years of experience so its very likely that people believe what you've put out.

 

_______

 

The reason why I made an account here on topia is the rules that people gotta be respectful (on facebook and shroomery for example people are disgusting), and the bad advice rule here.

 

To see something thats clearly out of date and to not correct it is how we support wrong info being spread and in my eyes theres nothing wrong with having a conversation about those things, actually the opposite - people will dislike me even more for saying this but to ignore wrong stuff is like watching away when someone gets beat up.

 

I'm not here to make friends, its something that might or might not happen but not my main goal, I'm online to learn and share.

Always open for productive conversations but it has to be a conversation and not a game

I went back and read my posts to see where we've gotten to this point in the conversation and feel you may have taken things the wrong way- I am simply asking how this works. like I said, when I started this shit people weren't really doing crosses or breeding and the prevailing wisdom is you could not cross mushrooms- back then they were using Rattlesnake venom to break cell walls to allow mycelia to hybridize, and I haven't seen faht harvesting venom on here recently so I don't think this is the route he's taking, it would be fucking badass if it was though. that was the theory of the redboy. also, they were breeding on agar, sectoring out dikaryons and placing those together with hopes they will merge, which he said takes literally hundreds of tries. None of these are simplisitic as putting 2 MS solutions into the same spawn, which was thought to basically just have competing strains in the same spawn but not produce a hybrid. They would plainly tell you it was not a cross and it didn't work that way.

 

So, yes there were 1 or 2 people in the OMC doing this- they weren't publicizing it at all nor were they documenting their work. and they were adamant that you could not produce a hybrid using 2 different spore swabs in the way faht is. Since we're a decade or so past these projects and I haven't been following everything going on there may have been many changes, and rather than read 10 years of posts I asked anyone to point me in the direction of anything that would get me up to date. Things are different now, the whole cubie game has been monentized to a much larger extent with a much larger following, and there (should) be a lot more information. I hope my explanation tells you where I'm coming from, why I'm questioning things, and what I'm looking for as far as information goes. You want to correct wrong information, and I have repeatedly said I'd like the information and send me links so I can be corrected. that was my original intent of posting in this thread. I can grow a fucking cubie ten ways, but I'm not up to date on the current topics. It's not hard to understand how to make mycelia once you know what it likes and dislikes, but making something new is another ballgame. 

 

I've made many friends in this community over the years, online and IRL, some of my best friends are from this website. If you ever choose to have friends here I think you'll find some of the best people are the weird dudes that grow mushrooms and talk about it.

[Moby]

The picture looks like PEU tbh, is it what you got as LPEU ?

 

The mate who sent me LPEU had big leucistic mushs with normal caps, didn't get to grow them yet.

_____

 

Here some Moby Dick from a dutch growkit in 2014

 

 

Threw different phenos, both pictures from the same kit

 

 

Didn't safe the gen back then because I was stupid..

The Mobys around now have brighter caps and at least the ones I saw in communities didn't grow that thick stems.

 

Got a print of the brighter caps version here, its a AA+ x GT cross, also didn't get to grow these yet.

____

 

I'm seeking special mushrooms more than high potency fruits, I barely take any mushrooms anymore, the cultivation and collection is what keeps me going.

 

I'd put PE into something to change the appearance more than increasing the potency, but thats just me, I understand tho that people mix varieties to get better colonization, spore production and/or potency.

 

RW definately would be a great candidate for a PE mixture.

RW spawn will be done colonizing tomorrow,  I could work on it for a bit while hoping for the old PE spores to germinate.

 

I might just give all of them a try once PE showed interest in growing

[Moby]

I see what you're saying.

 

The things that you referred to tho are so old and the same people even created their own crosses a couple years after they talked about the stuff that you take as your information.

 

I don't want to shit on those guys!

Without their weird ass experiments we most likely wouldn't be at the level of cultivation thats possible with our input now but looking at it from where we are now, alot of their stuff was just weird ass experiments and assumptions.

