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HPBCD DMT sublingually active under tongue


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#21 tregar

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Posted 04 January 2022 - 03:24 PM

Recent improvment: Include everclear (95% ethanol) as a co-solvent with the water to increase the solubility of HP-B-CD's guest and consequently to improve the encaspsulation efficacy:
 
Note: the "concluding remarks" of the attached 2021 paper on HPBCD in post #2 mentions that so long as you keep the co-solvent ethanol concentration below 30%, it does not compete with the guest for entry or encapsulation into the cyclodextrin cavity.
 
60mg dmt dissolves into 3 drops everclear
70mg dmt dissolves into 3 drops everclear
80mg dmt dissolves into 4 drops everclear
90mg dmt dissolves into 4 drops everclear
100mg dmt dissolves into 5 drops everclear
 
A great way to ensure near 100% dissolution:
 
1) first place your 60mg dmt onto spoon
2) add appropriate 3 drops of everclear to dissolve, mix & crush until completely dissolved (10 to 15 seconds)
3) then add 10 drops of near boiling hot water from a nearby coffee mug if using 90mg dmt or less, or 12 drops of water if using over 90mg (100 to 120mg dmt)
4) mix the everclear dissolved dmt and water together
5) then add your 420mg HPBCD powder (to keep at a 1:1 molar ratio, use 1:7mg dmt to hpbcd, use 1:8mg dmt to 2-HPBCD if using the more common 2-HPBCD) on to the spoon
6) Crush/mix all together for 2 minutes, this forms a practically 100% HPBCD complexed DMT solution for application under tongue, no stray dmt is seen floating around.
 
I prepared 60mg HPBCD DMT this way today and was impressed at how well it all dissolved together, only way I will use it from now on. I love the addition of the co-solvent. Will post pic later.
 
I will only be using this co-solvent addition method in the future for near 100% dissolution of the DMT.

Edited by tregar, 04 January 2022 - 04:39 PM.


#22 tregar

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Posted 05 January 2022 - 08:52 AM

Don't use the method above in post #21, the everclear dissolved DMT clumps when water addition added. Method below works perfect, have used it over 44 times:
 
In closing, post #1 has complete instructions and pictures all updated for 1-1-2022 on sublingual HPBCD DMT & summary of over 44 sublingual experiences in a year's time, these experiences all much stronger than oral DMT by many factors. Zero nausea, zero dizziness, zero anxiety or un-easy feelings, deep head space, highly visual, strong open eyed and CEV's of spinning & dancing geometrics & real Ayahuasca visions, incredible music enhancement, way over the top open eyed beauty, neon colorful & highly euphoric, see trip reports bottom of post #1...will continue to use for the rest of my life, highly recommend: https://www.dmt-nexu...?g=posts&t=9686
 
From post #1:
 
My procedure:
1) place 60mg of DMT onto a spoon
2) add 1:1 molar ratio of host drug to HPBCD powder, this means 1:7 mg ratio DMT to HPBCD, use a 1:8 mg ratio DMT to HPBCD if you are using the 2-Hydroxypropyl-β-cyclodextrin.
3) this means 60mg dmt placed on spoon, then add 420mg of HPBCD on top DMT, use 480mg HPBCD if you are using the 2-Hydroxypropyl-β-cyclodextrin.
4) add 10 drops of very hot near boiling water to the mix from a nearby microwaved coffee mug for DMT doses of 90mg or below, use 12 drops of boiling hot water to mix DMT doses over 90mg (such as 100 to 120mg). 60mg DMT = +3 Shulgin level strength, 90 to 120mg = +5 Shulgin level life changing strength.
5) Knead or crush the HPBCD powder into the dmt using the end of a spoon for 2 minutes, scrape & mix everything back and forth hard using your muscles. This is how scientist pre-pare these complexes by kneading.
6) Hold a lighter under the spoon to heat up spoon for around 20 seconds or so, until the solution just starts to boil, then pull flame away, so that complete dissolution or dissolving takes place, after heating up, mix the contents a little bit more before using, see pics.
7) Take 150 to 300mg tetrahydroharmine orally around 45 minutes before. Place 35mg of freebase harmine under your tongue. Then place bottom of your tongue onto HPBCD complexed DMT spoon, the HPBCD DMT glob will all adhere as HPBCD powder forms sticky complexes. Be sure to take the 35mg harmine and HPBCD DMT under tongue all at the exact same time in order to activate the DMT strongly.
 
Hold under tongue for 10 to 12 or 15 minutes depending on dosage, press down with bottom of tongue the whole time to trap sticky liquid complex in the sublingual mucosa. Be sure to use bottom end of tongue to lick any off spoon that is left behind, you want to get it all.
 
At end of 15 minutes, spit out any saliva into a cup instead of swallowing. Gently relieve any saliva during the 15 minute period as comfort dictates by leaning your head forward and spitting into a cup, but keep your tongue pressed down any time you relieve saliva. There is a mild to moderate sting felt but it's so worth enduring for the effects in 22 minutes. The sting does not bother me at all. The tongue is completely fine afterwards (no burn), and it's as if nothing happened the next day.
 
Attached 1: Sublingual Mucosa as a route for systemic drug delivery by Narang, Sharma, 2010.
 
Attached 2: Thermodynamic properties of hydroxypropyl‑β‑cyclodextrin/guest interaction: a survey of recent studies by D'Aria, Pagano, Giancola, 2021.
 
Pic 1: 300mg pure THH for oral use in weigher, 35mg harmine fb for sublingual use next to it, 60mg dmt fb in spoon, 420mg HPBCD white powder above it, coffee mug of near boiling hot water, medicine dropper pipette, Bic lighter.
 
Pic 2: 60mg DMT was covered with x 7 or 420mg HPBCD powder and 10 drops of near boiling hot water from a nearby coffee mug was added, and all mashed and stirred well for 2 minutes, then Bic lighter held under spoon until the solution just started to boil (20 seconds or so), then pull flame away, notice how well the DMT complexed inside the HPBCD. Mix a few more seconds before using. 
 
Take 150 to 300mg tetrahydroharmine 45 minutes earlier orally, place 35mg harmine under tongue, then place tongue on to HPBCD complexed DMT spoon, it will all adhere for sublingual use. Journey starts in 22 minutes after application and lasts x 90 minutes, at which time you can re-dose x 2 more times, each dose just as strong as 1st dose for a 4.5 hour long strong journey with super-long afterglow. Instructions, 5 hour CEV trip report and 9 pics here on post #1.
 
sublingual HPBCD complexed DMT pics.PNG


#23 tregar

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Posted 08 January 2022 - 12:50 PM

"Cyclodextrins used as excipients" pdf, European Medicines Agency, Oct 9, 2017:, under "Kinetics":
Cyclodextrins at high doses can increase drug permeability by direct action on mucosal membranes and enhance drug absorption and/or bioavailability. These effects are possibly caused by solubilisation of membrane lipids through inclusion complexation with cyclodextrins and the ability of cyclodextrins to cause perturbation of membrane integrity. However, unlike detergents, cyclodextrins solubilize membrane components without entering into the membrane, therefore the perturbing effects of cyclodextrins are mild and reversible [7].Cyclodextrins are absorbed poorly via mucosal membranes.
HPBCD enhances the drug permeability of guest complexed drug, but the cyclodextrins themselves are poorly absorbed via the sublingual mucosa.
 
"Cyclodextrins used as excipients" pdf, European Medicines Agency, Oct 9, 2017: page 5 of 16 under "Oral products, Kinetics":
The oral bioavailability of cyclodextrins is very low in adult animals and humans (0.1–3%), except for RM-β-CD, which has a bioavailability of 12% in rats. Because of their bulky and hydrophilic nature only insignificant amounts of cyclodextrins are absorbed from the gastrointestinal tract by passive diffusion [33, 27]. 
 
This pharmacology has been used to potentiate these freebase drugs ORALLY as well -- in my experience, this results in an Ayahuasca experience that is strong in potency. Example: HPBCD improves oral absorption profile for Ofloxacin, a second generation fluroquinolones by 54 to 89 percent.
 
