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#1 FLASHINGROOSTER

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Posted 15 February 2021 - 03:01 PM

So looking to grow me some of that psychedelic cactus. Within a few minutes of searching there was an old link on here saying that cultivated lophophora W would produce very little of the alkaloids present in the wild versions. A little help here, is this true? Do I even have the right species?

 

http://www.cactusped..._williamsii.htm

 

Pretty clueless at this point

 

Its legal to grow here so I did find a guy who sells seeds. But not sure what to even buy?

 

https://magicactus.com/seedsales.html



#2 pharmer

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Posted 15 February 2021 - 03:24 PM

Others will have more to add about peyote. I don't have the patience to grow it.

 

Unless you're stuck on that idea you'll get more of the stuff you're looking for from columnar cactus. The names you need to know are Trichocereus Bridgesii, Trichocereus Peruvianus, and Trichocereus Pachanoi. IMHO they are desireable in the order listed.

 

The advantage of these as opposed to peyote is the time it takes to grow enough to consume in a single plant. It could be five years with peyote but only two with the listed columnar cactii. Columns grow like crazy once established and ten of them can regenerate themselves as quickly as you and a friend can find time to enjoy the experience

 

There's no reason you can't do both. Get some columns going as soon as the weather will permit, and get some peyote seeds going. If you're thumb is at all green you'll be consuming your own columns in a couple years while watching your single priceless buttons growing for at least another three years.  You'll hear people here say they treasure their buttons too much to eat them :)


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#3 Alpoehi

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Posted 15 February 2021 - 03:42 PM

Peyote are wonderful and very precious cacti. But they are slow-growers unless you graft them. I heard it is considered illegal in the U.S.A to grow peyote cactus.

I tried to harvest some of mine and when I dried them I had only 20 grams. Way too less for an experience of the other kind with that amount.

 

A good alternative is growing Trichocereus, pharmer already mentioned what to look for. The best way to do that is not from seeds although it is an option.

The faster way is getting large cuttings, rooting them and letting the pups grow from them.

A good size of a cutting can be 3 to 4 inches in diameter and 10 inches long.

 

Also you need time with cacti, always.

An example: I purchased a trichocereug bridgesii cutting, 16 inches long and 4 inched diameter. Unrooted.

It took 5 (!)  months for it to root. Then it took 3 months for it to grow again. That was last summer.

This summer, hopefully, it will thrive some pups. Once that happens they will grow very fast.

 

That's the way it is with cacti, be it cuttings or seedlings.


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#4 Sicshroom

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Posted 16 February 2021 - 09:04 AM

I have no experience consuming these cacti but I am growing all the ones named above. If you start from seeds I would suggest getting alot of them. With purchased yote seeds vs ones that were gifted to me. The purchased ones only had 10% germination rate on 4 different purchases.... this is what drove me to grafting yotes so I can produce my own seeds... the seeds that were gifted to me had 95% success rate. They were fresh and that was the biggest difference. Trichocereus seeds seem to be viable more as I just started 20 seeds from a purchase last year and 17 sprouted. Ad for your reference to alkaloids production I believe the general consensus is that in green house conditions that are favorable the plants can put on more growth in a short amount of time.this leads to large beautiful plants The alkaloids though are a defense mechanism that doesn't deposit as fast as the plant grows. Imagine adding a drop of food color to a glass of water at the rate of one drop per day. If your vessel holding the water stays the same size in one week you will see how the color better. But if you increase the size of the vessel as well the color Won't be as strong. This is the closest way I know to explain why huge indoor yotes will be less potent then harder grown ones. My oldest yotes I've grown from seed are 2cm across but I've seen 4 month old seedlings that size too.
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#5 Skywatcher

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Posted 16 February 2021 - 09:53 AM

Nice to see you delving into the "cactophile" playground Flash.

I agree with all the advice you have received, and would add that you will find cacti cultivation an enjoyable exercise in patience.

 

Stress to the cacti increases the alkaloid content. The trick is to keep it within reason and not attempt to keep your cactus living on the nearest edge to the danger zone. I base this on my own experience. I have a San Pedro I started with 40+years ago. I have consumed portions many times over the years. I found that the cactus I kept growing at home in a mild but warm climate was reliably good.

 

The very same cactus taken from a cutting and planted at a vacation home in the desert, in ground, is subjected to the harshness of the southwest desert. If not planted in the shade of a tree and given water when someone was there occasionally, it would not be able to survive. This cactus is much slower growing, but reliably  much more potent than it's source cactus in a much milder climate extreme.

 

I am one of those that would not eat my peyote I have spent over ten years growing. You will understand after you spend years growing them, that they acquire their own unique personalities, and become like friends whose company you enjoy....

(that's not the only whacky cactus grower belief you might hear around here)


Edited by Skywatcher, 16 February 2021 - 04:23 PM.

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#6 FLASHINGROOSTER

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Posted 16 February 2021 - 07:32 PM

Hey thanks guy's that is the direction I needed to get pointed in. Some solid advice in there. I have a ton of learning to do.

