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HPBCD DMT sublingually active under tongue


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#61 tregar

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Posted 02 October 2022 - 12:06 PM

Updated for 10-2-2022 with 45 pics, all 3 topics condensed into 2 pages with complete directions: Page 8, post #141: New research: Morning glory contains 5 stimulating LSD-like drugs, soluble only in wine/alcohol, only sparingly soluble in water. - Page 8 - Botanicals - Mycotopia

 

1) Zero nausea morning glory LSH + penniclavine combo tincture based on 2022 LSH study, natural LSD

 

2) One-shot HPBCD DMT Ayahuasca, forms easily in 2 minutes on a spoon, dissolves instantly clear into 1 shot glass of microwaved hot water, absorbs 2 to 3 times better than DMT salts, just as potent as Hawaiian psychotria and completely masks the nasty DMT taste, no gastrointestinal upset or DMT burps. Just as potent and all encompassing as REAL JUNGLE AYAHUACA. Normal DMT salts absorb poorly, HPBCD is a polysaccharide with six glucose units derived from the enzymatic degradation of cornstarch, when complexed to freebase dmt, it makes the DMT not only water soluble but increases it's bioavailability similar to the way psychotria does this, increasing absorption by many factors into the intestinal tissues.

 

3) 5 sublingual HPBCD DMT Ayahuasca trip reports recorded over a year's time, formed in just 2 minutes on a spoon, absorbs in 15 minutes or less under the tongue, zero nausea or dizziness, very euphoric, 1 hour long very strong journey, a great way to re-dose a 2nd and even 3rd time (every 1 to 1.5 hour) after your original One-shot oral HPBCD DMT Ayahuasca for a 4.5 hour long very strong journey. 



#62 tregar

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Posted 28 October 2022 - 10:03 AM

Last and final updates 10.28.2022:
 
LSH + penniclavine combo psychedelic, natural LSD: 
 
1) Zero nausea morning glory LSH + penniclavine combo tincture based on 2022 LSH study, natural LSD:
 
 
Sublingual "under the tongue" Ayahuasca: 
 
I use the sublingual HPBCD DMT weekly with zero nausea or dizziness used sublingually. Big difference compared to oral Ayahuasca which always make me feel nauseated, uncomfortable, dizzy like and with anxiety, with sublingual there is none of that. Take a look at L-dreamer's many experiences using the sublingual Ayahuasca several posts up. He rated it 10/10 just like me.
 
This sublingual Ayahuasca bi-weekly is so euphoric and very strong, zero nausea or dizziness, absolutely love her. All the visions, music enhancement, deep spiritual insights and teachings of oral Ayahuasca without the side effects:
 


#63 tregar

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Posted 05 January 2023 - 01:05 PM

Compilation of panaeolus cyanescens or pan cyan experiences & combo with THH or tetrahydroharmine, like organic psilocin LSD, extremely visual, music enhancing & super euphoric:
 


#64 tregar

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Posted 07 January 2023 - 06:52 AM

Concerning thread "Salvinorin Cyclodextrin Complexation for Sublingual Administration" by Brennendes Wasser, and one page with directions on how to complex DMT to HPBCD below in only 2 minutes. 
 
Brennendes Wasser said:
So I was thinking about making a Salvia Nosespray the first time I had some, but then tossed it as my stuff still had some grey impurity. My only experience with smoked Salvia in Holland was way too harsh to give it another BIG go Shocked . Therefore I thought I would toss this molecule completely.
 
But now I might tackle it again as I may pre-weigh the Salvinorin much better with some crystals.
 
So Loveall you found that you should stirr the Salvinorin in excess Ethanol while evaporating, to ensure close contact with HPBCD and then re-dissolve in any suitable liquid?
 
My plan would be as following:
 
10 mg Salvinorin A
3x EQ of HPBCD
in 0,5 ml Ethanol
 
stirred for 2 h and then evaporated overnight.
 
This is dissolved in 0,5 ml water and put into a Nosespray.
 
I guess a super easy proof of Complexation is even if everything dissolves later in water or not Confused
 
As I know that 1 push Nosespray = 0,... mg of Salvinorin A (in theory), I could sit there and start ramping up that Nosespray to record whenever I get some effects.
 
So I guess 10 mg totaly would be enough to at least get a threshold effect IF all the Salvinorin was complexed?
 
If absolutely nothing happens after incorporating that 10 mg I guess it is more likely that the complexation did not work (or did not enhance bioavailability) than the dose was too small?
 