I've used HPBCD complexed DMT orally three times stirred into a 1oz hot water tea (it dissolves instantly) with 150 to 300mg THH + 160 to 200mg harmine with a bit of citric acid to help the harmalas dissolve, and it's also way more potent than normal DMT freebase or salts used orally, very reminiscent of my over 70 Hawaiian psychotria brewed leaf teas, very strong & all encompassing. Trip report on page 2, post #25 of nexus link, see "HPBCD DMT" thread in Pharmahuasca section. 
 
But I vastly prefer the oral 150 to 300mg THH + sublingual Ayahuasca (35mg sublingual harmine fb + 60 to 100mg sublingual HPBCD DMT all taken at exact same time under tongue), many times stronger than oral DMT, and zero dizziness or un-easy feelings for me due to only 35mg harmine being used. Highly recommend for sensitive individuals like myself. Very strong & feels great all evening like mescaline, heavenly. 
 

Attached File  Sublingual mucosa as a route for systemic drug delivery.pdf   240.7KB   16 downloads

Attached File  Thermodynamic properties of hydroxypropyl Beta cyclodextrin and guest interaction, a survey of recent studies, 2021.pdf   854.1KB   19 downloads

Attached File  questions-answers-cyclodextrins-used-excipients-medicinal-products-human-use_en.pdf   273.35KB   17 downloads

Attached File  HPBCD solubility enhancement table for 68 drugs.pdf   61.76KB   22 downloads


Edited by tregar, 08 January 2022 - 06:28 PM.


#24 tregar

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Posted 14 January 2022 - 11:16 AM

For storage, I remove the plunger from a 3ml syringe (100 in a box for dirt cheap on-line) and backfill or pour the contents of the HPBCD complexed DMT spoon down the syringe for storage in a freezer long-term, to defrost, pull plunger out of syringe again (so pressure does not build up) and place syringe in a mug of hot water, contents will flow easily again. Shoot contents under tongue when cools down. Syringe tips lock onto the end of the syringe to prevent spillage or loss of contents. This is how I pre-pare the 2 additional doses for use at each 1.5 hour point for the evening and store at room temp. I like to trip strongly for 4.5 hours, so 3 doses total...but the afterglow continues way beyond this.

"Cyclodextrins used as excipients" pdf, European Medicines Agency, Oct 9, 2017: Page 11 of 16:

According to the data in section 2 one can conclude that below 20 mg/kg/day no serious adverse effects are to be expected for all routes of administration and no statement is deemed necessary.

Above 20 mg/kg/day, cyclodextrins may show some activity, and because there are insufficient safety data in children below two years old, it is advisable to inform about the quantity of cyclodextrin in the product and that for use in children below two years old, a doctor’s recommendation is needed.

Above 200 mg/kg/day cyclodextrins may theoretically cause problems in the digestive system when given orally, and cause mild renal toxicity when given parenteral, which information can be given. Depending on the amount, cyclodextrins may influence the Cyclodextrins used as excipients permeability of tissues and therefore the bioavailability of active substances given topically (nasal, rectal, dermal, ocular).

This is exactly the way I use the HPBCD sublingually, when I complex 90mg DMT to (x7) or 630mg of HPBCD, and I re-dose two more times every 1.5 hour, I am using 1890mg of HPBCD for the evening. I weigh 95kg, so I am using less than 20mg/kg/day or less than 1900mg per day. This always gives me a 4.5 hour long +5 Shulgin level strength experience with super-long afterglow. Very similar to 600mg plus of mescaline.

pic 1: 300mg of pure THH for oral use taken 45 minutes before, not shown: 35mg of freebase harmine for sublingual use taken at exact same under tongue as the 0.5ml (10 drop) 90mg DMT complexed to 630mg HPBCD stored in a 3ml syringe if desired.

Pic 2: Ibogaine and tetrahydroaharmine are in the same beta-carboline family. Alex Garant's artwork will have you seeing double.

 

HPBCD DMT 3ml syringe storage.PNG



#25 tregar

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Posted 15 January 2022 - 08:02 AM

Re-wrote above post as could not edit:

 

For storage, I remove the plunger from a 3ml syringe (100 in a box for dirt cheap on-line) and backfill or pour the contents of the HPBCD complexed DMT spoon down the syringe for storage in a freezer long-term, to defrost, pull plunger out of syringe again (so pressure does not build up) and place syringe in a mug of hot water, contents will flow easily again. Shoot contents under tongue when cools down. Syringe tips lock onto the end of the syringe to prevent spillage or loss of contents. This is how I pre-pare the 2 additional doses for use at each 1.5 hour point for the evening and store at room temp. I like to trip strongly for 4.5 hours, so 3 doses total...but the afterglow continues way beyond this.

 

"Cyclodextrins used as excipients" pdf, European Medicines Agency, Oct 9, 2017: Page 11 of 16:

According to the data in section 2 one can conclude that below 20 mg/kg/day no serious adverse effects are to be expected for all routes of administration and no statement is deemed necessary.

Above 20 mg/kg/day, cyclodextrins may show some activity, and because there are insufficient safety data in children below two years old, it is advisable to inform about the quantity of cyclodextrin in the product and that for use in children below two years old, a doctor’s recommendation is needed.

Above 200 mg/kg/day cyclodextrins may theoretically cause problems in the digestive system when given orally, and cause mild renal toxicity when given parenteral, which information can be given. Depending on the amount, cyclodextrins may influence the Cyclodextrins used as excipients permeability of tissues and therefore the bioavailability of active substances given topically (nasal, rectal, dermal, ocular).

This is exactly the way I use the HPBCD sublingually, when I complex 90mg DMT to (x7) or 630mg of HPBCD, and I re-dose two more times every 1.5 hour, I am using 1890mg of HPBCD for the evening. I weigh 95kg, so I am using less than 20mg/kg/day or less than 1900mg per day. This always gives me a 4.5 hour long +5 Shulgin level strength experience with super-long afterglow. Very similar to 600mg of mescaline.
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Read lots of questions concerning tetrahydroharmine or THH, so will add this in closing:

As a long time chemist, have years of experience with home-made pure THH, it does not convert back to harmaline, and I've had THH remain 100% stable for many years in a closet, that still glowed pale blue under blacklight, and worked just as well as the day it was made.

See post #13 of this thread for how to make it yourself with pictures in 1.5 hour using harmaline which you can often find on-line if don't want to start from scratch. All you need is a cheap stir mantel from *mazon, vinegar, 10% janitorial ammonia from hardware store, zinc dust, cotton ball in a funnel. I always encourage everyone to learn chemistry.

The liftmode THH paperwork indicates it is made in China, if it truly is over 99% pure, then by all means it should only glow pale blue. Any green in the glow means it has un-converted harmaline, how much is anyone's guess. Harmaline is sedating and causes nausea and dizziness at high doses.

pic 1: 300mg of pure THH for oral use taken 45 minutes before, not shown: 35mg of freebase harmine for sublingual use taken at exact same time under tongue as the 0.5ml (10 drop) 90mg DMT complexed to 630mg HPBCD stored in a 3ml syringe if desired.

Pic 2: Pure tetrahydroharmine glows pale blue under blacklight like LSD or psilocin, harmaline reduces to tetrahydroharmine by gaining a hydrogen atom. Tetrahydroharmine is in the same beta-carboline family as ibogaine, remarkable way beyond 4k monochrome (blue or green for me) closed eye teaching visions at 300mg for hours. No sedation, pleasant stimulation. Adding even small amounts of sublingual or oral HPBCD DMT adds color to the visions.

3ml HPBCD dmt syringe to store.PNG

 

THH.PNG


Edited by tregar, 15 January 2022 - 09:15 AM.


#26 tregar

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Posted 16 January 2022 - 10:05 AM

^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
In closing, complete TEK & summary of over a year of Ayahuasca experiences, 44 sublingual (counts 2 re-doses every 1.5 hour for 4.5 hour total strong journey) & 3 oral.
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
 
Physics envy said:
I tried the sublingual 2HPBCD / DMT combination last night (60mg n,n + 480mg 2HPBCD), along with 175mg oral Liftmode brand 'THH' and 25mg sublingual harmine. (I'm 150lbs, so I dropped the harmine dosage from Ava's recommended 35mg.)
 
I was very sensitive to the burn - it was almost intolerable and I will not be retrying this ROA. And it is still annoying the next day under my tongue.
 
