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experiment -BlueFoot cakes (really Ps.Ovoideocystidata)


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#1 mycobri

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Posted 01 September 2007 - 09:01 AM

so this is an experiment to attempt to fruit ps. caerulipes from a cake that already has a casing layer.

it is based on the radel / cyano idea of a core and shell.
this will be attempt #2 at fruiting ps. caerulipes ;)

as far as ID of spores, these are the spores directly from the Bluefoots that Golly fruited.

not sure of the difference between ps. Caerulipes and ps. ovoideocystidiata, but they are one of the two:eusa_thin

PP5 deli containers will be used.

the core ingredients dry
bf supercake core dry.jpg
using hips supercake mix for best results.
bf supercake mix wet.jpg
after adding water and verm


the shell ingredients dry
bf dry shell mix.jpg
• there are very thin coffee stirrer bits boiled for an hour or so to make them soft.
i believe they are birch (thanks orchidman)
• 3 spoonfuls of Rye Grass Seed
• 12 0z. of Agway premium potting soil


the shell mix is wet to field capacity
bf shell mix wet.jpg
a pan works well as water can be added and the pan tilted to drain.
6 oz. Manure / kelp tea was used to hydrate the mix.
then a small amount of verm if needed to bring down to field capacity

bf shell prod.jpg
then the outer shell was formed by loading the mix in along the outer edge of a 1/2 pint widemouth
and pressed in a circular motion to firm up the shell.

then the core is loaded.
bf shellcore.jpg
they are topped off with a thick dry verm barrier.
then they temporary foil lids are rubberbanded on and toothpick sized holes added for venting.
bf foil pc.jpg
after sterilization and cooling the foil lids will be switched with PP5 lids in a GB then knoc'd
so far this is the method that will be used.

ran into a few problems so far though:

the first batch was badly burned and some pp5's melted in the pc. :thumbdown:

the second batch was made, PC'd and then it was realized that there were mealworms in the substrate :nunchuck::puke:

all that time and work wasted! :eusa_doh:
luckily the jars were not knoc'd and no spores wasted.

fresh brf will be purchased and round three will begin this weekend.

feel free to share any helpful ideas :bow:

#2 mycobri

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Posted 01 September 2007 - 09:20 AM

To test the syringes for contams some popcorn quarts and an LC were started.
bf backup quarts.jpg
the two on the left were colonizing at 82 degrees in a TIT incubator.
the two on the right were colonizing at room temps (about 72 degrees) in a cardboard box

so it seems safe to say that they do better at room temps as previously recommended. ;)

the karo / water LC is actually doing good so far.
maybe extra bluefoot cakes will be able to be produced if the LC works out.

#3 golly

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Posted 01 September 2007 - 09:30 AM

Glad your trying those spores out Myco..They are indeed Caerulipes...

Think you will need some kind of Lignin source for fruiting though, like sawdust,chips or mulch..

I could see this working as long as u can provide cool room temps for the fruiting [60s].... In higher temps the risk of mold increases, as it takes much longer to pin than a Cube cake ...

Keep us posted Mang ..gluk

#4 Hippie3

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Posted 01 September 2007 - 09:37 AM

good luck!

#5 mycobri

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Posted 01 September 2007 - 09:40 AM

thanks. i will :thumbup::bow:
mulch is a great idea.
i think some mulch will replace the coffee stirrer bits on the next batch

#6 the jesus

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Posted 01 September 2007 - 09:48 AM

Interesting stuff bri, can't wait to see how it turns out. :bow:

#7 Guest_vinz_*

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Posted 02 September 2007 - 06:49 AM

good luck!:bow:

#8 cheshire

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Posted 02 September 2007 - 06:56 AM

hope these turn out good :meditate:

#9 mycobri

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Posted 02 September 2007 - 07:02 AM

Thanks for you support! :)

Glad your trying those spores out Myco..They are indeed Caerulipes...

yeah now that i read in the vaults a bit,
i see this matter has been settled.

looks like ps. ovoideocystidiata would have purple spores.

so these are ps. Caerulipes and do indeed have rusty brown spores.

in the pics -the top rows are cubes (purple)
the bottom ones are the ps. Caerulipes (rusty brown)

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#10 Workman

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Posted 02 September 2007 - 04:24 PM

Whoa, wait. So these are real Psilocybe caerulipes? I definately need some spores of that for confirmation and experimentation. Are there pictures of the mushrooms that these spore came from?

