64 replies to this topic

[YoshiTrainer]

Below is a chart I put together for no or low prep methods for various grains. To me, soaking, boiling, draining and drying are all a waste of time. For the most part, I measure my grains, add water, then lid/foil and into the PC. For a lot of these grains, it is that simple, for others, a little extra care is needed. With some grains, a pinch of gypsum seems to help, some need rinsing, a few need to be shaken while still hot. These #s are what works for me, you might need small adjustments for your materials. I will also add, smaller jars are more carefree than larger. The values below are grain:water.

Grain 1/4 Pint Pint Lb

Millet 2Tbsp:1Tbsp 1 1/3C:160ml
Milo 2Tbsp:20ml 1 1/3C:200ml
Oats 2Tbsp:20ml 1 1/3C:200ml
Pearled barley 25g:15ml 1lb:270ml
Rye 2Tbsp:20ml 1 1/3C:200ml
RGS 2Tbsp:13ml 1 1/3C:150ml
Wheat 2Tbsp:20ml 1 1/3C:200ml
WBR 25g:17ml 1lb:275ml
WBS 2Tbsp:20ml 1 1/3C:190ml

Millet: a great choice for no prep, cheap and easy to work with. It is 2:1 seed:water by volume, you can let it cool completely in the PC before using.

Milo: Kind of a pain to work with but seems to be good for spawn. Milo benefits from 1tsp of gyp per Qt and a shaking the jar while still hot, after the PC cycle.

Oats: Many love or hate these grains. They are a great price and work really well for hearty spawn. Fairly easy to work with, no gypsum, a warm shake is helpful but not necessary.

Pearled barley: I added this one mostly for edible mycelium TEKs, should be done in bags.

Rye: Another great choice, it is easy to work with, just grain + water, allow to cool in PC.

RGS: Surprisingly easy to work with grain. To measure it is a heavy 2 to a light 1 seed:water ratio by volume. I use RGS for high spawn rate with low nutrition.

Wheat: Another classic, fairly easy to work with, it does benefit from 1tsp gyp per Qt and a warm shake but not absolutely necessary.

Whole Brown Rice (WBR): Another grain I use mostly for edible mycelium TEK. Should use bags for this one.

Wild Bird Seed (WBS): This tends to be dirty and needs rinsing, especially if it has cracked corn in it. It also takes 1tsp gypsum per Qt and must be shaken while hot.

Rinsing: For grains that need rinsing, like WBS, you need cold water, a scale and a strainer. For single jars, add your grains to the jar and weigh it (jar + dried grain). To that # add the weight of the water you will be adding (1ml=1g). The sum will be the final weight of your jar. Rinse with cold water to your heart's content, drain, don't worry about drying. I have a small mesh strainer the fits inside the jars mouth to drain with. Reweigh your jar and top with water til you reach your right weight (jar + dried grain weight + water weight). As an example, if your jar and dry grains weigh 350g and you are adding 200ml water, your jar should weigh 550g after rinsing/draining then topping off. If you normally make multiple jars, consider with the first round weighing them all and taking the average. Just use that average for this and the next runs.



Some final thoughts, no prep will save you tons of time and effort. The grains will not come out evenly hydrated, some will be drier, a few will have burst, some even leave a film in the jar, it is all fine. Of the grains tested, millet, rye and RGS were the easiest to work with then oats, wheat, milo and WBS. Also, maybe anecdotal but grain mixes, seem to work better, two I use a lot are:

I start most of my agar on this grain mix, in a quarter pint jar, add

1 Tbsp oats
1 Tbsp rye
20ml water

PC 90min @15psi

Here it was dumped on MS Starry Night agar



I G2G the quarter pints to these pints then use them to bulk or you could G2G to quarts.

In a pint
2 Tbsp oats
2 Tbsp rye
2 Tbsp millet
2 Tbsp RGS
66ml water

PC 90 min @ 15 psi



W/MS Starry Night



I hope you will try a jar of no prep your next PC cycle and let me know how it works out.

Cheers!

Some conversions

1 1/3 C = 236.59 ml
2 Tbsp = 29.57 ml
1 lb = 454.59 g

Some pics:

Millet

1/4 Pt

(photo coming)

Pt w/Fp+



Qt w/PExAPEU



Milo

1/4 Pt w Fp+



W/MS Starry Night



Pt w/Bell capped subaeruginosa



Qt w/PExAPEU unfortunately I started to shake the jar right before the pic.



Oats

1/4 Pt w MS Starry Night



Oats dumped on Natalensis agar



Pt w/Alutacea



Qt w/Subtropicalis



Pearled barley

Lb w/ Subtropicalis



Rye

1/4 Pt w/Fp+



Pt w/Yellow subaeruginosa



Qt w/PExAPEU



RGS

1/4 Pt w/Pan bisporus



1/2 Pt w/Pan 'Trop Aus'



Pt w/MS Starry Night



Qt w/Pan bisporus



Wheat

1/4 Pt w/MS Starry Night



W/Yellow subaeruginosa



W/Natalensis



Pt w/Gymnopilus purpuratus



Qt w/PExAPEU



WBR

Lb w/Subtropicalis



WBS

1/4 Pt w/PExAPEU



W/Yellow subaeruginosa



W/Subtropicalis



Pt w/W/Yellow subaeruginosa



Qt w/PExAPEU

[MushLuvR]

Wow @YoshiTrainer.... Great information here, especially starting on the smaller 1/4 pints, I've always wanted to try No Prep Oats in quarts, working with Milo lately and it's Dirty AF, but easy to cook and dry.  I do have a couple 1/4 pints laying around from friends over the years that I don't use for anything really.  I do need to quit running quart jars with a big slice of Agar, it's just SLOW.  Anyway, Nice job on all the different grains too, I almost went barley (Oats are expensive currently here) until I found Milo on the cheap.  