I did it twice last night as the first time it did not work as I probably did not complex the mixture properly and also did not get the mixture off the spoon very well. So after an hour, I mixed a second batch, using the same amounts of 2HPBCD, dmt, and harmine. (I did not mix the harmine in, just placed it under my tongue for a minute before inserting the complexed mixture.)
 
The second batch of dmt DID work Very happy After about 10 minutes it started to come on, and it quickly became very strong with a few-minute rush, similar to a decent vaped dose.
 
However, it wore off about 10-15 minutes after it started.
 
I did not notice anything extra from the alleged THH. And I did not notice any lengthening of the experience from either the harmine nor the THH.
 
Before giving up on this liftmode THH, I'll try it again and up the dose to closer to 300mg in hopes that there is at least *some* THH in there. And I will use the oral method of complexing the dmt then melting it into hot water to drink along with the THH and maybe ~170mg harmine. Alternatively, I may try complexing the harmine and using it sublingually, upping the dose to 35mg.
 

 

 

Thanks for your report Physics envy. Congrats on getting it to work for 10 to 15 minutes. Up your harmine dose. Mine always lasts 90 minutes with very strong activity, this could be to me using 300mg home-made pure THH orally, as it does a fine job of preventing the inactivation of the DMT by MAO localized in the mitchondria of the cells of the brain.
 
I also use 35mg sublingual harmine fb (for my weight of 95kg) at exact same time under tongue as the sublingual HPBCD DMT, same power as x6 or 210mg oral harmine, both together give 90 minutes of +5 Shulgin level strength with 90mg of DMT, re-dosing 2 more times every 1.5 hour, 4.5 hour journey: very similar to 600mg mescaline.
 
But 60mg of DMT is plenty for a +3 Shulgin level strength trip with 2 re-doses every 1.5 hour, see the 5 hour CEV brightly colored Ayahuasca visions trip report below. Most meaningful teaching & intense visionary experience of my life, and I've taken Ayahuasca over 70 times, high dose cactus tea over 200 times, and acid nearly as much.
 
How this works: the Hydroxy propyl beta cyclodextrin molecule (HPBCD) has an inner hydrophobic cavity (repels water) which attracts & traps freebase molecules like DMT freebase inside it's tornado shaped cone. The outer cavity is hydrophilic (likes water) and thus makes the DMT molecule water-soluble.
 
HPBCD, being a potent polysaccharide derived from the enzymatic degradation of starch, improves the penetration of the DMT freebase many factors over (studies show x 4 factors or 400%) into the sublingual mucosa under the tongue. HPBCD then releases the DMT as the potent freebase into the bloodstream once it crosses the sublingual mucosa, these reasons explain its potency.
 
Keep in mind using DMT salts sublingually does not work, and there is no penetration enhancement unless HPBCD is used to complex DMT in the freebase form only. The cyclodextrins have toroidal shapes, with the larger and the smaller openings of the toroid exposing to the solvent secondary and primary hydroxyl groups respectively.
 
You can order HPBCD from China no matter where you live as it is legal, and if you google "Europe + HPBCD" there are a couple places that sell it as well. It is very common in the USA from *mazon or auction sites.
 
Complete instructions and pictures all updated for sublingual HPBCD DMT & summary of over 44 sublingual experiences in a year's time, these experiences all much stronger than oral DMT by many factors. Zero nausea, zero dizziness, zero anxiety or un-easy feelings, deep head space, highly visual, strong open eyed and CEV's of spinning & dancing geometrics & real Ayahuasca visions, incredible music enhancement, way over the top open eyed beauty, neon colorful & highly euphoric, see trip reports below...will continue to use for the rest of my life, highly recommend.
 
My procedure:
1) place 60mg of DMT onto a spoon
2) add 1:1 molar ratio of host drug to HPBCD powder, this means 1:7 mg ratio DMT to HPBCD, use a 1:8 mg ratio DMT to HPBCD if you are using the 2-Hydroxypropyl-β-cyclodextrin.
3) this means 60mg dmt placed on spoon, then add 420mg of HPBCD on top DMT, use 480mg HPBCD if you are using the 2-Hydroxypropyl-β-cyclodextrin.
4) add 10 drops of very hot near boiling water to the mix from a nearby microwaved coffee mug for DMT doses of 90mg or below, use 12 drops of boiling hot water to mix DMT doses over 90mg (such as 100 to 120mg). 60mg DMT = +3 Shulgin level strength, 90 to 120mg = +5 Shulgin level life changing strength.
5) Knead or crush the HPBCD powder into the dmt using the end of a spoon for 2 minutes, scrape & mix everything back and forth hard using your muscles. This is how scientist pre-pare these complexes by kneading.
6) Hold a lighter under the spoon to heat up spoon for around 20 seconds or so, until the solution just starts to bubble on the edges, then pull flame away, so that complete dissolution or dissolving takes place, after heating up, mix the contents a little bit more before using, see pics.
7) Take 150 to 300mg tetrahydroharmine orally around 45 minutes before. Place 35mg of freebase harmine under your tongue. Then place bottom of your tongue onto HPBCD complexed DMT spoon, the HPBCD DMT glob will all adhere as HPBCD powder forms sticky complexes. Be sure to take the 35mg harmine and HPBCD DMT under tongue all at the exact same time in order to activate the DMT strongly.
 
Hold under tongue for 10 to 12 or 15 minutes depending on dosage, press down with bottom of tongue the whole time to trap sticky liquid complex in the sublingual mucosa. Be sure to use bottom end of tongue to lick any off spoon that is left behind, you want to get it all.
 
At end of 15 minutes, spit out any saliva into a cup instead of swallowing. Gently relieve any saliva during the 15 minute period as comfort dictates by leaning your head forward and spitting into a cup, but keep your tongue pressed down any time you relieve saliva. There is a mild to moderate sting felt but it's so worth enduring for the effects which begin in 22 minutes. The sting does not bother me at all. The tongue is completely fine afterwards (no burn), and it's as if nothing happened the next day.
 
The combination of THH + DMT simulates true Ayahuasca, but there is zero nausea, zero dizziness, zero queasiness since there is no harmine or DMT going thru stomach and intestines. 22 minutes in there are heavy CEV's of spinning colored geometrics, visions of ancient architecture, animals, aliens, you name it, She seems to tap into the Akashic record of the ether in the Universe, where all past, present, and future is known. Open eyed profound beauty, music sounds incredible, extremely pleasurable experience, high spiritual euphoria.
 
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
1st journey: 300mg oral THH once + sublingual 60mg HPBCD DMT combined with sublingual 35mg harmine fb at exact same time under tongue with re-dose every 1.5 hour
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
 
On my very first 300mg oral tetrahydroharmine or THH + sublingual 60mg HPBCD DMT combined with 35mg sublingual harmine fb trip with 2 sublingual re-doses at each 1.5 hour mark (had not used DMT in several months)....all the way till 5am in the morning I was seeing closed eye visions of slow and high speed movies...I saw brightly colored serpents, dungeons I traveled thru, many Mesoamerican pyramids, women of incredible beauty, Japanese landscapes, dancing geometrics, many different animals on a rotating globe, walking on the planet-like globe as it spun, hundreds of visions like slow and high-speed movies over the course of many hours.
 
I wore headphones and listened to music the whole time, as the music sounded just like if I had taken a very strong cactus tea.
 
I saw the interiors of many magnificent homes, exposed like a camera flash went off, then off to the next home interior, bizarre alien looking creatures, I saw ancient ruins but they were seen as they were before they fell apart. All sorts of architectural wonders appeared that I could not make out exactly what time period they were from.
 
All the visions were enchanting & manifested incredible beauty. The multi-colored beautiful serpents kept appearing several times in different forms, as if they have some prominence to do with it all, two of them had shining skin covered in gold scales and intertwined like DNA, reminds me of the Aztec quetzalcoatl myth, the "serpent of precious feathers."
 
...all of these visions were brightly colored due to the sublingual DMT/harmine and oral THH combo all night long..it was one of the most powerful psychedelic experiences of my life...and I've taken Ayahuasca x 70 times, cactus 200 times, etc...I have never had over 5 hours of non-stop CEV visions anything close to what I saw that first night.
 