May I make a kind suggestion. I'm a lifetime chemist and have used cyclodextrins for over 2 decades. I used to complex HPBCD to pro-hormones and testosterone to make them absorb under tongue with incredible penetration. 20 years ago I used to converse with chemist Patrick Arnold on how to complex pro-hormones when they were legal until the Gov't banned them, as they worked as well as regular testosteone. Then used with DMT at least 50 times over a 2 year period.
 
--> Drop the ethanol as ethanol is not used when complexing freebase alkaloids to HPBCD, as the ethanol is polar and competes for entry into the hydrophobic (water repelling) inner HPBCD cone. The outside of the HPBCD cone is hydrophilic (mixes with water).
 
This means your salvinorin A has much less chance of entering the tornado trap cone of the HPBCD in appreciable quantitites as the ethanol will also be entering.
 
From "Thermodynamic properties of hydroxypropyl Beta cyclodextrin and guest interaction, a survey of recent studies, 2021.pdf" page 4 top:
Calorimetric titration showed that at ethanol molar fraction higher than 0.2 at neutral and alkaline pH, and higher than 0.1 at acidic pH, the complex does not form. These results indicate that ethanol competes with water for the cavity of HP-β-CD. DSC data of dried HP-β-CD, coming from hydroalcoholic solutions, confrm this hypothesis. In summary, the solubility enhancement of quercetin in higher concentrations of ethanol is counterbalanced by a lower propensity for the complex formation.
 
Dr. Narang:
The absorption of drugs through the sublingual route is 3 to 10 times greater than oral route and is surpassed by hypodermic injection. Sublingual mucosa under tongue is only 100 to 200 microns thick.
 
MESO-Rx, "Ask Patrick Arnold #10", April 15, 1999 By Chemist & bodybuilder Patrick Arnold:
Sublingual hydroxypropylbetacyclodextrin (HPBCD) complexed testosterone has a very high bioavailabilty however as the peak blood levels are seen rather quickly (20 to 40 minutes). These peaks are quite high however and the drop off is substantially gradual as in the EMU study testosterone levels of greater than 60% over baseline were still measured after 2 hours.
 
Straight testosterone or prohormones do not have very good absorption under the tongue. When complexed with cyclodextrin the properties change to enable it to absorb extremely well. It would be a long and detailed explanation but that is the jist of it.
 
DMT is very similar to pro-hormones, poor absorption under tongue, but when complexed to HPBCD, it absorb's extremely well, studies show up to 400% increased penetration. Chemist Patrick Arnold taught me how to complex pro-hormones in my 20's: Ask Patrick Arnold #11 - MESO-Rx (thinksteroids.com)
 
 
Instructions for complexing Salvinorin A to HPBCD or Hydroxy Propyl Beta Cyclodextrin. You can use the more common Beta-hydroxy propyl beta cyclodextrin, works just as well as the plain HPBCD. I bought a 1 kilogram tub from china for only sixty dollars many years ago.
 
1. Add 10mg salivonrin A to a spoon.
 
2. Molar mass of salvinorin A is 432.469 g·mol−1, add 1:1 molar ratio of host drug DMT (432g/mol) to HPBCD (1300g/mol) powder, this means 1:3 mg ratio host drug to HPBCD. The HPBCD is only able to complex freebase drugs, not the salt or hcl.
 
3. So then add x 3 or 30mg HPBCD to the spoon on top the salvinorin A.
 
4. Add 3 to 4 drops of very hot near boiling water from a nearby microwaved coffee cup to the mix and crush the ingredients together for 2 minutes. Since the HPBCD is like a glucose sugar it shrinks down to nothing and complexes with the host drug.
 
5. Place complex under tongue and hold for 5 minutes, it will all dissolve. Simply place underside of tongue onto spoon, the complex will all adhere as it is sticky.
 
6. HPBCD has been shown in studies to increase penetration of the freebase host drug by up to 400% into the sublingual mucosa under the tongue. The bulky HPBCD is not dissolved but it opens tight juctions under the tongue so that the host drug can enter with greatly increased efficiency. Most of the bulky HPBCD ends up in your saliva that you spit out into a cup after 5 minutes.
 
7. I have used this same HPBCD formula to complex DMT and it achieves even greater absorption into bloodstream then even oral dmt taken with 200mg harmine, 60mg easily a +3 Strength level, 100mg is a +5 level.
 