 

Looks like that website has some Trichocereus Peruvians in stock so that might be the ticket, the other two are sold out at the moment. Not to say I can't go in search of some other distributors as well. Perhaps I will add some peyote for fun and then temper my expectations a bit . Seems like a good starting point to me. Better to find out now than a few years later when the limited amount of peyote I grew isn't even enough to blast me off into space.

 

I can see why a guy might decide not to risk cutting it after spending all that time watching it grow.

 

The cactus seems to be one of the lesser known cultivated plants like mushrooms so there is a bit of mystery excitement to it all. You guy's will probably laugh but I bought a tiny succulent planted pot a couple of months ago just to get my finger tips wet in the slow grow genre.

 

Patience is a virtue I often struggle with, these last couple weeks I have been trying to tell myself to just stop for ten seconds and take some slow deep breath's when feeling agitated. Like a mini meditation to clear the mind, I think there is some serious value there if a guy could remember to use it.

 

Anyway I do have another question regarding the seasons, should I worry about the amount of growth in the winter months at all? I know cactus grows around here naturally but we do have pretty harsh winters that can drop down to -35 in the winter.  So my Newbie plan is to build a small shelf on the south part of the house and let them grow outside in the summer, then bring inside in the winter months and expect a sort of hibernation state until summer resumes. I guess to simplify how worried about south facing sun and heat should I be inside my house in the winter. There is a perfect location in a basement room with a south window, I was hoping to keep it in there during the winter months. Or should I go with the warmer East facing window upstairs....I got my little succulent in an East facing window and it appears to be not dying at this point. But as far as growth goes well that's another story that I have no clue on


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#7 Sicshroom

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Posted 16 February 2021 - 07:58 PM

So I live an area where over wintering can be a challenge, I Two have cacti that thrive here but only opuntias and they winter hardy. For me I like to use supplemental lighting and a fan. My house stays around 70 to 74 and I use a timer to keep them in 14 hours of light a day. All my plants are in taracota pots and the fan with the pots makes for really good moisture control. 30 hours after watering the plants are dry again.
I like starting seeds in winter though to get full benefit of the natural light from spring to fall

Edited by Sicshroom, 16 February 2021 - 07:59 PM.

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#8 FLASHINGROOSTER

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Posted 17 February 2021 - 06:24 PM

OMG I am an idiot. I built myself a little cabinet/seed nursery for growing weed in so that would be about perfect for growing. It has the lights and everything.... Then again why don't I just share my grow room! Sorry guys I am like a kid lost in a forest with this stuff, since my grow room is inactive it didn't even dawn on me that it would be appropriate for cactus as well. Especially if those lights are going to be on anyway... DUH

 

Okay I think I have a very basic plan formulated


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#9 Skywatcher

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Posted 17 February 2021 - 06:46 PM

If you opt to start some loph seeds, temperature is key and you will need to rig some shade for the germinated seeds as they burn easily.


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#10 FLASHINGROOSTER

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Posted 17 February 2021 - 07:06 PM

Thanks Sky, every little piece helps me put the puzzle together



#11 Skywatcher

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Posted 17 February 2021 - 07:18 PM

You have but to ask...................

:biggrin:


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#12 Arathu

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Posted 17 February 2021 - 09:12 PM

Right here is where I started quite some time ago now....... ^^^^^ he helped then too......thanks Sky......

 

I have a LOT of cactus now.......I think I love them all....

 

A


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#13 Alpoehi

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Posted 18 February 2021 - 06:35 AM

OMG I am an idiot. I built myself a little cabinet/seed nursery for growing weed in so that would be about perfect for growing. It has the lights and everything.... Then again why don't I just share my grow room! Sorry guys I am like a kid lost in a forest with this stuff, since my grow room is inactive it didn't even dawn on me that it would be appropriate for cactus as well. Especially if those lights are going to be on anyway... DUH

 

Okay I think I have a very basic plan formulated

 

So you already have the optimal environment for growing from seed.

Remember: Lophophora seeds require light for germination.

They find their way into the ground in a magical way.

 

Good luck!


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#14 FLASHINGROOSTER

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Posted 24 February 2021 - 04:12 PM

[Direct Link]

 

Watched the two episodes of that hamiltons pharmacopia, one about sand pedro and the other peyote. Watching the love some of those growers show to their peyote was inspiring. When hamilton asked the one grower if he considered them magic he responded by saying that every morning he says a prayer and talks to his cacti. The shamanistic angle of spitting on everything in the san pedro episode was lost on me but I can get into rituals whether I believe in them or not. There is something there that I can respect. The line where the guy is talking about how other religions focus on a great book, where as focusing on a magical mysterious cactus that has possibly "taught" millions of souls over the span of human existence seems more fitting to me. Religions will come and go but the cactus remains

 

[Direct Link]

 

Way down the road for me yet but It was neat to see how they graft the cacti together to promote faster peyote growth. I imagine a few of you have had success with that method before?



#15 rockyfungus

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Posted 25 February 2021 - 08:24 AM

https://mycotopia.ne...ctures-welcome/

Have fun...Tons of cacti info here


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