Salvinorin HPBCD Cyclodextrin Complexation for Sublingual Administration
I am in a great mood (strong afterglow) this morning after having a +5 Shulgin level experience last night with a tea I made from 750 grams of home grown very potent bridgesii chunks from around the core boiled into a tea. Drank the tea first, then 1 hour later took 5 hits of LSD, also drank a morning glory seed solution in sherry wine made from 25g (875) seeds. I took the MG seed wine at same time as LSD. The MG seed wine adds divine spirituality, infinite beauty & euphoria, incredible dimensions, extreme saturated color & music enhancement to the experience along with the mescaline. Absolutely amazing experience all night long. Highly recommend. I do this at least once a month.
How to make the zero nausea morning glory wine: https://www.shroomer...Number/27850299
Concerning thread "Salvinorin Cyclodextrin Complexation for Sublingual Administration" by Brennendes Wasser
Brennendes Wasser said:
So I was thinking about making a Salvia Nosespray the first time I had some, but then tossed it as my stuff still had some grey impurity. My only experience with smoked Salvia in Holland was way too harsh to give it another BIG go Shocked . Therefore I thought I would toss this molecule completely.But now I might tackle it again as I may pre-weigh the Salvinorin much better with some crystals.So Loveall you found that you should stirr the Salvinorin in excess Ethanol while evaporating, to ensure close contact with HPBCD and then re-dissolve in any suitable liquid?My plan would be as following:10 mg Salvinorin A3x EQ of HPBCDin 0,5 ml Ethanolstirred for 2 h and then evaporated overnight.This is dissolved in 0,5 ml water and put into a Nosespray.I guess a super easy proof of Complexation is even if everything dissolves later in water or not ConfusedAs I know that 1 push Nosespray = 0,... mg of Salvinorin A (in theory), I could sit there and start ramping up that Nosespray to record whenever I get some effects.So I guess 10 mg totaly would be enough to at least get a threshold effect IF all the Salvinorin was complexed? If absolutely nothing happens after incorporating that 10 mg I guess it is more likely that the complexation did not work (or did not enhance bioavailability) than the dose was too small?
May I make a kind suggestion. I'm a lifetime chemist and have used cyclodextrins for over 2 decades. I used to complex HPBCD to pro-hormones and testosterone to make them absorb under tongue with incredible penetration. 20 years ago I used to converse with chemist Patrick Arnold on how to complex pro-hormones when they were legal until the Gov't banned them, as they worked as well as regular testosteone. Then used with DMT at least 50 times over a 2 year period.
--> Drop the ethanol as ethanol is not used when complexing freebase alkaloids to HPBCD, as the ethanol is polar and competes for entry into the hydrophobic (water repelling) inner HPBCD cone. The outside of the HPBCD cone is hydrophilic (mixes with water).
This means your salvinorin A has much less chance of entering the tornado trap cone of the HPBCD in appreciable quantitites as the ethanol will also be entering.
From "Thermodynamic properties of hydroxypropyl Beta cyclodextrin and guest interaction, a survey of recent studies, 2021.pdf" page 4 top:
Calorimetric titration showed that at ethanol molar fraction higher than 0.2 at neutral and alkaline pH, and higher than 0.1 at acidic pH, the complex does not form. These results indicate that ethanol competes with water for the cavity of HP-β-CD. DSC data of dried HP-β-CD, coming from hydroalcoholic solutions, confrm this hypothesis. In summary, the solubility enhancement of quercetin in higher concentrations of ethanol is counterbalanced by a lower propensity for the complex formation.
The absorption of drugs through the sublingual route is 3 to 10 times greater than oral route and is surpassed by hypodermic injection. Sublingual mucosa under tongue is only 100 to 200 microns thick.
MESO-Rx, "Ask Patrick Arnold #10", April 15, 1999 By Chemist & bodybuilder Patrick Arnold:
Sublingual hydroxypropylbetacyclodextrin (HPBCD) complexed testosterone has a very high bioavailabilty however as the peak blood levels are seen rather quickly (20 to 40 minutes). These peaks are quite high however and the drop off is substantially gradual as in the EMU study testosterone levels of greater than 60% over baseline were still measured after 2 hours.Straight testosterone or prohormones do not have very good absorption under the tongue. When complexed with cyclodextrin the properties change to enable it to absorb extremely well. It would be a long and detailed explanation but that is the jist of it.
DMT is very similar to pro-hormones, poor absorption under tongue, but when complexed to HPBCD, it absorb's extremely well, studies show up to 400% increased penetration. Chemist Patrick Arnold taught me how to complex pro-hormones in my 20's: Ask Patrick Arnold #11 - MESO-Rx (thinksteroids.com)
Patrick Arnold's latest project: Once part of sports' dark era, Patrick Arnold is on new quest | News | news-gazette.com
Instructions for complexing Salvinorin A to HPBCD or Hydroxy Propyl Beta Cyclodextrin. You can use the more common Beta-hydroxy propyl beta cyclodextrin, works just as well as the plain HPBCD. I bought a 1 kilogram tub from china for only sixty dollars many years ago.