Full instructions for sublingual or the one-shot HPBCD DMT Ayahuasca (your choice):
1) place 60mg of DMT onto a spoon (60mg for beginners)
2) add 1:1 molar ratio of host drug DMT (188g/mol) to HPBCD (1300g/mol) powder, this means 1:7 mg ratio DMT freebase to HPBCD, use a 1:8 mg ratio DMT to HPBCD if you are using the 2-Hydroxypropyl-β-cyclodextrin. For harmine freebase, 212g/mol or 1:6mg ratio harmine to HPBCD. The HPBCD is only able to complex freebase drugs, not the salt or hcl.
3) this means 60mg dmt placed on spoon, then add 420mg of HPBCD on top DMT, use 480mg HPBCD if you are using the 2-Hydroxypropyl-β-cyclodextrin.
4) add 8 drops of very hot near boiling water to the mix from a nearby microwaved coffee mug for DMT doses of 90mg, use 10 drops of boiling hot water to mix DMT doses of 120mg. Use 10 to 12 drops of hot water for 150mg DMT. 10 drops usually still works well for 150mg DMT. Just experiment a bit. You will want to use less drops of hot water (1 drop per 12mg DMT) for higher doses of DMT so it will fit comfortably below the tongue. 60mg DMT = +3 Shulgin level strength, 90mg DMT = +4 Shulgin level life strength. 120 to 150mg DMT = +5 Shulgin level life changing experience.
5) Knead or crush the HPBCD powder into the dmt using the end of another spoon for 2 minutes, scrape & mix everything back and forth hard using your muscles. This is how scientist pre-pare these complexes by kneading.
 
Note: DRY THE BOTTOM of tongue/sublingual mucosa with a tissue before applying.
 
What I do now is take 200mg of harmine and 200mg of pure THH orally, then 1 hour later once I feel the harmine and THH, I take sublingual HPBCD DMT (around 100mg) hold under tongue for 15 minutes, all dissolves, gives a 1.5 hour very strong extremely euphoric and visual experience, then I re-dose more sublingual DMT at the 1.5 hour point again, holding under tongue, continues to work at full strength, as the oral harmine has a half life of from 1 to 3 hours, continues to work for 3 hours to 5 hours. Please start with only 60mg DMT if you duplicate this, 60mg = +3, 100mg = +5 in strength.
 
I way prefer taking DMT under tongue instead of orally, as zero nausea, goes straight to brain, no dizziness, the only way I use it, very bad ass this way. None of the negatives of oral Ayahausca. There is something about DMT moving thru the stomach that makes it nausea prone, dizzy, and weird and strange, this is all avoided by using it under tongue. The harmine lowers MAO in the brain for 3 to 5 hours, so you can use the dmt under tongue with many re-doses, as it prevents the DMT from being zapped by mitochondria in the brain.
 
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Yes, the 1:1 molar guest:host ratio is the most commonly used in scientific work. I've encountered very few examples outside this ratio. Most scientist say the 1:1 molar ratio works the best, and there is no need for any other in most of the papers I have read.
 
HPBCD = 1300g/mol
B-HPBCD = 1400 g/mol (these molar mass ratios are approximate and not exact, you can encounter different)
 
The complex of salvinorin A with HPBCD or DMT with HPBCD in drops of water and crushed together for 2 minutes using the end of another spoon using your muscles to mix and grind it all together on the spoon should remain in liquid form at all times when ground together for 2 minutes with the drops of hot water. This liquid is flowable and you can even pour it from off the spoon into a syringe for storage to use later.
 
Hydroxypropyl beta cyclodextrin is a white to off-white crystalline powder. It is freely soluble in water and propylene glycol. It's solubility in water is more than 100g per 100ml under 25 degrees celsius.
 
With hot water, the solubility in water basically doubles. This is why I use near boiling hot water drops from a nearby coffee mug, using a pipette to draw up the water.
 
It cannot unfortunately be evaporated down, as the complex is already sticky (like how a sugar is sticky) and if you try to evaporate it down it will become a super sticky glob that will not even come off the spoon, it is like plaster.
 
It is best to use it right away, by placing the bottomside of your tongue onto the spoon, it will all adhere as it is sticky, and absorbs very fast under tongue.
 
What I do when I complex DMT with HPBCD and the drops of hot water, is store the resulting liquid by removing the plunger from a 3ml syringe (100 of these for less than ten dollars on-line with storage caps), and allowing the liquid to flow from off the spoon into the syringe, then replace the syringe plunger, and store the syringe in the freezer, it will keep forever this way.
 
When ready to use, simply drop syringe into a cup of warm water (cap on bottom of syringe will keep liquid from coming out) and it will defrost and become flowable again, then you can shoot the liquid under your tongue.
 
When I am tripping and need a 2nd dose around 1.5 hour later, I simply pull out another syringe from the freezer, defrosts in less than 30 seconds, and shoot contents under my tongue and hold in the sublingual mucosa.
 
