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castings n coir ???


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#1 Guest_eraupe_*

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Posted 08 February 2005 - 05:38 AM

Hi,
I am planning on using a 50/50 mix of worm castings and straw as the substrate in my next grow. I have read that pasteurizing castings via hot water pasteurization in a pillow case can get messy; namely the castings turn to mud and leach out of the pillow case. I have no access to an oven in my current residence, so I cannot pasteurize the castings there. However, I do have a 5 gallon pot that can hold 6-1qt jars, and a small alcohol stove capable of bringing several gallons of water to a boil.

I was thinking of using the following setup to pasteurize my substrate mix without allowing the castings to leach.

Posted Image

I plan to:
-soak the the straw for several hours
-add lime to boost pH
-then mix straw, castings and water, bring to a little wetter than field capacity
-pack into jars
-Heat until core temperature in center jar is 160-180*F, hold there for 90min.
-Allow to cool
-Check Hydration
-Mix with grain spawn.

Should this setup be effective in pasteurizing the castings/straw mix without allowing the castings to leach? Should I simply leave the lids on the jars loose, or just take off the lids and tin foil them? Will the jars burst? Any tips, ideas, or suggestions are welcome. Thanks

#2 Guest_rodger_*

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Posted 08 February 2005 - 07:26 AM

That is essentially my pasteurization tek. Place the jars in COLD water, put the lid on the pot and bring to a boil. As soon as the water boils, shut off the heat and allow the jars to remain in the hot water. When cool, remove and use.

Put filtered lids on the jars, and cover with foil. No need for a thermometer.

#3 Guest_hippie3_*

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Posted 08 February 2005 - 08:30 AM

or just try this -
http://mycotopia.net...tml ?1078666159
for fast easy way to do larger amounts

#4 Guest_eraupe_*

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Posted 08 February 2005 - 03:57 PM

I was initially going to build one of those steam pasteurizers and just do 4 tubs of straw/castings, but unfortunately space and cost became an issue. I don't really have the space for the cooler and steamer in my place without it being extremely conspicuous. So instead of the 4 tubs and steamer, I plan to do 20 of those 9x12" glad ovenware trays full of 1 qt. of spawn, and 1 qt. 50/50 straw/castings mix, cased with jiffy mix. I figure the high spawn:substrate ratio will result in quick colonization, and the tray depth/size will give me 1 or 2 decent flushes, then I dunk, recase, and see what I can get. In the past, I have used the smaller 8x8" trays with only cased grain, with good results. Since much less straw/castings is needed, I can pasteurize as described above with equipment I already have, saving me money.

I really wish I could do the steam pasteurization, the idea is so perfect. When I first came across the plans in the archives I was so excited, having just run into contam. problems with straw I attempted to pasteurize in hot water, with insufficient equipment. Maybe sometime in the future I will build the steamer, when space and cost aren't such a big issue.

Rodger, should I use tyvek or polyfil lids on the jars? Which will hold the moisture in the jars better?

Thanks guys.Posted Image

#5 Guest_i_am_me_*

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Posted 08 February 2005 - 04:02 PM

I enjoy this method as well.

No tyvek or polyfil lids on top, you're spawning out of the jars, the substrate doesn't stay there unless you want to spawn into it and mix it up to fruit from the jars.

#6 sparky

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Posted 08 February 2005 - 07:54 PM

Ya Rodgers in the jar tek is the ONLY way to fly for small to medium quantities of substrate. Its super foolproof, even i can do it.

Posted Image

#7 Guest_realschmeal_*

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Posted 08 February 2005 - 08:21 PM

I had a problem with jars tipping over, then I found out that I can stuff an extra pint jar in with 7 quarts - put a large metal hook into the substrate in the pint and hook it to an adjacent qt jar so it won't sink and then there's no room for the jars to tip over. I need to get a couple of bricks for when I want to do just a few jars, I guess. I don't see why lids would be necessary, but maybe Roger has a good reason.

One thing I love about this is that it is a relatively mess free tek, you can do most of the clean up in the kitchen sink.