 

Not sure what in the end made the difference that putting spores together now works and didn't work back then, maybe they were just not compatible varieties or maybe they didn't use spores from freshly harvested mushrooms which could result in later germinating spores of one of the used varieties which then miss the point of mating with the second variety, Idk just a couple thoughts.

 

We now know better how the life cycle is and roughly how the mating works. 

 

No bad blood dude, lets enjoy the ride - together

[fahtster]

No.. I was just showing my endeavors with regular peu.. haven’t done or had LPEU yet.

I feel ya on just looking for unique fruits.. that’s cool too!

Hey man.

Like I said, I'm always open for exchanges and willing to talk about things.
I tried hard to have a conversation with you and asked questions about your points which you completely avoided over multiple comments.

We could have had a nice conversation about the topic but exchange without exchange is just a game and nothing productive.

Hippie3, RR, Workman and many other people have made crosses that are out there since like 10-15 years now.

Back then alot of things were just plain speculation and turned out to be wrong over time.

To correct things that are wrong has nothing to do with attacking, like I said, I tried hard to have a conversation to change your mind based on things we know now but that wasn't possible so at some point it got actually frustrating and there was nothing left than to clearly say that things are wrong.

This is not to act like a smartass or to win a debate, its to avoid wrong info from being shared and you mentioned 20 years of experience so its very likely that people believe what you've put out.

_______

The reason why I made an account here on topia is the rules that people gotta be respectful (on facebook and shroomery for example people are disgusting), and the bad advice rule here.

To see something thats clearly out of date and to not correct it is how we support wrong info being spread and in my eyes theres nothing wrong with having a conversation about those things, actually the opposite - people will dislike me even more for saying this but to ignore wrong stuff is like watching away when someone gets beat up.

I'm not here to make friends, its something that might or might not happen but not my main goal, I'm online to learn and share.
Always open for productive conversations but it has to be a conversation and not a game

I went back and read my posts to see where we've gotten to this point in the conversation and feel you may have taken things the wrong way- I am simply asking how this works. like I said, when I started this shit people weren't really doing crosses or breeding and the prevailing wisdom is you could not cross mushrooms- back then they were using Rattlesnake venom to break cell walls to allow mycelia to hybridize, and I haven't seen faht harvesting venom on here recently so I don't think this is the route he's taking, it would be fucking badass if it was though. that was the theory of the redboy. also, they were breeding on agar, sectoring out dikaryons and placing those together with hopes they will merge, which he said takes literally hundreds of tries. None of these are simplisitic as putting 2 MS solutions into the same spawn, which was thought to basically just have competing strains in the same spawn but not produce a hybrid. They would plainly tell you it was not a cross and it didn't work that way.

So, yes there were 1 or 2 people in the OMC doing this- they weren't publicizing it at all nor were they documenting their work. and they were adamant that you could not produce a hybrid using 2 different spore swabs in the way faht is. Since we're a decade or so past these projects and I haven't been following everything going on there may have been many changes, and rather than read 10 years of posts I asked anyone to point me in the direction of anything that would get me up to date. Things are different now, the whole cubie game has been monentized to a much larger extent with a much larger following, and there (should) be a lot more information. I hope my explanation tells you where I'm coming from, why I'm questioning things, and what I'm looking for as far as information goes. You want to correct wrong information, and I have repeatedly said I'd like the information and send me links so I can be corrected. that was my original intent of posting in this thread. I can grow a fucking cubie ten ways, but I'm not up to date on the current topics. It's not hard to understand how to make mycelia once you know what it likes and dislikes, but making something new is another ballgame.

I've made many friends in this community over the years, online and IRL, some of my best friends are from this website. If you ever choose to have friends here I think you'll find some of the best people are the weird dudes that grow mushrooms and talk about it.

The hybridization of cube to cube can be done if you have single spores of each variety Clamp onto each other and share genes that way.. ppl have done it through serial dilution.. my take on venom was that it’s more for the combining of different species such as azures and cubes. My method isn’t just taking ms solution of 2 varieties and inoculating grains.. although I’m trying that as well but don’t give it much optimism.. my method is like taking single spores of each variety and putting them next to each but on a grand scale.