A 60mg DMT HPBCD dose absorbs in 10 minutes, and a dose of 100mg dissolves in 15 minutes. Of course, I take 200mg of harmine freebase and 200mg of tetrahydroharmine freebase 1 hour before (2 highest ingredients in caapi).
 
When I feel the harmalas working, I shoot the HPBCD DMT liquid from the syringe under my tongue, hold it for 10 to 15 minutes, I spit out any collected saliva into a cup at the end of the 10 to 15 minute point...and it works powerfully around 20 minutes after you begin all this (works in 1/2 the time of an oral dose of 45 minutes), lasts strongly for 90 minutes, then I can easily re-dose again at that time, and even a 3rd time if I choose, as the harmine lowers mao in the brain for several hours, keeping the DMT from being zapped by mao mitochondria in the cells of the brain.
 
I've taken oral Ayahuasca over 80 times, and this sublingual HPBCD DMT is just as powerful as the oral form, no difference in strength except if feels stronger sublingually imho, but I prefer the sublingual as there is no nausea, no dizziness, no weird symptoms, only way I use it. It's more euphoric for me this way too. I love music and can listen to music for hours when using this sublingual Ayahuasca, as good as listening to music on mescaline, no difference, just heavenly.
 
HPBCD is very safe and effective used this way, as the 1300g/mol bulky HPBD cannot readily penetrate the sublingual mucosa as it is just too thick, (only very little gets thru according to studies on the sublingual, not even worth mentioning) but it does facilitate the transfer of the very low molecular weight DMT 188g/mol or salvinorin A (432 g/mol) into the bloodstream. Think of how aloe vera also achives similar kind of results.
 
What's even more impressive, is that the HPBCD allows the DMT or salvinorin A to penetrate into the bloodstream from the sublingual mucosa under tongue as the POTENT FREEBASE, reaching the brain quickly. DMT salts have been shown to not work via absorption under the tongue, but DMT freebase reaches the brain fast this way but also up to 400% increased penetration via the use of HPBCD which opens up tight junctions in the only 100 to 200 micron thick sublingual mucosa.
 
Chemist Patrick Arnold can be considered the "grandfather of pro-hormones and HPBCD" as he created and patented sublingually absorbed pro-hormones with his company Ergopharm that made millions of dollars selling these HPBCD complexed pro-hormones to use under tongue for 10 years, until the Gov't made pro-hormones illegal as they worked as well as tesoterone.
 
I made and used them over 20 years ago, had my testosterone level tested 1 hour after I took and held a 10mg HPBCD complexed 4-androstenidiol dose under my tongue for only 5 minutes, my test levels rose from my normal 300 ng/dl (low end) to an impressive 3500 ng/dl...way above the range of 1200 ng/dl tested in natural athletes at the high natural end. 3500 ng/dl is in the steroid level. Pro-hormones and testosterone both absorb very poorly under tongue, just as DMT in it's natural form is poorly absorbed. But when complexed with HPBCD, they achieve extraordinary penetration into the bloodstream.
 
I have a picture of the Ergopharm HPBCD pro-hormone complex which was sold for 10 years on the link #3 above from the table of contents. They also made a nasal spray HPBCD complex which worked just as well, but I preferred the sublingual. I used to communicate with Patrick Arnold via deja news groups which is how I learned how to do this. Once he left deja news groups (bought out by google groups) he started his company, Ergopharm, 2 pics of him in top links in post #1.
 
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
 
1) Compilation of panaeolus cyanescens experiences & combo with THH or tetrahydroharmine, like organic psilocin LSD: https://www.shroomer...Number/28108398
 
2) How to make the zero nausea morning glory wine: Zero nausea morning glory LSH tincture based on 2022 LSH study, natural LSD: https://www.shroomer...Number/27850299
 
3) HPBCD DMT sublingually active under tongue: https://mycotopia.ne...e-under-tongue/
 
4) One-shot hpbcd dmt ayahuasca and sublingual hpbcd dmt ayahuasca, absorbs 2 to 3 times better than DMT salts, masks taste: https://mycotopia.ne...ts-masks-taste/
 
5) Salvinorin HPBCD Cyclodextrin Complexation for Sublingual Administration: https://mycotopia.ne...administration/

Edited by tregar, 07 January 2023 - 11:25 AM.


#65 tregar

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Posted 17 February 2023 - 07:36 AM

Sublingual Ayahuasca, my psychedelic of choice: https://www.shroomer...Number/28189371
 
hxxps://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/28189371 (change hxxp to http to link)
 
I've actually decided to save my bridgesii only for when I go outdoors to the waterpark with my family or in nature at the river. I always get a mild hangover from cactus that makes me extra tired, and I end up sleeping too much of the next day away, and my beautiful, funny and smart wife gets aggravated with me :smile: cause I can't stay up to watch movies.
 