The visions inspired me to buy a book on the Aztec myth of "Quetzalcoatl, the serpent of precious feathers", as I feel somehow this entity is a "teacher to mankind". I saw the brightly colored serpents many times in the 5 hours of visions, and now I understand why they are so commonly reported in Ayahuasca journeys.
 
They seem to possess divine knowledge that humans were not supposed to have been privileged to, but the serpents gifted this knowledge to humankind.
 
Recently found a 1.5 hour video on Amazon prime entitled "Ancient Alien Origins" which is all about this ancient alien flying serpent or dragon entity which is found in all religions of the world & "BAM, Builders of the Ancient Mysteries".
 
Return of the Serpent & of Eden:
 
hxxps://earthmedicine2015.wordpress.com/2016/01/29/return-of-the-serpent-of-eden/
 
 
Have no problem tolerating the sting, but many others like yourself may not, therefore I recommend like you mentioned trying the HPBCD DMT orally, just stir the spoon full of it into 1oz of microwaved hot water, it dissolves right away, transparent colored water...
 
...and the HPBCD will mask the taste of the nasty DMT, due to the outer coating of HPBCD having a sugary taste as it is derived from the enzymatic degradation of starch, a carbohydrate. When you drink the hot tea with your harmalas, it is pleasant and goes down easy for zero nausea Ayahuasca. I recommend taking the HPBCD DMT tea with your harmalas dissolved into it (if harmalas in freebase form, add a bit of citric acid to help them dissolve into the water) at the exact same time, just as the Shaman's prepare it for strongest activation and journey.
 
Or just take capsules of the harmalas (160 to 200mg harmine + 150 to 300mg THH) at the exact same time you drink the HPBCD DMT oral tea. This way you can avoid the taste of the harmalas, and the freebase harmalas will dissolve fine once they reach stomach acid.
 
"Cyclodextrins used as excipients" pdf, European Medicines Agency, Oct 9, 2017: page 4 & 5 of 16 under "Oral products, Kinetics":
Cyclodextrins can be used to reduce or prevent gastrointestinal and ocular irritation, reduce or eliminate unpleasant smells or tastes.
 
The oral bioavailability of cyclodextrins is very low in adult animals and humans (0.1–3%), except for RM-β-CD, which has a bioavailability of 12% in rats. Because of their bulky and hydrophilic nature only insignificant amounts of cyclodextrins are absorbed from the gastrointestinal tract by passive diffusion [33, 27].
 
This pharmacology has been used to potentiate these freebase drugs ORALLY as well -- in my experience, this results in an Ayahuasca experience that is strong in potency. Example: HPBCD improves oral absorption profile for Ofloxacin, a second generation fluroquinolones by 54 to 89 percent.
 
HPBCD makes the DMT freebase water & increases drug penetration x 4 factors or 400% into oral intestinal tissues or the sublingual mucosa. HPBCD also does a fine job of helping to mask the taste of the DMT when used orally.
 
I've used HPBCD complexed DMT orally three times stirred into a 1oz hot water tea (it dissolves instantly) with 150 to 300mg THH + 160 to 200mg harmine with a bit of citric acid to help the harmalas dissolve, and it's also way more potent than normal DMT freebase or salts used orally, very reminiscent of my over 70 Hawaiian psychotria brewed leaf teas, very strong & all encompassing. Trip report below:
 
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
80mg DMT complexed to 560mg HPBCD oral Ayahuasca report, +5 Shulgin scale
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
 
The experiment was a success...I took the 80mg freebase DMT complexed to (x7) or 560mg of HPBCD (use x8 or 640mg if using the more common 2-HPBCD to keep at a 1:1 molar ratio) all kneaded/crushed using end of another spoon, use your muscles, scrape & crush it back and forth well...all mixed on a spoon for 2 minutes with 0.5 milliliter (10 drops) of VERY HOT near boiling water from a nearby coffee mug.
 
1300 g/mol HPBCD to 188 g/mol DMT freebase = 1:1 molar ratio
1500 g/mol 2-HPBCD to 188 g/mol DMT freebase = 1:1 molar ratio
 
Both work exactly the same.
 
What I do is heat up a bit of water in a coffee cup in microwave & draw up drops of it using pipette. I read using hot water speeds & aids the mixing of the HPBCD to host drug. Then heat bottom of spoon up for around 20 seconds with a bic lighter, just until the edges of the liquid on the spoon begin to bubble, then pull flame away, mix solution a few more seconds, this ensures complete dissolution.
 
I added the 0.5ml spoon full HPBCD DMT solution to 1oz of 120 degree hot water...this then immediately turned into 100% transparent water when it hit the hot liquid in the pyrex cup...This was stored in fridge until use...then when I was ready, the 1oz clear transparent liquid HPBCD DMT water solution, once re-heated up in pyrex pot on stove, to this was then added 200mg harmine + 250mg THH and also 150mg of pure ascorbic acid (vit C) to help dissolve the freebase harmine + thh.
 
Or you can just take pre-made capsules of your harmalas at the exact same time you drink the 1oz HPBCD DMT hot water tea to avoid the taste of the harmine and THH.
 
I gulped it down in one shot...there was virtually no taste! I think the HPBCD completely masked the taste of the nasty DMT...I was shocked...took it all together at same time at 3:30, I'm writing this 3 hours later.
 
It came on exactly like 30 grams of hawaiian psychotria! there was no difference between this and the leaf brew, again I was shocked...it gripped me powerfully, heavy tryptamine buzz and high frequency. The THH already imparts a body frequency buzz + DMT tryptamine buzz = amazing amplified body frequency.
 
A vibrating neon colored fortress like a magnetic field surrounded me in the room, it shined off of every object similar to a UV blacklight glow...this neon visual vibration appeared all around me, given off by everything around me. The vibrational frequency field reminded me of the tractor beam in Star Trek when they would transport. I've experienced this same phenomena with past journeys involving 30 to 35 grams of potent Hawaiian psychotria...but never with plain freebase DMT or DMT salts before, only again with this HPBCD DMT.
 
I had to remain in one spot sitting as it was so strong for 1 hour straight, the walls in the room filled with 3-D ish like honeycomb orange & brown geometrics that appeared to bulge slightly off the surface, like the inside of a bee hive, neon colors were abundant, heavy tracers...the beauty all around me was infinite, beautiful CEV's (spinning and dancing or constantly morphing geometrics) and OEV...I was amazed to say the least.
 
In conclusion, I am impressed with this route of administration via sublingual or oral.
 
During the oral Ayahuasca journey (200mg harmine + 250mg THH + 80mg DMT complexed to 560mg HPBCD) for the first hour, all objects glowed or shined as if in caught in a neon colored magnetic transporter beam.
 
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12 reasons pure THH or tetrahydroharmine rocks
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1. Post #13 of this paper: shows how to convert harmaline to pure THH in 1.5 hour for the first time (very fast) with 75% yield. TIHKAL THH entry also achieved 75% yield. Post also shows how to check the blue glow under blacklight to make sure it is pure. Any green in the glow means you still have un-converted harmaline, but follow instructions and you won't have any unconverted.
 
1. Dennis Mckenna Ph.D: page 115:
Thus, tetrahydroharmine may prolong the half-life of DMT by blocking it's intraneuronal uptake, and hence, its inactivation by MAO, localized in mitochondria within the neuron.
In my experience, THH doubles the half-life of DMT, so when used sublingually or orally, you get a full strong 90 minutes out of it with long afterglow.
 
2. She is in the same beta-carboline family as ibogaine. She is the 2nd highest alkaloid in Caapi. She has a 10.5 hour half-life with peak at 5.25 hours.
 
3. DMT only colors are subdued and dark, but THH brightens the DMT visuals: out of this world impossible bright neon colors are a trait of high dose oral tetrahydroharmine + moderate dose 60 to 70mg+ sublingual or oral HPBCD DMT: neon red-greens, neon orange-blues, neon purple-yellows.
 
4. DMT does not block serotonin on it's own, but THH does...this results in not only stimulation but euphoria in combo with the DMT: and real Ayahuasca visions become apparent...important teamwork. Ibogaine, LSD, mescaline, shrooms, 5-meo-dmt, bufotenin in Amazonian snuffs, all block serotonin, THH blocks serotonin.
 
