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Questions about spawn bags, pressure cookers and Impulse sealers.

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#21 nomoreusmc



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Posted 05 March 2005 - 10:39 AM

my inverto jars did the same thing, my solution was to keep them warmer. ~ 80F the water vaporizes and no more problem.

#22 nomoreusmc



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Posted 05 March 2005 - 10:40 AM

BTW the heating pad thing, bad idea. Its a fire hazzard.

#23 SolveEtCoagula



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Posted 05 March 2005 - 12:59 PM

Thanks I am gonna try adding just alittle verm to them and heat pads won't be needed due to weather changing soon (hopefully).

My grain prep tek before now has always been to soak them for 15-24 hours, take them out, pour them on beach towels, let them sit for awhile and brush dry them with the towel. Then when I think they are ready I just loadem up into bags and pc them.

I know it is a moisture problem I just wasn't sure what was causing it.

The expansion of air in the bag several days after kind of baffled me. I was thinking that it had more to do with it by creating a dome for water to evaporate, rise up, and cling to until it finally built up enough that it 'rained' heh. The hydrologic cycle in a bag =( I have no clue how ot make the bags not expand with air after several days of incubation it just expands like a baloon very slowly.

Anyways I am starting to think its a combination of heatpad+too much moisture thanks for the verm tip I will try it.

#24 Guest_lost_onabbey_rd_*

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Posted 05 March 2005 - 02:14 PM

well how long are you PC those things... i've heard people say mycobags should go for NO LESS then 2 hours... might not be cooking them long enough... and when you say they blow up like a ballon... does it have a filter in it?
i have no real experience with myco bags so all i can give ya is hear say... but i will be doing one of rye in the next few days so hopefully it will turn out alright... good luck

#25 Guest_golly_*

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Posted 05 March 2005 - 03:00 PM

I think its normal for gas pressure to build up in myco bags as the myc or bacteria convert the carbohydrates into co2 gas, even with a filter patch the bag is supposed to expand....thats what it said when i recieved a spawn bag of rieshi a while ago.

#26 Guest_Peter Cottontail_*

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Posted 05 March 2005 - 03:09 PM

If anything, your grain is too dry sol. Welcome back by the way. . . I wondered what became of you. I soak for 24 hours, then boil for a few minutes. I'm sure the condensation is from temperature changes. Your heating pad probably has a ten degree or so differential and that's too much. First, shitcan the heating pad anyway, as they're nothing but trouble. Room temperature will work just fine, even if it takes a day or two longer. If it's too cold in the room, simply run a space heater to take the chill out of the air. Try to keep the temperature as stable as you can. Wild swings will build up moisture on the sides of your bags and ruin your project.

#27 Hippie3



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Posted 05 March 2005 - 03:18 PM

i don't think the bags are getting fully sterile,
i suspect that bloating up of the bag
is caused by gases being released during
intense bacterial growth.
i'd drain better and pc longer

#28 Hippie3



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Posted 05 March 2005 - 03:20 PM

btw i've been getting decent results by soaking a full day
draining, then soaking a few hours longer in a bleach solution
then i place rye in burlap sacks to store/drain.

#29 SolveEtCoagula



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Posted 05 March 2005 - 11:01 PM

Yea, I tend to dissapear for long periods of time. Sometimes lifes better lived not always lookin over your shoulder :P I try to make sure I never get caught up again.

Thanks a lot for the advice im going to try both ways, some with verm and some with more moisture.

The grain was always bendable with just my fingers squishy but not mushy. I figured that was plenty of moisture.

Yes, the bags have a filter patch they are the ones from mycosupply. I also pc'd them for 2 and half hours. Maybe 3 is better hell if I know looks like I got alot more trial and error ahead of me.

BTW: Kick ass new boards :P When I went to old site to check up on things I saw the post about it being closed down and thought some bunk shit went on till I read bit more hah =) Very happy to see things still up and runnin.

#30 karlfinn


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Posted 06 March 2005 - 10:46 AM

Hey Hip , I like that bleach/burlap drain tek, I'll give it a try. thanx for the R&D.
that's the way we use to malt rye and corn for moonshine..right in the bag till it sprouted. but that's another story. but I never thought of it for draining my grains..
I have big nylon-mesh bags which do the same thing..burlap is hard to find anymore around here. gotta try this..

#31 Hippie3



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Posted 06 March 2005 - 11:49 AM

..burlap is hard to find anymore

i buy my rice 20-50 pounds at a time
it comes in burlap bags mostly
so i just re-cycled the empties

#32 Hippie3



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Posted 06 March 2005 - 11:50 AM

Yes, the bags have a filter patch they are the ones from mycosupply. I also pc'd them for 2 and half hours.

assuming you sealed them ok,
that should be enough time in the pc
might consider getting a different source
for your rye,
could be a bad batch there

#33 taoistshredder


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Posted 06 March 2005 - 11:59 AM

I've been having the same kind of problems with mine; PCed a whole lot of rye (that whole 50 lb. bag I got) in a week, in 20-or-so bags, and now a week and a half later, all but 3 are green. I don't know where I fucked up, but it's obvious I did. From what I've seen, lots of people fuck these up, so I guess I'll just keep trying...