I actually went back to taking 200mg tetrahydroharmine + 200mg harmine orally at one time in a capsule, then 1 hour later when I feel it working, I place the HPBCD DMT under my tongue and wait for it dissolve which happens 100% in 15 minutes. It is no different from high dose cactus in effects for 1.5 hour with an incredible afterglow.
 
Sublingual Ayahuasca directions:
1) Take 200mg harmine freebase and 200mg pure THH freebase orally in a capsule
How to make pure THH or tetrahydroharmine here, post #13: https://mycotopia.ne...e-under-tongue/
2) 1 hour later: Place 120mg DMT on a spoon
cover with x 7 or 840mg Hydroxy propyl beta cyclodextrin or HPBCD also use the 2-Hpbcd, same in effect. This keeps it at a 1:1 molar ratio, as HPBCD (1300 g/mol, is x7 bigger in mol/g weight by dmt (188 g/mol).
3) add 10 drops of hot water from a microwaved coffee mug
4) mix and scrape it all back and forth for 1 to 2 minutes on the spoon using the end of another spoon, the complex is formed with absorption into the sublingual mucosa x 4 normal or 400% increase studies show.
5) Place bottom side of tongue onto spoon, the HPBCD DMT complex will all adhere, as HPBCD forms sticky complexes like sugar. Now hold under your tongue for 15 minutes, if at any time you feel too much saliva form, simply tilt head forward and spit out the extra saliva into a cup, but always keep tongue pressed down.
 
How this works: the oral harmine you took works in the brain to prevent the "zapping of dmt" by mitochondria located within the cells of the brain according to Dr. Mckenna, mao is reduced in the brain for several hours as harmine has a half life of around 1 to 3 hours. So once the dmt is absorbed sublingually, the harmine working in the brain prevents it from breaking down, and the THH doubles it's half life. The THH is critical as it is a major alkaloid of Caapi, a feminine teaching spirit who causes visions all on her own, she is the guide and teacher for the experience. She also blocks serotonin which causes mild stimulation, dmt does not block serotonin.
 
There is a mild sting but it is so worth the wait. The HPBCD being such a large molecular weight is not absorbed by the mucosa but does facilitate the transfer of the DMT into the bloodstream as the potent freebase by opening up of "tight junctions" as research into HPBCD shows. The HPBCD ends up in the saliva you spit out after 15 minutes. The mucosa under tongue is also only 100 to 200 micrograms thick, it is rich for this activity and many times more potent than normal oral absorption according to Dr. Narang.
 
When you mix it on the spoon, use your muscles to scrape, mix and knead it all together. This is how scientist prepare these complexes, by kneading.
 
1.5 hour incredible experience +5 shulgin in intensity and euphoria and beauty....beautiful geometrics overlaid all surfaces, music beyond heavenly, just incredible music enhancement...actresses on tv look like goddesses.
 
The colors omg are just neon like and out of this world, so beautiful, the shimmering of everything is beyond belief. The beauty with open eyes is divine and infinite. The interconnection of all things is seen, and very deep spiritual insights and healing. I walked out in nature and lost myself in the beauty.
 
None of the negatives of oral Ayahuasca, as oral DMT makes my very nauseated and uncomfortable, this is all positives...very euphoric and straight to bloodstream as the potent freebase.
 
Way better than LSD.....and just as good as high dose cactus tea. I had an experience tonight that blew my mind, this is my method to use every weekend for the rest of my life, Sublingual Ayahuasca is a great way to stay psychedelic for the rest of your life. I re-dosed more HPBCD DMT at the 1.5 hour point, and the fun continued for another 1.5 hour, as the oral harmine has a half life of from 1 to 3 hours, and the THH doubles the half-life of DMT as shown by Dr. Mckenna, I can attest it does. You can keep re-does a 3rd time, as I did many hours later, and was still blown away. I have used it over 50 times in 2 years last year, and loved every minute of it.
 
I've taken oral Ayahuasca over 90 times in a decade, trust me when I say this is so much better, no nausea, no dizziness, as dmt is not travelling thru stomach.
 
More on sublingual Ayahuasca, my psychedelic of choice, I wrote this 2 years ago:
 
1mg LSA + new aldehyde molecule discovery results in effects similar to 100ug LSD: https://www.shroomer...27850299/page/1
 

Edited by tregar, 17 February 2023 - 07:38 AM.





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