5. THH has numerous similarities to mescaline, she is like the beta-carboline version of mescaline, few people have used her over 100mg. I have seen the receptorome chart for THH vs. mescaline. She not only blocks serotonin like mescaline, but agonizes all 3 adrenal receptors A1-A3 associated with beauty and aesthetic enhancement, just like mescaline. Beauty enhancement is "over the top" when THH is included, she is diamondlike shimmering in her beauty.
 
Actresses on TV will look like dazzling glowing super-colorful cartoon versions of themselves (just like with high dose cactus tea) only if you include the THH. Researchers have called THH the "tryptamine of the beta-carboline world" and rightly so.
 
6. THH is found in average 150mg in a cup of Caapi based Ayahuasca tea, when 2 cups are drank by some of the more advanced members for evening at the vegetals (UDV, Santo Daime, Shuar Indian) people are consuming around 300mg of THH.
 
7. Music will only sound bad-ass incredible if you include from 150mg to 300mg oral THH with your sublingual or oral DMT.
 
8. This pure THH at 300mg all by herself is extremely visual, she's an isomer of a hormone like substance made in the brain naturally.
 
9. The entry in TIHKAL for 300mg THH is completely wrong, where the unexperienced person compares it to the effects of 100mg harmaline. She is nothing at all like harmaline, and like 69ron once said about the person's comment in TIHKAL, he or she would not be able to tell their ass from their elbow. I agree, what complete nonsense. Dr. Shulgin wrote that he never got the chance to try THH, but wrote that more studies on it are "badly needed."
 
10. professor8 (found here from 11/1/2010 he writes like a poet w/special powers of imagination & expression):
Tetrahydroharmine (THH) has the ability to raise your vibration in a most powerful, yet subtle way. It brings a crystalline prismy texture to spice and adds a super clear watery dimension to Aya, like looking down through 10meters of shimmering Caribbean Sea on clear blue day. It brings a dimension of pure light to the entheogenic experience and encourages entities & intelligences of only the Highest Order. If one is not accustomed to perceiving these experiences with a spiritual perspective most of the nuances & subtleties THH brings on are overlooked and remain unseen and one would better enjoy Harmaline as a house painter chooses a roller over a brush, its about preference & choice.
 
11. Trips (from here on 12/2/2011):
As to how the THH altered the experience -> I find rue extract+DMT to be very similar to mushrooms. I found the THH added to the rue+DMT to shift the experience to a state much closer to that provided by LSD. It was more clear, more energetic, more focused, and when confusion struck it was definitely more "acid-like".
 
The world is moving in the direction of the Left Brain: technology and science. What the world needs is to move in the direction of Right Brain development: empathy, spirituality, connectedness. Compounds like tetrahydroharmine in Caapi could be said to improve emotional intelligence, a smart-nutrient for the right side of the brain.
 
At 300mg of THH all by itself, there are heavy open-eyed tracers like lightening flashes, and hours of teaching closed eye visions that start with colored sparkles and fireworks (red, green, yellow, blue) that dart around and progress into full-fledged way-beyond 4k visions with eyes closed that are not only static but often animated like slow and high speed movies, but all one monochrome color like green or blue for me, when you add DMT, the visions then become colored and patterning on animals for example will display their associated colors, DMT also adds on to or builds on top the THH visions, expanding them, but the teachings and insights & visions are credited to the Vine:
 
12. Gayle Highpine (Ayahuasca researcher):
The vine carries the content of the message, the teaching, and the insight. The purpose of drinking Ayahuasca is to receive the message the vine imparts.
 
Tetrahydroharmine or THH ranks very high on the "periodic psychedelic table" among all the known entheogens for inducing realistic way beyond 4k monochrome teaching visions for hours...adding even small amounts of DMT brightens and colorizes the visions, example: reptiles, birds & animals such as serpents/snakes/toucans/parrots/jaguars with patterning show their respective associated colors. Many times I have viewed multi-colored serpents, birds & jaguars several times over hour long CEV periods, serpents are the manifest spirit of Ayahuasca.
 
Daniel Pinchbeck "Breaking Open the Head" (Daniel also states in his book, that Ayahuasca is his favorite entheogen):
For many people, Ayahuasca-a slowed-down low-res interface of the DMT flash-seems to convey strong messages from the natural world, of nature as sentient energy and spirit matter, of the need to protect the planet we have been given.
 
Yage whispers that human beings are meant to be gardeners of this reality, journeyers, storytellers and singers, weavers of the sacred. DMT, on the other hand, conveys no overt human or humane message.
 
Graham Hancock, "Supernatural", pg 428:
My experience with smoked DMT was qualitatively different from the realms and beings Ayahuasca introduced me to. For whereas the Ayahuasca worlds seemed rich, luxurious, and abundant in the transformations of organic and supernatural life, DMT brought me to a world--or to some aspect of a world--that appeared from the outset to be highly artificial, constructed, inorganic, and in essence technological.
 
Gayle Highpine (Ayahuasca researcher):
In the western world, Ayahuasca acquired a new definition: It was now, by definition, the combination of Banisteriopsis caapi and a DMT-containing plant. Ayahuasca became, by definition “orally active DMT.” The first anthropologist to adopt the new definition seems to have been Luis Eduardo Luna in 1984. Luna spent time with Terence McKenna, absorbing his perspective, before beginning his fieldwork. Since then, anthropologists have increasingly adopted this definition and filtered their observations through it. The preeminence of the Ayahuasca vine in the indigenous Amazonian world became the elephant in the living room of Ayahuasca studies, with a tacit agreement to pretend it doesn’t exist.
 
The leaves were Ayahuasca’s “helpers,” I was told, and their purpose was to “brighten and clarify” the visions. The vine is like a cave, and the leaf is like a torch you use to see what is inside the cave. The vine is like a book, and the leaf is like the candle you use to read the book.
 
The vine is like a snowy television set, and the leaf helps to tune in the picture. There was a subtle attitude that the need for strong leaf was the sign of a beginner: An experienced ayahuasquero could see the visions even in low light.
 
Ayahuasca vine is not visionary in the same way as DMT. Visions from vine-only brewsare shadowy, monochromatic, like silhouettes, or curling smoke, or clouds moving across the night sky. It is because their visions are usually monochromatic that vines are classified by the color of vision they produce: white, black, blue, red (in my experience, dark maroon).
 
Snakes, the most common vision on Ayahuasca, are considered the manifest spirit of the vine. Vine visions can be hard to see; in fact, the “visions” may not be visual at all, but auditory or somatic or intuitive. But the vine carries the content of the message, the teaching, and the insight.
 
The leaf helps illuminate the content, but the teachings are credited to the vine. Vine visions are “frequently associated with writing, to a code that is present in visions…or in the ‘books’ where the spirits keep the secrets of the forest.” (Calavia Saez 2011:135).
 
The vine is The Teacher, The Healer, The Guide. The purpose of drinking Ayahuasca is to receive the message the vine imparts. This is why it is the vine, not the leaf, that is classified by the type of vision it gives. “For them the vine is, in truth, a living guide, a friend, a paternal authority” (Weiskopf 2005:104).
 
Listening to the Vine:
While I was living in the village, someone began the process of shamanic apprenticeship. There was a series of ceremonies with brews of special strength for that purpose; brews with enormous quantities of vine. About two to three pounds of fresh vine per person was used (about 25 to 35 times the amount needed for MAOI inhibition). Those were powerful experiences indeed.
 
Although the apprenticeship began with crushingly vine-heavy brews, the more the apprentice progressed, the weaker the brew he would need. He would learn to see the dimmest of visions. If he spent a full two years “fasting,” then eventually even smelling or tasting the brew, even touching an Ayahuasca plant, would be enough to visit her realms. On the other hand, he would learn to navigate the strongest of brews with clear focus, and be undistracted by any amount of DMT fireworks.
 
Psychedelia, page 61:
A traditional saying among Ayahuasqueros is that the jungle vine brings powerful realistic visions, but that the chacruna brings light to these visions. According to the view of Western research, this is not the case; essentially the entire psycho-activity resides with the chacruna leaves DMT content.
 