1. Add 10mg salivonrin A to a spoon.
2. Molar mass of salvinorin A is 432.469 g·mol−1, add 1:1 molar ratio of host drug DMT (432g/mol) to HPBCD (1300g/mol) powder, this means 1:3 mg ratio host drug to HPBCD. The HPBCD is only able to complex freebase drugs, not the salt or hcl.
3. So then add x 3 or 30mg HPBCD to the spoon on top the salvinorin A.
4. Add 3 to 4 drops of very hot near boiling water from a nearby microwaved coffee cup to the mix and crush the ingredients together for 2 minutes. Since the HPBCD is like a glucose sugar it shrinks down to nothing and complexes with the host drug.
5. Place complex under tongue and hold for 5 minutes, it will all dissolve. Simply place underside of tongue onto spoon, the complex will all adhere as it is sticky.
6. HPBCD has been shown in studies to increase penetration of the freebase host drug by up to 400% into the sublingual mucosa under the tongue. The bulky HPBCD is not dissolved but it opens tight juctions under the tongue so that the host drug can enter with greatly increased efficiency. Most of the bulky HPBCD ends up in your saliva that you spit out into a cup after 10 minutes.
7. I have used this same HPBCD formula to complex DMT and it achieves even greater absorption into bloodstream then even oral dmt taken with 200mg harmine, 60mg easily a +3 Strength level, 100mg is a +5 level.
Full instructions for sublingual or the one-shot HPBCD DMT Ayahuasca (your choice):
1) place 60mg of DMT onto a spoon (60mg for beginners)
2) add 1:1 molar ratio of host drug DMT (188g/mol) to HPBCD (1300g/mol) powder, this means 1:7 mg ratio DMT freebase to HPBCD, use a 1:8 mg ratio DMT to HPBCD if you are using the 2-Hydroxypropyl-β-cyclodextrin. For harmine freebase, 212g/mol or 1:6mg ratio harmine to HPBCD. The HPBCD is only able to complex freebase drugs, not the salt or hcl.
3) this means 60mg dmt placed on spoon, then add 420mg of HPBCD on top DMT, use 480mg HPBCD if you are using the 2-Hydroxypropyl-β-cyclodextrin.
4) add 8 drops of very hot near boiling water to the mix from a nearby microwaved coffee mug for DMT doses of 90mg, use 10 drops of boiling hot water to mix DMT doses of 120mg. Use 10 to 12 drops of hot water for 150mg DMT. 10 drops usually still works well for 150mg DMT. Just experiment a bit. You will want to use less drops of hot water (1 drop per 12mg DMT) for higher doses of DMT so it will fit comfortably below the tongue. 60mg DMT = +3 Shulgin level strength, 90mg DMT = +4 Shulgin level life strength. 120 to 150mg DMT = +5 Shulgin level life changing experience.
5) Knead or crush the HPBCD powder into the dmt using the end of another spoon for 2 minutes, scrape & mix everything back and forth hard using your muscles. This is how scientist pre-pare these complexes by kneading.
Note: DRY THE BOTTOM of tongue/sublingual mucosa with a tissue before applying.
What I do now is take 200mg of harmine and 200mg of pure THH orally, then 1 hour later once I feel the harmine and THH, I take sublingual HPBCD DMT (around 100mg) hold under tongue for 15 minutes, all dissolves, gives a 1.5 hour very strong extremely euphoric and visual experience, then I re-dose more sublingual DMT at the 1.5 hour point again, holding under tongue, continues to work at full strength, as the oral harmine has a half life of from 1 to 3 hours, continues to work for 3 hours to 5 hours. Please start with only 60mg DMT if you duplicate this, 60mg = +3, 100mg = +5 in strength.
I way prefer taking DMT under tongue instead of orally, as zero nausea, goes straight to brain, no dizziness, the only way I use it, very bad ass this way. None of the negatives of oral Ayahausca. There is something about DMT moving thru the stomach that makes it nausea prone, dizzy, and weird and strange, this is all avoided by using it under tongue. The harmine lowers MAO in the brain for 3 to 5 hours, so you can use the dmt under tongue with many re-doses, as it prevents the DMT from being zapped by mitochondria in the brain.
One-shot hpbcd dmt ayahuasca and sublingual hpbcd dmt ayahuasca, absorbs 2 to 3 times better than DMT salts, masks taste - Botanicals - Mycotopia
I don't have access to Salvinorin A, but can assure you, this HPBCD complexing of host freebase drugs with plain hot water, and formed on a spoon in only 2 minutes will astound you. HPBCD is one of the greatest modern discoveries in the field of pharmacology and chemistry.
Edited by tregar, 05 January 2023 - 04:18 PM.