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Extracting mescaline from dried Peruvianus skins


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#1 el_ronhub_bird

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Posted 11 April 2021 - 08:25 PM

I've got about 400g of skins that I got from icarosDNA that I'd like to turn into pure white mescaline HCl. I spent yesterday reading several different extraction methods on different websites. I'm generally familiar with the a/b extraction process from a few MHRB extractions I've done over the past couple years. Also from that, I already have almost everything I need to get going on this extraction as far as supplies. I'm not certain what method to go with yet. Most that I've read don't vary greatly from the a/b process outlined in the Marsofold tek that I followed for most of my MHRB extractions. However in one thread Phineas Carmichael outlines a method similar to the Gordo tek that I followed for my very first MHRB extraction, except this was for cactus. But same procedure; mix powdered plant material with hydrated lime, then add water to make a paste, or dough. But this is a straight to base though, isn't it? Is one of these methods obviously superior to the other when it comes to cacti (a/b vs. STB)? Or is it a matter of preference or maybe circumstance? For some of the methods that I had read, time was a critical consideration in creating the tek. I am in no rush at all to get this done so that will have no bearing on how I choose to proceed. Thanks to anyone who chimes in!

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#2 Norman

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Posted 11 April 2021 - 08:39 PM

Just powder them fine and do this -
https://mycotopia.ne...ith-pics/page-1
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#3 Phineas_Carmichael

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Posted 11 April 2021 - 10:57 PM

I second that, Norman! Powder the skins & treat it like Marsofold's MHRB with an additional salting step. Boil 3x with citric acid (or vinegar) water & once with plain water. Filter out the sludge & reduce the volume of the combined extract by boiling. Then extract with xylene a few times to get rid of some Other Stuff before basifying with NaOH and extracting with xylene again. Salt the mescaline out of the xylene with aqueous HCl & clean it up with cold anhydrous acetone.

https://mycotopia.ne...und-with-pedro/
Is a decade old extraction write-up (broken pic links and all) of an STB tek, although the salting at the end basically makes it an A/B extraction just done in reverse. It was never intended to be a TEK for anyone to follow!

The cactus dough can be a little finnicky, and getting all the xylene out is a PITA. That Drytek is better than aqueous STB cactus extraction IMO, especially methods that call for freezing to separate the layers, but nowhere near as clean & polished as the method Greenskeeper used in Norman's link above. Especially if you've got the time and the space to do it right.

[EDIT] I think that starting with dried & powdered material might allow one to skip the freezing & pectinase steps in Greenskeeper's report, as they are mostly for breaking down cell walls in the large chunks of fresh cactus used. What do you think, Norman? Greenskeeper, if you're listening, please chime in too!

Edited by Phineas_Carmichael, 12 April 2021 - 12:54 AM.

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#4 DarkNchildlike

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Posted 12 April 2021 - 12:02 AM

I'm really interested in the fact I'm seeing alot of cactus extractions lately. Relatively anyways. I to am waiting on some cactus powder. Got sent the wrong package once and waiting for a recompense.. that hurt.. was totally ready to go and everything..


I myself am planning to do maybe two different extractions. I'll be doing boils and then xylene then salt out with a FASA.

The next tek I wanna try will be basically the same hcl set up talked about.

Also there is a new experiment ppl are tweaking atm at the nexus where they are using ethyl acetate and using citric acid to crash a mescaline citrate salt. Seems promising? Some ppl have had problems it seems like tho, still tweaking.

Even if it ain't all good. It's all good enough.

#5 greenskeeper

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Posted 12 April 2021 - 12:33 AM

I agree with Norman and Phineas.

 

I haven't tried using dry cactus. I've tried getting xylene out of thick wet cactus mash and it was a disaster.

I was just reading the Marsofold's tek and it's very similar. They do a couple of acidic water extractions on the plant matter whereas I did one, mainly because I had so much bulky material to work with. Do it three times to get the most out of the plant matter.

If you grind the cactus to fine powder I guess you can leave out the freezing. I've had success without using pectinase too.

 

Grind it up, boil it up....


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#6 greenskeeper

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Posted 12 April 2021 - 01:00 AM

DarkNchildlike Have you done precipitation with FASA before? I haven't, all I know about it is what I read in Kash's A/B mescaline extraction. I'd like to try it as a purification step but I don't know where to get fumaric acid or clean methanol.


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#7 Norman

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Posted 12 April 2021 - 02:56 AM

Can you do a FASA precip on alks dissolved in xylene?
Fumaric acid can be had from bulk dry foods supply places. It’s used as an additive in keeping a low pH for preserving food.
The yellow bottle of HEET fuel additive is methanol. Don’t get the red it’s ISO.
Yeah I don’t see a need for a freeze with dry material. I don’t see a reason not to use pectinase though. Cant hurt.
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#8 greenskeeper

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Posted 12 April 2021 - 06:11 AM

Unfortunately Heet is not sold in this part of the world and I can't find fumaric acid for sale either - I have no idea why. I might be able to buy fumaric on eBay but the price+shipping is outrageous.