Ayahuasca researcher Luis Eduardo Luna recently observed that when surveying tribal lore praising the jungle vine, he could find no traces of similar mythology around the two most common plant admixtures; psychotria viridis or diplpterys cabrerana, even though these DMT plants to a Westerner would appear much more important than the harmala alkaloids of the B. caapi liana.
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References:
 
Dennis Mckenna Ph.D:
Thus, tetrahydroharmine may prolong the half-life of DMT by blocking it's intraneuronal uptake, and hence, its inactivation by MAO, localized in mitochondria within the neuron.
I have years of experience with pure tetrahydroharmine, and it does indeed do this very well.
 
Jamie, posted : 11/23/2012 8:29:28 PM:
You can't compare sublingual or oral either..20-30mg sublingual harmine is enough to activate sublingual DMT and cause effects on it's own. 20mg sublingual is probably comparable to 200mg oral.
I use 35mg freebase harmine sublingually along with the sublingual HPBCD complexed DMT, 35mg sublingual has the power of x6 or 210mg oral harmine, but without the dizziness and un-easy feelings some sensitive individuals like myself may feel with an oral dose.
 
Dr. Narang:
The absorption of drugs through the sublingual route is 3 to 10 times greater than oral route and is surpassed by hypodermic injection. Sublingual mucosa under tongue is only 100 to 200 microns thick.
In over 44 total sublingual experiences over a year's time, this sublingual route is many times more potent than oral DMT.
 
"Cyclodextrins used as excipients" pdf, European Medicines Agency, Oct 9, 2017:, under "Kinetics":
Cyclodextrins at high doses can increase drug permeability by direct action on mucosal membranes and enhance drug absorption and/or bioavailability. These effects are possibly caused by solubilisation of membrane lipids through inclusion complexation with cyclodextrins and the ability of cyclodextrins to cause perturbation of membrane integrity. However, unlike detergents, cyclodextrins solubilize membrane components without entering into the membrane, therefore the perturbing effects of cyclodextrins are mild and reversible [7].Cyclodextrins are absorbed poorly via mucosal membranes.
HPBCD enhances the drug permeability of guest complexed drug, but the cyclodextrins themselves are poorly absorbed via the sublingual mucosa.
 
Pic 1: use a 1:1 molar ratio HPBCD to DMT
 
Pic 2: How to mix the DMT, HPBCD, and drops of very hot water on a spoon & chart of DMT strength.
 
Pic 3 left: 300mg pure THH for oral use in weigher, 35mg harmine fb for sublingual use next to it, 60mg dmt fb in spoon, 420mg HPBCD white powder above it, coffee mug of near boiling hot water, medicine dropper pipette, Bic lighter.
 
Pic 3 right: 60mg DMT was covered with x 7 or 420mg HPBCD powder and 10 drops of near boiling hot water from a nearby coffee mug was added, and all mashed and stirred well for 2 minutes, then Bic lighter held under spoon until the solution just started to boil (20 seconds or so), then pull flame away, notice how well the DMT complexed inside the HPBCD. Mix a few more seconds before using.
 
pic 4: 300mg of pure THH for oral use taken 45 minutes before, not shown: 35mg of freebase harmine for sublingual use taken at exact same time under tongue as the 0.5ml (10 drop) 90mg DMT complexed to 630mg HPBCD stored in a 3ml syringe if desired. Locking syringe caps prevent spillage.
 
Two re-dose syringes at the 1.5 hour point can be "back-filled" by removing plunger & pouring spoon's HPBCD complexed DMT solution down the syringe. Schematic showing sublingual mucosa only 100 to 200 microns thick.
 
Pic 5: Pure tetrahydroharmine glows pale blue under blacklight like LSD or psilocin, harmaline reduces to tetrahydroharmine by gaining a hydrogen atom. Tetrahydroharmine is in the same beta-carboline family as ibogaine, remarkable way beyond 4k monochrome (blue or green for me) closed eye teaching visions at 300mg for hours. No sedation, pleasant stimulation like mescaline. Adding even small amounts of sublingual or oral HPBCD DMT adds color to the visions.
 
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pic 5.JPG

Edited by tregar, 16 January 2022 - 10:56 AM.


#27 tregar

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Posted 17 January 2022 - 08:09 AM

Just a quick note: in the 44 times I've used 60 to 90mg HPBCD DMT sublingually under tongue, my tongue felt 100% fine the next day, no burn, completely normal, as if nothing was used the night before. 60mg HPBCD dmt = + 3 Shulgin level strength, and 90mg HPBCD dmt = + 5 Shulgin level strength.
 
All I can think of is make sure there is no sodium hydroxide contamination in your dmt before you complex it, as any remnants of it will surely burn, it helps to use a long glass pipette with rubber bulb and 2 Liter erlenmeyer flask (heat resistant & tapers at top for easy pull) when extracting, this will ensure no accidental grabbing of any lye water, ie contamination...and make sure the dmt is complexed to the HPBCD as well as you can, as freebase dmt without being complexed can burn as well. 
 
My only other suggestion, is to just stir the HPBCD complexed DMT from off the spoon into 1oz of microwaved hot water (120 degree F) for oral Ayahuasca use, it dissolves instantly, and you will notice the water remains transparent due to the remarkable dissolution. Then just take a capsule full of 160 to 200mg harmine + 100 to 300mg THH at exact same time you drink the 1oz HPBCD DMT water tea. The harmalas can be in freebase form, work just fine. Take all at exact same time as the Shaman's do for strongest effects. 
 
The HPBCD masks the taste of the nasty DMT freebase very well when used orally in a tea, and even helps to reduce gastrointestinal irritation by the freebase DMT. I was shocked in my oral use as there was virtually no taste, and zero nausea. 
 
Using it orally works very well, used it this way x 3 times. It's many factors stronger than normal dmt freebase or salts used orally, as the HPBCD increases drug penetration x 4 factors or 400% into not only sublingual mucosa but intestinal tissues as well. 80mg HPBCD DMT Oral trip report in summary above in middle. Good luck, and thanks again for your report Physics envy. 
 
One last note: make sure you have not used dmt in any form within the past 2 weeks, as this will ensure 90 minutes of very strong activity, and each dose thereafter for the evening will be just as strong as the first dose and last just as long.
 
Harmine and THH together are both important, just as Dr. Mckenna mentions for preventing the inactivation of DMT by MAO localized in mitrochondria within the cells of the brain, these both prevent zapping of the DMT, and greatly extend the half-life of the DMT several times over, just like with real oral Ayahuasca, as Benny Shanon mentions in "Antipodes of the Mind"..."there is always 90 minutes of very strong activity", this has been my experience as well when your tolerance is low. 


#28 tregar

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Posted 19 January 2022 - 05:18 AM

In closing, the 300mg oral pure tetrahydroharmine once (10.5 hour half life with peak at 5.25 hours) + sublingual 60mg HPBCD DMT + sublingual 35mg harmine fb taken at exact same time under tongue with 2 re-doses at the 1.5 hour mark gave five hours of brightly colored very meaningful & teaching Ayahuasca visions (+5 Shulgin level life-changing strength) that inspired me to buy a book on the Aztec myth of "Quetzalcoatl, the serpent of precious feathers", as I feel somehow this entity is a "teacher to mankind". I saw the brightly colored serpents many times in the 5 hours of visions, and now I understand why they are so commonly reported in Ayahuasca journeys. Serpents are also said by Ayahuasca researcher Gayle Highpine to be the manifest spirit of Ayahuasca. 
 
They seem to possess divine knowledge that humans were not supposed to have been privileged to, but the serpents gifted this knowledge to humankind.
 
Recently found a 1.5 hour video on Amazon prime entitled "Ancient Alien Origins" which is all about this ancient alien flying serpent or dragon entity which is found in all religions of the world & "BAM, Builders of the Ancient Mysteries".
 
