24 replies to this topic

[Irishlion]

This table is for a general reference of what active chemicals are in each cacti

Trichocereus bridgesii

Mescaline 50/100g fresh >50%

3-Methoxytyramine <1%

3,4-Dimethoxyphenylethylamine <1%

Tyramine <1%

Bridgesigenin A

Bridgesigenin B

Kaempferol Flavonoid acting as a Mao-i

Quercetin Flavonoid acting as a Mao-i



Trichocereus camarguensis

tyramine >50%

3,4-dimethoxyphenylethylamine <1%

3-methoxytyramine traces

N-methyltyramine traces


Trichocereus candicans

hordenine >50mg/100g >50%


Trichocereus chilensis
NONE


Trichocereus courantii

N-methyltyramine 10-50mg/100g >50%

N-methyl-3-methoxytyramine 10-50%

tyramine <1%

3-methoxytyramine <1%

3,4-dimethoxyphenethylamine <1%


Trichocereus cuzcoensis

3-methoxytyramine >50mg/100g >50%

tyramine <1%

mescaline <1%

3-hydroxy-4,5-dimethoxyphenethylamine trace


Trichocereus fulvilanus

tyramine >50mg/100g 10-50%

N-methyltyramine 10-50%

mescaline trace


Thrichocereus huascha

hordenine 10-50mg/100g 100%


Trichocereus knuthianus

tyramine 10-50mg/100g 10-50%

3-methoxytyramine 10-50%


Trichocereus lamprochlorus

hordenine 10-50mg/100g >50%


Trichocereus macrogonus

mescaline 10-50mg/100g >50%

3,4-dimethoxyphenylethylamine <1%

3-methoxytyramine <1%

tyramine <1%


Trichocereus manguinii

tyramine 10-50mg/100g 10-50%

N-methyltyramine 10-50%

hordenine 10-50%

3-methoxytyramine <1%


Trichocereus pachanoi

mescaline >50mg/100g >50%

3,4-dimethoxyphenylethylamine <1%

hordenine traces

tyramine traces

3-methoxytyramine <1%

3,5-dimethoxy-4-hydroxyphenylethylamine traces

3,4-dimethoxy-5-hydroxyphenylethylamine traces

anhalonidine traces

mescaline 0.331%/255gm dried

mescaline .357%/base


Trichocereus pasacana

hordenine 1-10mg/100g >50%


Trichocereus peruvianus

tyramine 1-10mg/100g >50%

3-methoxytyramine traces

two unknown alkaloids <1%

mescaline .817%/dry

tyramine .0085%/dry

3-methoxytyramine .01%/dry

3,5-dimethoxy-4-hydroxyphenylethylamine .0035%/dry


Trichocereus purpureopilosus

tyramine 10-50mg/100g 10-50%

N-methyltyramine 10-50%


Trichocereus poco

hordenine 1-10mg/100g >50%



Trichocereus santiaguensis

hordenine 1-10mg/100g 10-50%

tyramine 10-50%


Trichocereus schickendantzii

hordenine 1-10mg/100g >50%

N-methyltyramine traces


Trichocereus skottsbergii

hordenine 10-50mg/100g >50%

N-methyltyramine <1%


Trichocereus spachianus

hordenine 1-10mg/100g >50%


Trichocereus strigosus

hordenine 10-50mg/100g 100%


Trichocereus taquimbalensis

mescaline 10-50mg/100g >50%

hordenine <1%

3,4-dimethoxyphenethylamine trace

3-methoxytyramine trace

Trichocereus terscheckii

mescaline 10-50mg/100g >50%


Trichocereus thelegonoides

hordenine 10-50mg/100g 100%


Trichocereus thelegonus

hordenine 10-50mg/100g >50%

N-methyltyramine trace

Trichocereus tunariensis

tyramine 10-50mg/100g 10-50%

hordenine 10-50%


Trichocereus validus

mescaline >50mg/100g >50%



Trichocereus werdermannianus

mescaline 10-50mg/100g >50%

3,4-dimethoxyphenylethylamine <1%

tyramine traces

3-methoxytyramine <1%

3,5-dimethoxy-4-hydroxyphenylethylamine traces


One must remember that the amounts of each chemical present in each cacti can vary from a little to alot based on enviromental varibles. I hope this helps anyone that is wanting to know what is in trich Cacti and will give you a good Idea of their mescline contents. :cacti: :cacti: :cacti: :cacti: :cacti: :cacti: :cacti:

Edited by Irishlion, 30 March 2011 - 06:41 AM.