This is done by first layering the spores on top of each other and then using the hundreds,if not thousands of tiny strands from the swab tips those spores are layered on and grinding the two layers together (by rubbing the tips together)... the fibers from the two swab tips interlock with each other as they’re rubbed.. this breaks up the spore clumps of each individual variety, making new clumps where single spores of each are interwoven and places next to each other on tiny bits of swab strands that come off in the water.. basically serial dilution on a grand scale.. bit of an oxymoron but that’s the best way I can explain it.. this is the vision I have about what’s going on with my methodIf you already understood my method, I apologize.

I don’t have links to this because I haven’t seen it done before.. you are in the link to this lol. As far as links to cube spores sharing genes from different varieties, I’ll take a look and see if I can find some info when I’m not at work but I doubt outside of growers like us, it’s not going to be documented but I’m pretty sure ppl on this website have done it.. I forget who but again I’ll check later if I remember.

Faht

Edited by fahtster, 25 November 2020 - 06:31 PM.

[thafunkyone]

No.. I was just showing my endeavors with regular peu.. haven’t done or had LPEU yet.

I feel ya on just looking for unique fruits.. that’s cool too!
 

 

Hey man.

Like I said, I'm always open for exchanges and willing to talk about things.
I tried hard to have a conversation with you and asked questions about your points which you completely avoided over multiple comments.

We could have had a nice conversation about the topic but exchange without exchange is just a game and nothing productive.

Hippie3, RR, Workman and many other people have made crosses that are out there since like 10-15 years now.

Back then alot of things were just plain speculation and turned out to be wrong over time.

To correct things that are wrong has nothing to do with attacking, like I said, I tried hard to have a conversation to change your mind based on things we know now but that wasn't possible so at some point it got actually frustrating and there was nothing left than to clearly say that things are wrong.

This is not to act like a smartass or to win a debate, its to avoid wrong info from being shared and you mentioned 20 years of experience so its very likely that people believe what you've put out.

_______

The reason why I made an account here on topia is the rules that people gotta be respectful (on facebook and shroomery for example people are disgusting), and the bad advice rule here.

To see something thats clearly out of date and to not correct it is how we support wrong info being spread and in my eyes theres nothing wrong with having a conversation about those things, actually the opposite - people will dislike me even more for saying this but to ignore wrong stuff is like watching away when someone gets beat up.

I'm not here to make friends, its something that might or might not happen but not my main goal, I'm online to learn and share.
Always open for productive conversations but it has to be a conversation and not a game

I went back and read my posts to see where we've gotten to this point in the conversation and feel you may have taken things the wrong way- I am simply asking how this works. like I said, when I started this shit people weren't really doing crosses or breeding and the prevailing wisdom is you could not cross mushrooms- back then they were using Rattlesnake venom to break cell walls to allow mycelia to hybridize, and I haven't seen faht harvesting venom on here recently so I don't think this is the route he's taking, it would be fucking badass if it was though. that was the theory of the redboy. also, they were breeding on agar, sectoring out dikaryons and placing those together with hopes they will merge, which he said takes literally hundreds of tries. None of these are simplisitic as putting 2 MS solutions into the same spawn, which was thought to basically just have competing strains in the same spawn but not produce a hybrid. They would plainly tell you it was not a cross and it didn't work that way.

So, yes there were 1 or 2 people in the OMC doing this- they weren't publicizing it at all nor were they documenting their work. and they were adamant that you could not produce a hybrid using 2 different spore swabs in the way faht is. Since we're a decade or so past these projects and I haven't been following everything going on there may have been many changes, and rather than read 10 years of posts I asked anyone to point me in the direction of anything that would get me up to date. Things are different now, the whole cubie game has been monentized to a much larger extent with a much larger following, and there (should) be a lot more information. I hope my explanation tells you where I'm coming from, why I'm questioning things, and what I'm looking for as far as information goes. You want to correct wrong information, and I have repeatedly said I'd like the information and send me links so I can be corrected. that was my original intent of posting in this thread. I can grow a fucking cubie ten ways, but I'm not up to date on the current topics. It's not hard to understand how to make mycelia once you know what it likes and dislikes, but making something new is another ballgame.