Edited by MushLuvR, 16 November 2022 - 12:41 PM.

[DonShadow]

Great write-up Yoshi, thanks for taking the time to share this. Saved for future reference.

[Moonless]

Gonna try this next time. I'm a lazy MF.

[YoshiTrainer]

Thank you guys, hopefully this will help people save some time and effort.

@Mush, the 1/4 pints are nice, once they colonize, G2G are so fast! Plus, lots of shakes for contams, the initial with the agar, once in the middle, shake before G2G, shake midway through the new jar and shake before bulk or another G2G.

[Severian]

How does shaking work with the 1/4 pint? Looks as if you have those totally full?

[YoshiTrainer]

Thank you Severian, the cooked grains only reach the bottom of the jar's threads, plenty of room to shake.

[Severian]

I need to get new plasticjar lids cuz salt air is eating all of mine but I love the idea of agar- to 1/4 pint to grain!

[YoshiTrainer]

I was reminded to use medium heat to bring your PC to temperature, it seems to help reduce burst grains.

[MushLuvR]

I went for it @YoshiTrainer, I was on the hunt for old small jars and found a 4/8/16oz and a quart jar to test (Oats). I have half gallon jars, but they don't fit and not something I use for grain jars anyway. They do however store Cannabis Perfectly though (for years).

Edited by MushLuvR, 22 November 2022 - 03:27 PM.

[MushLuvR]

Went well I think, I could have definitely brought up the PC a bit slower, but I'm not worried about it, minimal bursting and it's mainly the partial seeds which is normal for Oats.  

 

 

 

Individual close-up shots of quart, pint, half pint to a 4oz jelly jar.  A few busted grains in the quart, but not enough to matter and seeds look nice and plump full of water.  I'll let them dry a bit and shoot em' with something.... SOON.  Thanks Yoshi, your measurements were spot on, I went 2 cups of Oats to 240ml of water in the quart, and a smidgen of gypsum if that per jar.  The other 3 were as directed, 20ml, 40ml, and 80ml 

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                 2Tbsp  4Tbsp     8Tbsp or half cup

 

 

 

Edited by MushLuvR, 22 November 2022 - 05:38 PM.

[YoshiTrainer]

Woot woot, great job MushLuvR, I'm glad it went so smoothly! Can't wait to see what you do with them!

[Arathu]

Nice write up Yoshi! Good job man......

 

A

[YoshiTrainer]

Thank you sir!

[MushLuvR]

Eating Shiitakes while browsing Mycotopia... PRICELESS  

 

Jars looked great (No condensation, I tumble my oats multiple times before use) so I did two agar drops to the smaller jars (FP+ 1/4 /Melmac half), and LC'd the pint/quart (PE6 pint and King Trumpets quart of my own LC).  Melmac is DEF clean, the FP+ looks great, but I did get a little yeast contamination last time, could be me though slackin' up or just HIGH AF doing too many projects at once (tents) too so there's always MANY MANY variables as to WHY.  We do what we do and like I always say, the price we pay to play somedays.  Anyway, jars look great and should colonize dem plump seeds no problem.  

[YoshiTrainer]

Sounds like a great way to browse Mycotopia Mush! Thank you for the update, hopefully smooth sailing for you, can't wait to see.

[MushLuvR]

I meant to post the quart jar since it's an oyster (fast to show) and a fresh LC of mine, just under a day since Noc'd (pic below).  The PE6 LC is old, and I hope it jumps off, it may not (I've hit jars again in the past with something else with success) for the pint and the two smallest jars are Agar drops so nothing yet.  But shoot, the test was about the prep, not if I can get them to grow and it works no doubt.     I've been doing my fuel pellets bags all in one lately too, 5 cups of pellets to a quart of water and about a half cup of Bran.  Done and Done, less mess and easy PEAZY!  I'm pretty sure I'm not dropping Oats in boiling water any longer either, and or cooking Milo.  I'll give the Milo a cycle... SOON.  All best to your success.  

 

 

[YoshiTrainer]

Thank you for the update MushLuvR, oysters are beasts for sure! Part of no-prepping is getting myc to grow on it so appreciate the info. Good job w/the no-prep HWFP, it is always nice to find that sweet spot in a recipe. Good luck with the milo, for your sake, shake it hot!

[MushLuvR]

Right on track with the KO LC jar, today is the 11th day so 10 complete and the quart as you can see is nearly full like I prefer of 2 cups of Oats.  Normal range of liquid 2ccs to 2.5.  KO's are always under 2 weeks and being in the low 70's for colonization, All Good and healthy.  

 

 

 

[YoshiTrainer]

Looks nice and healthy MushLuvR, thank you for the update!