[Shadowlord]

Great info Irish!
Very helpful and insightful. Nice to know what has what in it. And it'll give me an idea of what alkaloids are in these cacti so as to know what is the reason for the difference in the experience from Cacti/cacti tea vs. Extracted Mescaline.
The in depth type of info I've come to expect from my fellow 'Topiates
:bow:

[Irishlion]

thanks man. took me like 3 hours to type that shit and a lots of research to find that shit. Nice to see my research has been appericiated:rasta::eusa_clap:headbang:

[cactuswren]

Institut für Pharmakologie, Toxikologie und Pharmazie, Tierärztlichen Hochschule Hannover.
Hordenine (N,N-dimethyltyramine) is a phenylethylamine alkaloid with antibacterial and antibiotic properties. It stimulates the release of norepinephrine Results of some experiments in pharmacological models show that hordenine is an indirectly acting adrenergic drug. It liberates norepinephrine from stores. In isolated organs and those structures with reduced epinephrine contents the hordenine-effect is only very poor. Experiments in intact animals (rats, dogs) show that hordenine has a positive inotropic effect upon the heart, increases systolic and diastolic blood pressure, peripheral blood flow volume, inhibits gut movements but has no effect upon the psychomotorical behaviour of mice.




Hordenine is one of the alkaloids in Peyote that explains it's use by Native Americans and some of the indigenous people of Mexico as a topical treatment for wounds to prevent infection. I didn't know that it is being sold now as a weight loss supplement and is popular with some body builders. It is also added to animal feed. This could be the alkaloid in Trichocereous Pachanoi that causes the "speedy" effect some report. I never felt an increased heart rate with peyote, most likely due to pellotine and other akaloids that balance out that effect. Thanks for the information Irishlion.

[twoguysupnorth]

thanks to both irishlion and cactuswren. cactus your info is really interesting since i suffer from bloodflow problems in my legs and feet and also (not recently) have a spastic stomach. something to look into for sure.:bow:

[teesus]

cool info. so t.peruvianus dosn't have much mescaline at all?!
i have some dried t.candicans. wonder if hordeninextraction works the same way than a mescextraction. does anybody know?

[jason_]

took me like 3 hours to type that shit and a lots of research to find that shit. Nice to see my research has been appericiated

Certainly appreciated... I am always looking for similar info and it usually takes a good bit of research to find info just for one or two cacti for comparison, much less more than thirty!

Nice work indeed.

Can I ask how exactly what the research for this chart carried out- are these numbers just compiled from various other sources?

-Jason

[Irishlion]

its off a study that is called
Agurell 69.2 . and
Agurell et al 71

[rocketman]

If I am not mistaken these refer to a small sample or even one plant in most cases. The problem is and will be in the future is being able to determine the difference between these plants as far as identification. You can believe what you are told by self proclaimed experts, or do your own experimentation.

Saying T. Pachanoi has a 1-2% mescaline profile is very much the same as saying Skunk has 10-22% thc.

Variables: particular clone, seed grown, time of year, lighting....pretty much the same for both MJ and cacti that contain mescaline.

There has been magic found in cacti that your list says has none, and vice versa. There is a true cluster fuck where cactus and potency are concerned. Hell if you ask 2 "experts" you likely wouldnt get the same answer as far as identification of a particular plant.

Edited to say: Use this list as a sort of guide maybe, but the only true way to know which cactus has what is to acquire a proven clone from a friend or reliable source.

[Irishlion]

that why it says

This table is for a general reference of what active chemicals are in each cacti

and

One must remember that the amounts of each chemical present in each cacti can vary from a little to alot based on enviromental varibles.

And for those interested here is a excellent link for most any info that is cacti related http://users.lycaeum...us/cactindx.htm its called the Visionary's Cacti Guide. I hope this helps someone from new to well experienced. I have loked through this and man there is so much info on cacti there its unreal or atleast IMO it is.