I've made many friends in this community over the years, online and IRL, some of my best friends are from this website. If you ever choose to have friends here I think you'll find some of the best people are the weird dudes that grow mushrooms and talk about it.

The hybridization of cube to cube can be done if you have single spores of each variety Clamp onto each other and share genes that way.. ppl have done it through serial dilution.. my take on venom was that it’s more for the combining of different species such as azures and cubes. My method isn’t just taking ms solution of 2 varieties and inoculating grains.. although I’m trying that as well but don’t give it much optimism.. my method is like taking single spores of each variety and putting them next to each but on a grand scale.

This is done by first layering the spores on top of each other and then using the hundreds,if not thousands of tiny strands from the swab tips those spores are layered on and grinding the two layers together (by rubbing the tips together)... the fibers from the two swab tips interlock with each other as they’re rubbed.. this breaks up the spore clumps of each individual variety, making new clumps where single spores of each are interwoven and places next to each other on tiny bits of swab strands that come off in the water.. basically serial dilution on a grand scale.. bit of an oxymoron but that’s the best way I can explain it.. this is the vision I have about what’s going on with my methodIf you already understood my method, I apologize.

I don’t have links to this because I haven’t seen it done before.. you are in the link to this lol. As far as links to cube spores sharing genes from different varieties, I’ll take a look and see if I can find some info when I’m not at work but I doubt outside of growers like us, it’s not going to be documented but I’m pretty sure ppl on this website have done it.. I forget who but again I’ll check later if I remember.

Faht

 

So the prevailing theory we've got here: this is basically the same thing as running hundreds of slants to see what takes. I can dig it. love it. placing single spored dikaryotes in slants together is a massive crapshoot, ya might as well run em all at once and see what sticks.

 

How many times have you run this before you get something like this? I'm just trying to figure how often this can be repeated. Back in the day spore swabs were definitely not the preferred method- prints agar and innoculation loops or syringes or LC but swabs it seems like were used collecting wild specimen and cleaning up from there. 

 

I just learned 10 years worth of shit in 5 minutes...;) 

[fahtster]

This is the first time.. so I’m trying to contain my excitement and not jump to wording with finality to the their tone but at the same time I’m trying to incite excitement in others to try it as well.. the widespread apparent success over multiple cakes’ inoculation points leads me to the assumption that I can repeat this and plan on it.. I’ve already got a few PE/pfrs double swabs I made a few days ago but I didn’t have both those varieties sporelating at the same time.. I had a few PE swabs already and simply took them and used em to swab the pfrs on top and then just put them in new swab packaging (tossed the unused swabs that were in the new packs). So, I’m a little reluctant to use those since I have PE coming in and pfrs and crs all going to be fruiting at the same time and I’d rather swab both varieties to the same swab fresh.. plus I want to layer the varieties in the swab by going back and forth between each cap to create even more infusion. Either way, I’ll be moving forward with another attempt shortly. And the F2 are gonna be telling

So, I’m kinda sticking my neck out reputation wise but I wouldn’t do that without a pretty confident feeling that all the logic lines up and I can definitely repeat. I’ll eat my words and apologize profusely if this was somehow a fluke one-off.. I’m not one to spread misinformation (knowingly).

I really want others to try it.. even if I repeat it, I need more hands-on peer review. So, this post is really the only way to light a fire under ppl to give it a whirl.. it’s just so easy

Speaking “putting two different ms SS in one grain” method, I had some vendor syringes and just mixed some pe and crs SS and put them to rye in a 16qt.. not really expecting anything but growth of both.. but thought I’d try it out. I did a 3/4 CV top layer on one side and then a 1/4” CV and a 1/4” jiffy mix casing on the other side.. got pins coming up now



Faht

Edited by fahtster, 25 November 2020 - 10:05 PM.