#9 el_ronhub_bird

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Posted 12 April 2021 - 10:06 AM

greenskeeper your recent mescaline thread is just fantastic! I've read it over a few times already. I can tell you put lots of effort into it, so thanks, we really appreciate it! It'll definitely be a huge help to me in my current endeavor. I feel totally privileged that there are already many people that I look up to around here chiming in on this thread! Thanks to the OG chemists for having enough patience to walk us noobs through these processes step by step. Looks like for now I'll just be collecting a little more supplies and powdering up these skins. I'll post again whenever there is some action
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#10 greenskeeper

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Posted 12 April 2021 - 05:11 PM

Great! looking forward to the progress reports :)



#11 el_ronhub_bird

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Posted 15 April 2021 - 01:20 PM

With pectin being the substance responsible for the gel-iness of jams and jellies, is it also responsible for the dreaded snot or slime that often manifests during cactus extractions? If so is this the reason for the pectinase?
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#12 greenskeeper

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Posted 15 April 2021 - 06:02 PM

Yeah, that's part of it. I don't really know what's behind the snotty mucoid nature of that stuff but I bet pectin is involved. That snot can largely be resolved by vigorous boiling in water.

I know that pectinase/pectolyase is used in wine- and juice-making industries to speed up the juicing process and improve the sedimentation/clarifying.

 

I've not been very scientific with the use of pectinase - I got so tired of xylene/aqueous emulsions that I added fine-filtering, a load of salt, and pectinase to the process all at once. It works! :)

So far I have not been inspired enough to evaluate each of those changes in isolation.


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#13 Chips101

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Posted 15 April 2021 - 09:03 PM

Very interested. keep going. It's like watching someone open a present.

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#14 el_ronhub_bird

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Posted 16 April 2021 - 01:49 PM

The vendor who i got my MHRB from recently put a listing for some san pedro powder on their website. Their bark was legit so it definitely peaked my interest. I know this doesn't guarantee anything about the SP powder but i think I'll give it a shot. Their lowest listing is for an ounce, I think I might grab that to test for potency before grabbing a couple kilos, ya know? In this case, I would wanna do a quick and dirty extraction just to see if the product is holding. Anyways, whatever I do regarding mescaline extraction I'll document in this thread
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#15 DarkNchildlike

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Posted 16 April 2021 - 08:23 PM

I would really love to find a good vendor on some powder or chips. I just got ripped off trying to obtain some for $170 :( :(

Even if it ain't all good. It's all good enough.

#16 Phineas_Carmichael

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Posted 17 April 2021 - 01:20 AM

IcarosDNA has consistently been a great vendor for a long, long, long time. Their ordering process is intimidating but their product is consistently excellent. My buddy Freddie and I got lucky with the powder he bought (from a trusted MHRB vendor who was a Mycotopia Sponsor at the time) a decade ago.

One ounce (28 grams) of cactus powder at 1% is 280mg of mescaline if everything goes perfectly. A quick and dirty extraction better yield 100% of the alkaloids if you want to test the material for a +/- experience...

Edited by Phineas_Carmichael, 17 April 2021 - 01:57 AM.


#17 el_ronhub_bird

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Posted 17 April 2021 - 11:16 AM

IcarosDNA has consistently been a great vendor for a long, long, long time. Their ordering process is intimidating but their product is consistently excellent. My buddy Freddie and I got lucky with the powder he bought (from a trusted MHRB vendor who was a Mycotopia Sponsor at the time) a decade ago.

One ounce (28 grams) of cactus powder at 1% is 280mg of mescaline if everything goes perfectly. A quick and dirty extraction better yield 100% of the alkaloids if you want to test the material for a +/- experience...

I've read nothing but positive reports on icaros' product, here and every other corner of the interwebz. I believe he was a sponsored vendor here when I first joined in 2007. To make a long story short, I sent him payment in the beginning of January and just now recieved the first half of my order and probably won't see the second half for close to a month from now. I know this isn't his fault, it's just part of the game. It would just be cool to have a viable second option

Edited by el_ronhub_bird, 17 April 2021 - 03:59 PM.

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#18 el_ronhub_bird

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Posted 17 April 2021 - 04:05 PM

Would any of you guys already experienced with mescaline mind telling us what was your dosage and what strength was the trip it provided?

@Phineas when I said "test for potency" I meant the extraction itself, not a bioassay. Anything gained from the small extraction would just get tossed in with the larger extraction
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#19 greenskeeper

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Posted 17 April 2021 - 04:54 PM

In Somebody Who Is Obviously Me's experience;

 

< 80 mg can be hard to distinguish from placebo

150mg really adds to enjoying music, beautiful walks. At this dose SWIOM becomes sensitive to gravity waves.

200mg shows it phenylethylamine nature - a bit like MDMA but trippier. Love the music!

300mg Tripping. Music is Trees are so beautiful.

600mg Trees. Trees. Bees. Wow. SWIOM cried with awe at the end of it.

 

Just one person's experience.


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#20 pharmer

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Posted 17 April 2021 - 06:14 PM

the consensus over the years appears to be that 500mg of decently extracted but not necessarily pure mesc is one dose for one person of average weight. Let's call that 180 pounds.

 

Your mileage may vary. It takes me more than that to get the wobbly legged euphoria with pastel hallucinations Shulgin Scale 4 trip. I'm a little over 200 pounds. Except for the 20 pounds of frontal cortex that's all manly muscle :)

 

I'd guess a 130 newb would be seriously entertained by 300mg


Edited by pharmer, 17 April 2021 - 06:15 PM.

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