#8 sparky

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Posted 08 February 2005 - 08:29 PM

way!

actualy I dont fill it so full that the jars tip easily, I do have holes in the lids because I dont have lids without holes , lol.

or as an idea, you could put some foil balls in the pot to steady up the jars, something like that..
Posted Image

#9 Guest_rodger_*

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Posted 08 February 2005 - 09:38 PM

If the jars are tipping over, just add a few extra jars full of water so the pot is full. You want as much water in the pot as possible when you pasteurize by the jar method. I use synthetic filter disks over the top of the original metal lid. The metal lid has two 1/8" holes drilled into it. The metal lid keeps the material from drying out inside. The filter helps it to have a shelf life after pasteurization of a few days.

#10 Guest_eraupe_*

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Posted 08 February 2005 - 10:15 PM

Rodger,
When you put the lids on, do you put them upside-down or right-side-up?

#11 Guest_suckerfree_*

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Posted 08 February 2005 - 10:18 PM

right side up here, and i don't use polyfil, i use when i remove from PC (cooled overnight).

#12 Guest_rodger_*

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Posted 08 February 2005 - 10:25 PM

I use the lids upside down so the rubber doesn't stick to the jar and make it hard to get the lid off. That's the way I do grain spawn jars too. The lid always upside down, with the filter on the outside, then the ring over both.

#13 Guest_cheese_*

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Posted 14 February 2005 - 08:15 PM

Earlier, I said i was going to use straw, decided not to do that, since it is my first time, but I do want to do a casing with at least one of my cakes. So how much coir/worm castings should I use for just one cake? What percentage coir to worm castings? The one cake is going faster than the rest?

Also, how long after full colonization should I crumble it and case it with coir and worm castings? I'm guessing 2-3 days full colonization of one of the cakes. Most of the others are moving slower.

#14 insight

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Posted 14 February 2005 - 08:49 PM

I use 60/40 verm/coir with lime. Usually 3-5 days after 100% colonizations, I'll crumle 2-4 cakes, mix with a little patuerized verm/coir/lime (as substrate) and places mixture on some moist verm. Let sit 3 days to recolonize. Add casing layer, let sit 1 day and expose to fruiting conditions.

#15 toasty

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Posted 14 February 2005 - 09:06 PM

If you put your worm casting into the casing, Chances are good that contams will prevail.

#16 Guest_cheese_*

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Posted 14 February 2005 - 10:21 PM

I'm not talking about the top casing layer, I'm talking about mix it with the coir and the mixing that with the brf cakes. Then once that colonizes, I would put a coir layer on top as the casing and then case. Does that sound right?

#17 Guest_golly_*

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Posted 14 February 2005 - 10:47 PM

10-60% worm shite to coir would be fine ,,u have a lot of latitude using coir/poo ...For me ,i would leave the straw out too cause it is more contam prone than coir or poo imo.
As for casing layer most peeps would mix verm /coir or verm/peat ..Overlay is more likely with pure coir casing according to some....
Your substrate size should b 2-4 times the volume of the cake ..

#18 smegma

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Posted 08 March 2005 - 03:15 PM

LOTS o questions today fellas, hope I am not an annoyance. If I am, tll me how to make it up to you all.

Does coir/worm poo generally NEED to be PH adjusted?

SHOULD it be?

To what range?

IS coir/poo more prone to trich than other substrates in your opinion?

#19 nicholas

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Posted 08 March 2005 - 03:22 PM

It never hurts to add a pinch of lime. Mycelium likes a basified environment. Coir/poo as a substrate should be fine....as a casing however, anything with nutrients is a contam risk. You gonna use the coir/poo as a cake or...?

#20 smegma

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Posted 08 March 2005 - 03:30 PM

It never hurts to add a pinch of lime. Mycelium likes a basified environment. Coir/poo as a substrate should be fine....as a casing however, anything with nutrients is a contam risk. You gonna use the coir/poo as a cake or...?


Used as substrate in a cat litter pan, spawned with cloned 'texas oyster' WBS, uncased through first flush (because I for some reasonget a MONSTER first flush uncased with this setup), rinsed, dunked, then cased with a thin layer of STERILIZED verm for later flushes.

This is the collective advice I have been given for my skill set, chosen methods and available products.




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