[thafunkyone]

I'll give it a whirl. I'm getting a new spot set up, should be done in the next couple weeks, will have room for 'experiments'...would mixing spore prints in a solution be the same? or you think it has to be swabbed? i guess we've got nothing but time. 

[fahtster]

No.. I would think that’s the first thing ppl tried and because of the way spores clump together, you’d have a much tougher time getting the two varieties to “mate” with each other just free floating in liquid.. I’m sure it still happens.. that’s what I’m trying with the PE/CRS tub up there.. I shot the two vendor syringes into a single sterile jar and sucked the solution up into the same syringe.. I expect maaaaaybe a cross here and there but mostly one variety or the others’ fruits throughout the tub. It’s the sandwiching of the spores on top of each other and then grinding of them between swab fibers that breaks up each varieties spore clumps and reclumps them with a mix of both varieties that makes a cross almost sure to happen.. this is my theory anyway about what’s happening.

Printing caps on top of each other would give you a better chance than what I did with the mixing of SS in a sterile jar, I would think.

Again, these are just things I’ve thought through... the F2 will give me more info on if I’m correct or not

Faht

[Arathu]

Very interesting stuff......wonder what a gently and continuously stirring/stirred LC of two strains would do.....???? Thinking out loud.....

 

This is definitely the New Library at Alexandria......

 

Nice work faht et al.....

 

I LOVE this friggin place!

 

A

[Moby]

Very interesting stuff......wonder what a gently and continuously stirring/stirred LC of two strains would do.....???? Thinking out loud.....

 

This is definitely the New Library at Alexandria......

 

Nice work faht et al.....

 

I LOVE this friggin place!

 

A

 

Wasn't sure if I should bring that up but now that you mentioned putting living myc together.

 

A guy who crossed my way last year threw Enigma with another cube together and that happened

 

 

 

 

Looks like the myc doesn't just swap genes in the mono period but also later when they already are strains.

 

I got no more info about this tho

[fahtster]

Nice.. those are crazy lol

Faht

[Arathu]

No doubt....and I'm completely out of likes.......just freaky looking awesome!

 

A

[Moby]

Yea those are great.

 

https://mycology.fan...iki/Anastomosis

 

Might have happened in this process.

Crossing by finding compatible strains of two varieties and throw them together to fuse ?!

 

Mycology rocks

 

(again off topic sry)

Edited by DickMoby, 26 November 2020 - 06:29 PM.

[fahtster]

Definitely relevant imo, DM!

So I fruited that last pea+ cake from the first 4 I made (I tried some invitro things just to play around and it didn’t fruit so I put it in a ziplock FC).. it grew a massive dong



At least I think it’s straight PE.. I guess I’ll see if it drops spores or not.. I’m prepping things to clone it RN.. like 99% it’s PE.. either way, I want it as a culture lol

Faht

Edited by fahtster, 27 November 2020 - 09:46 PM.

[Freaky]

I wonder if the veil and veil tear can help with visual as well when it comes to viewing possible crosses like this.  PE veils are a bit different from most cube strains and they also tear early in the process. Not sure how the AA+ veils are normally as I've never grown them but wondering if there are other visual or fruitbody factors besides the cap shape and color you could use that might help confirm crossed fruitbodies vs non.

Edited by Freaky, 28 November 2020 - 01:34 AM.

[fahtster]

You’re totally right Aa+ veils stay on and stretch long and I just checked it again and it’s dropping spores so it looks like I’ve got a badass pea+ fruit :). I’m super Stoked! Probably just has a lot of the PE pheno going on.



Faht

Edited by fahtster, 28 November 2020 - 01:55 AM.

[Freaky]

Those are great pictures - and those veils are definitely not the norm on any PE I've grown or seen.  And the spores are very dark.  Super stoked about this!  

 

I love the look of those - the thick dense PE stalk/stem with a nice witches hat.  The color on the cap has almost a white outer ring too.