Return of the Serpent & of Eden:
 
hxxps://earthmedicine2015.wordpress.com/2016/01/29/return-of-the-serpent-of-eden/
 
 
Pic: Serpents are the manifest spirit of Ayahuasca
 
A few additional pics & from article "Return of the Serpent & of Eden" link given above:
 
Top left: Egyptian Goddesses Isis (Cobra) & Serapis: depicted as Sacred Serpents
 
Top middle: Shipibo Ayahuasca Tapestry: The Vase representing the Amazonian Medicine, The Serpents that of the Grandmother Spirit of Ayahuasca
 
Top middle: Cosmic Serpent: Book by Jeremy Narby
 
Top right: Mayan ruins
 
Bottom left: Priestess of Quetzalcoatl
 
Bottom middle: Aztec Serpent Moon Goddess (Coyolxauhqui). Other Aztec Serpent Symbols include: Quetzalcoatl (Feathered Serpent), Xiuhcoatl (Fire Serpent), Mixcoatl (Cloud Serpent), and Coatlicue (She with Serpent Skirt)
 
Bottom right: Kundalini Serpent Pathway
 
Bottom right: Shiva & Shakti: Siddhi Level of Divine Masculine & Feminine Balance
 

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#29 tregar

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Posted Yesterday, 11:53 AM

This goes along with post #10 on page 1 (on morning glory seeds) added here, as I could not go back and edit:
 
In closing: morning glory compared with HBWR:
 
Please keep in mind that HBWR has high levels of ergometrine, causes cramping and vasoconstriction, ergometrine levels in morning glory for comparison is very low. Also, HBWR has no history of Shamanic use, whereas morning glory seed usage goes back several hundreds of years. HBWR only has history of medicinal use. HBWR also has high levels of LSA, very sedating and not really all that psychedelic at all. But yes, all studies published after 2011 indicate that no LSH has been found yet in HBWR. 
 
Interestingly, when a boy was found dead at the bottom of his apartment building (he jumped out, apparently this really does happen), they detected levels of LSH or Lysergic acid Hydroxyethylamide in his blood, he had also been drinking heavily and taking HBWR seeds that night. Here is the actual toxicology study:
 
hxxps://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/20018470/
 
Remember, LSH is just a labile (unstable) adduct of LSA + acetaldehyde which can remain stable in acidic solutions, for example: outside the body in ph=4.0 cold fresh just opened sherry wine solution (under 70 degree F so the acetaldehyde does not boil off), and sherry is high in acetaldehyde. And you have to seal off the wine with a ten dollar wine preservation canister of inert argon gas (from *mazon with enough gas to last years of sealing) you shoot into the bottle, before placing back into the fridge, to keep the acetaldehyde from decomposing to vinegar via oxidation. Keep cold at all times. Whether this forms outside the liver as well as within is a whole nother discussion. 
 
This is the paper that shows the alkaloid content of HBWR is vastly different from the alkaloid content of morning glory: Paulke A, Kremer C, Wunder C, Wurglics M, Schubert-Zsilavecz M, Toennes SW. Identification of legal highs—ergot alkaloid patterns in two Argyreia nervosa products. Forensic Sci Int. 2014;242:62–71.
 
No high levels of stimulating LSH, agroclavine, elymoclavine, chanoclavine, penniclavine found in HBWR seeds, only in morning glory seeds. A 2014 forensics paper from Paulke found no LSH in HBWR seeds, but only found LSA & iso-LSA (83-84%) & ergometrine (10-17%) & rest minimal: lysergol, elymoclavine & chanoclavine. 
 
Sandgrease: "HBWR has more of a sedative effect compared to MG."
 
Nogal: "HBWR is more body related while MG seeds have effects more similar to LSD."
 
For five pics below, see post #10 on page 1 for detailed descriptions in morning glory topic.
 
Pic 1: The Aztec & Mayan extracted the morning glory seeds into wine and alcoholic solutions, 2016 Polish morning glory pics.
 
Pic 2: Steps in the wine morning glory extraction, pics listed from end to beginning in reverse order.
 
Pic 3: LSA adducts
 
Pic 4: Left: old 1970's morning glory data, right: new 2016 Polish mg study data
 
Pic 5: Eleusis ruins where the sacred psychoactive entheogenic Kykeon was drunk by initiates in ancient Greece, Eleusis participants, top: LSH compared to LSD, bottom: morning glory alkaloids, right: paspalum grass infected with claviceps paspali ergot which grows on the famous Rarian plain adjacent to Eleusis contains the same alkaloid profile as the sacred Aztec & Mayan morning glory.
 
attached: 2016 Polish morning glory study

 

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The end: Multiple encounters with death and depression & 80mg DMT complexed to 560mg HPBCD oral Ayahuasca report

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This is the story of how HPBCD DMT came about: the plants taught this to me. I did not discover it. I have taken Ayahuasca over 70 times and cactus tea x 200 times. Ayahuasca seems to want to propagate herself all over the globe by any means possible, and if that means using the latest pharmacology advancements such as HPBCD, then so be it. The planet is in crisis, and Ayahuasca wants to help reverse the insane rapid destruction.
 
Daniel Pinchbeck "How Soon is Now":
The human race is careening toward extinction: rising acidity of the oceans threatens coral reefs, habitat destruction, non-native species (predatory fish, bullfrogs, fungus, pathogens), climate change (alters temperature and water levels), pollution and diseases (especially chytridiomycosis, caused from the chytrid fungus) all have been shown to contribute to worldwide amphibian declines.
 
We clear forest that are full of trees even though we continue to pump CO2 into the air even though we know it's heating up the ozone and melting ice caps; we clear forests that are full of trees that could potentially help clean that co2 out of the air, the Amazon rainforest is the lungs of the planet, but miles of it are slashed & burned every week so that cattle can graize there instead to make hamburgers, and massive soybean cultivation. We throw away plastic water bottles, and worst of all, we feed into the corporate systems that keep this destruction going.
I don't know about you, but I don't use soybeans for anything, don't eat hamburger or steaks, only fish, chicken & turkey daily, as a bodybuilder this keeps me lean daily.
 
On my 70th Ayahuasca journey using the very last of my stored away Hawaiian psychotria, she showed me a vision of my "lost 1kg container of HPBCD". I had put it away 12 years ago, as I bought it from a sports supplement supplier, once pro-hormones became illegal, I carelessly abandoned the container in a place I could care less about.
 
Ayahuasca has a long standing traditional reputation of helping people find lost personal items like rings, necklaces, etc. through visions. She once helped me find a set of important spoons that I had misplaced many years ago as well. She showed me they were buried in a drawer under forgotten clothes many years old. I once saw a vision of a beautiful woman in medieval times searching for a lost ring in her home, Ayahuasca showed me that it was at the very top of a cubbard in her kitchen.
 
All that time the HPBCD container was lost, she showed me that it was in my garage buried in a container along with plumbing parts. That night I dug it out of the container and put it in my closet for use the next day. She also showed me a vision of the mimosa tree or shrub, I put 2 and 2 together, and knew what she was telling me...to experiment with HPBCD complexed DMT, and so that is what I did. She already knew that I had experience making sublingual HPBCD pro-hormones, as I had learned it from chemist Patrick Arnold.
 
I had run out of Hawaiian psychotria, and it had been extinct for the past 3 years, perhaps diverted to all the numerous Ayahuasca centers in South America. I needed a high power alternative.
 
A little bit about me...
 
Becoming a shaman is often just as much of a curse as it is a blessing. Shamans are chosen by the Spirits at birth, but it is not until later in life (usually in their 20’s) that the shaman is struck down. The striking down of a shaman is to dismember them as a person and to have them reborn into something else.
 
The word Shaman means "to know". I am not a shaman, but have been thru alot of the near-death experiences Shaman's have gone thru, lost both my twin girls at birth, so have no children, my beloved pet Shitzu died at only age 4 from continuous bladder stones for 6 months, we did everything together...he was unable to pee so many times, we had to rush him to vet, where he was put down. He visited both of us in a dream 2 days later to tell us he was doing great in Heaven with a big smile on his face.
 
Have nearly died several times, once was hit head on by a truck when driver ran a yield sign, barely survived with numerous injuries. The hospital caught all my fractured ribs but did not diagnose my collapsed lung, so when I got home, drifted into shock in the middle of the night, wife called an ambulance and was rushed to a better hospital where they immediately diagnosed the lung condition and treated me for it.
 
Once took alot of acacia bark with Ayahuasca instead of the normal Hawaiian psychotria I use, and went into a serious serotonin syndrome shock, for an hour and a half I sweated my ass off sitting in the bathtub, I told my wife goodbye while my dog watched in a sad state...by some miracle pulled out of it, believe it was the high levels of maoi's in the acacia that interacted with the rima's in the Ayahuasca, bad combination. My forehead was pouring sweat for 1.5 hours, was in severe shock and trembling, and knew I was gonna die.
 