[rocketman]

If I am not mistaken these refer to a small sample or even one plant in most cases. The problem is and will be in the future is being able to determine the difference between these plants as far as identification. You can believe what you are told by self proclaimed experts, or do your own experimentation.
Saying T. Pachanoi has a 1-2% mescaline profile is very much the same as saying Skunk has 10-22% thc.
Variables: particular clone, seed grown, time of year, lighting....pretty much the same for both MJ and cacti that contain mescaline.
There has been magic found in cacti that your list says has none, and vice versa. There is a true cluster fuck where cactus and potency are concerned. Hell if you ask 2 "experts" you likely wouldnt get the same answer as far as identification of a particular plant.
Edited to say: Use this list as a sort of guide maybe, but the only true way to know which cactus has what is to acquire a proven clone from a friend or reliable source.

Thats why I said this. It does differ if you read it closely. I gave the reasons why.

[cactuswren]

cool info. so t.peruvianus dosn't have much mescaline at all?!
i have some dried t.candicans. wonder if hordeninextraction works the same way than a mescextraction. does anybody know?

I have yet to see a taxonomic key that empirically defines what is [and isn't] T. peruvianus which is why I avoid it for ritual purposes unless it comes from a friend or expert in the field. I've read lab results that range from .0-3% [mescaline], most coming in at .5-1.35. Unless the studies are all using the same material, the percentages don't mean much. Plants such as T. macrogonus and T. bridgesii have more consistency in identification and alkaloid percentages. Certain clones of these have been proven to be reliable performers such as RS0004 and SS02. What I like about the lab data is the identification of alkaloids in the plant other than mescaline. I also look at the total percentage of alkaloids in the sample used, and where each alkaloid stands in making up that total. When you do find a plant that "speaks to you" more than others, grow lots of them and you will have no further worries about which cactus to use for therapeutic purposes.

[cuts]

Damn, I'd say that gives a pretty good idea of what you'd be getting if you had one of those cacti. Even if the alkaloid content does vary it gives you an idea. And that can make all the difference when it comes time for dosing. :cacti:

[PsyBearknot]

I think the alkaloid discussion is a very interesting one. I have always been interested in the pure Mescaline adventure from extraction.

I remember reading a post here while researching extracting Mescaline about some one who isolated the mescaline, and also isolated the other alkaloids. Does anyone remember what post that is in?

I think this would be a interesting way to get the high mescaline content one is looking for and be able to supplement it with some of the other alkaloids. This giving you a magic mix and controlling how much of a body load you experience.

[danzick]

Thanks much Irish and Cactuswren. Very useful info!!

[DrAstronaut]

Cool thread! I have been looking for this info...you saved me a trip to the library. Thanks for sharing!

[rocketman]

I think the alkaloid discussion is a very interesting one. I have always been interested in the pure Mescaline adventure from extraction.

I remember reading a post here while researching extracting Mescaline about some one who isolated the mescaline, and also isolated the other alkaloids. Does anyone remember what post that is in?

I think this would be a interesting way to get the high mescaline content one is looking for and be able to supplement it with some of the other alkaloids. This giving you a magic mix and controlling how much of a body load you experience.

I dont remember a thread where the other alkaloids were isolated, but the word on the street is by taking your extracted mescaline and eating a few grams of the whole cactus you will get the best of both worlds. I personally dont feel the same love for extracted mescaline as I do whole cactus. Maybe someone can try this who is experienced with both and let us know the outcome.

[re-aminator]

Wow. Thanks for the information. I had come to the conclusion that T. Peruvianus contained a higher amount of mescaline than T. Pachanoi. I guess I was wrong.

[Irishlion]

I dont remember a thread where the other alkaloids were isolated, but the word on the street is by taking your extracted mescaline and eating a few grams of the whole cactus you will get the best of both worlds. I personally dont feel the same love for extracted mescaline as I do whole cactus. Maybe someone can try this who is experienced with both and let us know the outcome.

I agreed completly RM. I diffently think whole fresh cactus is superior to extracted mescline.