#11 Workman

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Posted 03 September 2007 - 03:12 PM

I've reviewed the relevent threads on this particular grow and have concluded that despite the off colored spores, these still appear to be P. ovoideocystidiata and not P. caerulipes. The membranous ring on the stalk is a dead give away and the tendency to stain blue is much more pronounced in the ovoids.

But, that said, its best not to assume too much from pictures. The two species can be easily seperated by the spore shape since they belong to different Sections.

Psilocybe caerulipes
Section: Semilanceata
Spores 7-10 microns ellipisoid.

Psilocybe ovoideocystidiata
Section: Stuntzae
Spores 8-9 microns rhomboid.

Spore examination pending. I have also been granted access to P. caerulipes herbarium material for a direct comparison when it arrives. Unfortunately the herbarium material is old and likely unviable.

#12 mycobri

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Posted 03 September 2007 - 05:00 PM

Thanks workman. :thumbup:

Until then the grow will proceed as planned
using a replacement for the coffee stirrers,
maybe some mulch or hickory chips as sawdust.
Oak is also available
:eusa_thin
also after some reading, it seems that Humus is a good part decomposed Lignin. so maybe Humus will replace the potting soil.

any opinions about Apple woodchips?
some apple woodchips are available and i belive apple is a hardwood.

#13 golly

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Posted 03 September 2007 - 05:39 PM

Make that double whoa...!!
I based a good part of my reasoning on your work with the Ovoids WM ..Not only is the spore color dramatically different in all the ones i grew but the overall appearance of the fruitbody itself ..Although i cannot describe the difference in myco lingo - I can send you a print..
This needs to be put to rest because every thread has similar comments..

The ones i grew indoors did not blue at all, just the outside grown, showed gradual bluing...Why would a Bluefoot not be blue...? inquiring minds...

#14 Workman

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Posted 03 September 2007 - 06:38 PM

I hope it is different. I have spores from your specimens coming via other members so I should have something more solid to report soon.

I guess I should have paid more attention to the brown spored version at the time it first came up but I was just assuming it was the same species everyone else was working on.

#15 Hippie3

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Posted 03 September 2007 - 06:49 PM

I've reviewed the relevent threads on this particular grow


would someone plz link the 'relevant threads'
for the record ?

#16 mycobri

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Posted 03 September 2007 - 07:01 PM

here are a bunch of links i found to threads and
some important posts,
and some pics of the original wild mushrooms posted by llamabox.
i'm sure i missed a thread or two

llamabox posted this pic of wild specimen
http://mycotopia.net...3-bluehabxi.jpg

from this post
http://mycotopia.net...992-post12.html

original marketplace thread
http://mycotopia.net...oot-prints.html

llama's post to location
http://mycotopia.net...468-post30.html

more habitat
http://mycotopia.net...617-post34.html

original finds
http://mycotopia.net...6995-post1.html

golly's outdoor grow
http://mycotopia.net...door-patch.html

mycobri failed first attempt
http://mycotopia.net...containers.html

workman's ovoid thread / more of the mystery
http://mycotopia.net...y-outdoors.html

golly's grow & foster's accidental fruiting
http://mycotopia.net...pes-merged.html

llama's post about all the prints origins
http://mycotopia.net...8056-post9.html

from
http://mycotopia.net...ment-rages.html

llamabox posts someone elses indoor grow
http://mycotopia.net...r-fruiting.html

#17 Hippie3

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Posted 03 September 2007 - 07:18 PM

thx
:bow:

#18 golly

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Posted 03 September 2007 - 07:38 PM

Thanx for posting those links Myco ..Sorry your thread is getting derailed ,we can split it off if you like...
WM..Had i seen your last post in the Ovoids thread - i would have sent a print a long time ago...heh,, oh well...
I don't mind what it turns out to be - i just want my kids to have a real name...I gotta believe they are different though, although there is a red spore Cube and Panaeolus ,so i guess anything is possible..

#19 mycobri

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Posted 03 September 2007 - 07:44 PM

no need to seperate the thread, unless you want to :)
i enjoy the identification process

the spores from your children Golly were used in this 'experiment' ;)

the spores that will be sent in for identification by workman
will be from the print originally recieved from llamabox.

:bow:

#20 golly

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Posted 03 September 2007 - 08:03 PM

One would not think that these are the same mushrooms from the same patch..but they are..

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