Lost everything in a 100 year severe flood, my home and all my belongings, had just gotten married to my beautiful wife and all the newlywed gifts perished...right after that we moved to an apartment complex, and 5 months later all our belongings again perished as they burnt to the ground after a disgruntled teen threw a lit blunt into the apartment complex after his girlfriend dumped him.
 
Had it not been for the policeman banging on the door of the apartment, we would have surely burned in the flames, as we were on the 3rd floor & asleep as I worked 2nd shift at the time. We ran down the steps in only our bare feet and suffered smoke inhalation.
 
Have been thru some near-death experiences similar to a Shaman, who lives on the outskirts of society. Lifting weights, walking in nature with my dog, going to the waterpark with a season pass every summer, and reading Bible all keep my spirits up.
 
Some of you have contacted me via messenger to let me know that you would like to experience this for other reasons than the visions, to help with treating depression. I will tell you this, yes, Ayahuasca can help to cure not only anger issues, melancholy, drug abuse & addictions, but also depression. She is also able to grow brand new neurons in the brain every time a journey is taken, she has cured people of all sorts of afflictions and ailments, even severe depression. I feel an afterglow for a couple days after a journey, and this refreshed serotonin reset often lasts for a couple weeks.
 
Celebrities who have battled major depression: Dwayne Johnson "the Rock", Katy Perry, Jon Hamm, Lady Gaga, Michael Phelps, Kristen Bell, Bruce Springsteen, Gwyneth Paltrow, Ashley Judd, Naomi Judd, Ryan Phillippe, J.K. Rowling, Sheryl Crow, Terry Bradshaw, Buzz Aldrin, Tipper Gore, Wayne Brady, Jim Carrey, Robin Williams, Brittany Murphy.
 
Beyond Happiness And Unhappiness, An Interview With Spiritual Teacher Eckhart Tolle:
 
hxxps://www.thesunmagazine.org/issues/319/beyond-happiness-and-unhappiness
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What we are beginning to discover is this: The HPBCD "encapsulated and trapped DMT" seems be forming enhanced modes of transport and delivery of DMT similar to how oral psychotria leaf gives an experience that is much more powerful and all encompassing and colorful than using normal plain DMT crystals. 
 
The experiences from the Hawaiian psychotria brew Ayahuasca tea are always +5 on the Shulgin scale for myself in over 70 Ayahuasca sessions, while multiple experiments with several people in the Clearlight sessions found the DMT extracted crystals gave only mild experiences (+3 max) even when using doses up to 100mg. They also found the leaf brews to be +5 Shulgin level in strength & all encompassing. 
 
Even used doses of oral dmt crystals at doses from 70 to 120mg a dozen times years ago, and found them all mild as well (+3 Shulgin scale) compared to the VERY strong Hawaiian psychotria experiences (30 to 35 gram tea), just like mind-blowing Jungle Ayahuasca. 
 
Clearlight:
Experiments that involved several people found the leaf brew form superior to extracted actives, the leaf brews were very strong and powerful & clairavoyant (+5 Shulgin scale), while the extracted actives were mild (+3 Shulgin scale) at best, even up to 100mg. Again, this is poorly understood.
However, the HPBCD complexed DMT seems to greatly alter the transport, absorption & digestion of DMT freebase crystals, resulting in powerful experiences sublingually so far, even resulting in oral powerful Ayahuasca similar to those brews using actual Hawaiian psychotria leaf in them. 
 
downwardsfromzero wrote:
This combined with the HPBCD complexation results (which we really ought to replicate and confirm) makes me wonder whether there are saccharides in leaf brews which perform a similar effect to HPBCD. There is still so much scope for really interesting research here -thanks for posting.
This is indeed fascinating downwardsfromzero, thanks for that keen observation on the sacchardies, perhaps they do function similar to HPBCD? Note: this procedure will work with any freebase molecule that is poorly water soluble, it does not work with already water soluble compounds or salts.
 
Jagube said:
I've seen anecdotal reports of quidded D. cabrerana leaf being active.
Excellent observation Jagube.
 
69ron posted 8/12/2009:
People are getting pleasant DMT effects from sublingual Virola calophylla resin. I don't think it has that much DMT in it. So why does the resin work so well when DMT is so hard to use sublingually?
HPBCD DMT is very strong...have used 60mg of it sublingually under tongue for 15 minutes along with 35mg sublingual freebase harmine at exact same time and experienced rapid heartbeat & pulse, tryptamine body rush & buzz, dilated pupils, music sounded incredible, had cev's and open eyed euphoria and profound beauty. 5 hours of Ayahuasca visions. I took 300mg of tetrahydroharmine 1 hour earlier so it was more like a true Ayahuasca experience, but no nausea, and re-dosed more 60mg HPBCD DMT every 1.5 hour x twice re-dose for a 4.5 hour total long experience with super-long afterglow well beyond this. 
 
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80mg DMT complexed to 560mg HPBCD oral Ayahuasca report, +5 Shulgin scale
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The experiment was a success...I took the 80mg freebase DMT complexed to (x7) or 560mg of HPBCD (use x8 or 640mg if using the more common 2-HPBCD to keep at a 1:1 molar ratio) all kneaded/crushed using end of another spoon, use your muscles, scrape & crush it back and forth well...all mixed on a spoon for 2 minutes with 0.500 milliliter (10 drops) of VERY HOT near boiling water from a nearby coffee mug.
 
1300 g/mol HPBCD to 188 g/mol DMT freebase = 1:1 molar ratio
1500 g/mol 2-HPBCD to 188 g/mol DMT freebase = 1:1 molar ratio
 
Both work exactly the same.
 
What I do is heat up a bit of water in a coffee cup in microwave & draw up drops of it using pipette. I read using hot water speeds & aids the mixing of the HPBCD to host drug. Then heat bottom of spoon up for around 20 seconds with a bic lighter, just until the edges of the liquid on the spoon begin to bubble, then pull flame away, mix solution a few more seconds, this ensures complete dissolution.
 
I added the 0.5ml spoon full HPBCD DMT solution to 1oz of 120 degree hot water...this then immediately turned into 100% transparent water when it hit the hot liquid in the pyrex cup...This was stored in fridge until use...then when I was ready, the 1oz clear transparent liquid HPBCD DMT water solution, once re-heated up in pyrex pot on stove, to this was then added 200mg harmine + 250mg THH and also 150mg of pure ascorbic acid (vit C) to help dissolve the freebase harmine + thh.
 
Or you can just take pre-made capsules of your harmalas at the exact same time you drink the 1oz HPBCD DMT hot water tea to avoid the taste of the harmine and THH.
 
I gulped it down in one shot...there was virtually no taste! I think the HPBCD completely masked the taste of the nasty DMT...I was shocked...took it all together at same time at 3:30, I'm writing this 3 hours later.
 
It came on exactly like 30 grams of hawaiian psychotria! there was no difference between this and the leaf brew, again I was shocked...it gripped me powerfully, heavy tryptamine buzz and high frequency. The THH already imparts a body frequency buzz + DMT tryptamine buzz = amazing amplified body frequency.
 
A vibrating neon colored fortress like a magnetic field surrounded me in the room, it shined off of every object similar to a UV blacklight glow...this neon visual vibration appeared all around me, given off by everything around me. The vibrational frequency field reminded me of the tractor beam in Star Trek when they would transport. I've experienced this same phenomena with past journeys involving 30 to 35 grams of potent Hawaiian psychotria...but never with plain freebase DMT or DMT salts before, only again with this HPBCD DMT.
 
I had to remain in one spot sitting as it was so strong for 1 hour straight, the walls in the room filled with 3-D ish like honeycomb orange & brown geometrics that appeared to bulge slightly off the surface, like the inside of a bee hive, neon colors were abundant, heavy tracers...the beauty all around me was infinite, beautiful CEV's (spinning and dancing or constantly morphing geometrics) and OEV...I was amazed to say the least.
 
In conclusion, I am impressed with this route of administration via sublingual or oral.
During the oral Ayahuasca journey (200mg harmine + 250mg THH + 80mg DMT complexed to 560mg HPBCD) for the first hour, all objects glowed or shined as if in caught in a neon colored magnetic transporter beam.
 
Attached File  2016 Polish morning glory study (1).pdf   1.19MB   11 downloads
 
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Edited by tregar, Yesterday, 06:33 PM.





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