#34 Hippie3



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Posted 06 March 2005 - 12:30 PM

try the bleach soak
after the regular soak
i figure the 1st soak
hatches the endospores and breeds tons of bacteria
so why not trim that back some
before it even hits the pc ?
i drain off that nasty brown soak water,
refill with fresh and add a couple glugs of chlorox
and let it soak a few hours minimum
then drain,
pour into burlap
rinse again with fresh water
drain about an hour
and load jars.
store in fridge un-used rye in burlap
and it'll keep several days.

#35 Guest_golly_*

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Posted 06 March 2005 - 01:18 PM


#36 BuckarooBanzai


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Posted 28 December 2005 - 08:38 PM

I know these questions have been dealt with before, but there is some kind of confusing information in the archives so I’m going to play the rampant noob and ask ‘em all again!

I am interested in experimenting with spawn bags, but I’m not interested in doing a lot of them. I can have 6 of 8 cake projects fail (or succeed wildly) and not loose a lot of sleep. Bags, however, are going to take up a lot of space and produce a lot of fruit. Doing four and having one work will waste all my grow space. Doing four and having all four work out perfectly would actually be worse.

My spouse is going to be somewhat uncomfortable with four basketball sized projects fruiting at the same time. It’s fun to watch her eyes get big, but after the excitement wears off, she gets the paranoid heebie-jeebies and I hate that for her. After having flaunted so many rules and conventions for so many years, I’ve accepted the potential consequences (lets be honest, the EVENTUAL consequences – it’s all about playing the odds) of my hobbies/habits. This is why I keep a lawyer/bail fund in a safety deposit box, but that’s a whole different thread. The wife still likes to pretend that bad things don’t happen to good people. It’s harder for her to pretend that when she knows a boatload of fungi are maturing a scant few hundred yards away.

Anyway, my burning questions follow. Answer as many as you can stand without laughing…

  • Do you seal your bags before or after you PC them? Why do you do it that way? If you don’t seal until after, how do you secure the bags for PCing?
  • If I am using bags with vent patches, does that change the answer to question 1 in any way?
  • What Impulse setting (surprise…they have a knob) do you use for polypropylene spawn bags? Do you also wish the knob went to 11?
  • Do you double seal?
  • Do you use injector port bags or tape/glue to seal the inoculation hole?
  • Do you reuse your bags? If so, how many times and how do you clean them between uses?
  • When you PC bags, do you allow any extra time for the larger volume of material?
  • Have you ever fruited directly from/in a bag? If so, would you do it again?
  • This is a stupid question, I know, but do you use the same substrate moisture ratios in a bag as you use in a jar?
  • Were you hoping for another Spinal Tap reference?
  • Have you ever been killed in a bizarre gardening accident?
Thanks, in advance, for your patience and any experience you are willing to provide.

:headbang: Long live Mycotopia! :headbang:

#37 morthos



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Posted 31 December 2005 - 11:31 PM

Good day sir!

Let me begin by saying that I've no experience with standard spawn bags, but I've glorious & proven experience using oven bags for a similar purpose, from which I will answer most of your Q's.

If you aren't familiar with my past growing, I have created the OBIRE tek,l embarassingly I've yet to do a formal writeup, but all the needed info is around here in my posts. That's Oven Bag Invitro Reservior Effect. I colonize WBS in jars, then mix it with prepared verm into a prepared oven bag, and fruit within that bag. With 3L of WBS & 3L of verm, I get about 3oz dry on the first harvest, with multiple declining-scale harvests to follow.

First, I have had bad experience with sterilizing substrate inside a bag in a PC. I tried this 3 times with a 1:1 brf:verm mix, and all of them ruptured enough to cause disaster. This may not be relevant, as others in the archives have likely done this in standard spawn bags with success.

Second, no, I don't think the presence of a patch alters PC'ing. If anything I might think it allows pressure to equalize within a bag, preventing rupture or some such.

3+4+5...not applicable.

Sixth, no, I do not reuse bags. I destroy each bag during harvest.

Seventh, not really. An hour in the PC should kill anything you can fit in there. Go for 75 min if you're paranoid.

Eighth, GOD YES!! If I grow again this is my way. Soooo low-maintenance & stealthy.

Ninth, that depends what you're comparing to. I hydrate the verm to capacity, which is typically 1/4 of it's volume in water. my WBS, popcorn or BRF is hydrated in a process I won't elaborate yet but I believe within the norm for other methods, yes.

Tenth, wouldn't hurt, but I'm too drunk to care

Eleventh, no, or I couldn't write this.

If you are willing to colonize a bunch of 500ml jars & grow invitro on a grand scale, pm me & I'll give you more details. Better yet, have a look at my past posts. No lights, heating, humidity control or odd gizmos.

Happy new year!

#38 siam_jim


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Posted 01 January 2006 - 12:50 AM

I’m not any expert but I have many on hand experiences with these bags
1 no I fold the flap over and under then put a few rubber bands to hold it down
2 yes, but still fold over and do the same
3 never use expensive…staples are just fine.
4 yes but not really needed
5 yes after I inject from the top..i will make 5-10 hole in the same inject site
then tape it with medical tape
6. no
7 no…I start counting only when it reads 15psi
8 yes …it’s ok, yes I would do it again for space saving and less steps
9 yes
10 got to many pain in the a—
11 nearly when a mole rat snuck up and out on me, thought it was the 2 step
viper…..had to wash my over-alls after that one.
note: after the pc cools down over night, i take the rubber band off then unroll carefully, then 1" from the top double fold and staple it down then about 1" from the stapled fold i would inject and make extra holes then tape it.

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#39 bluecat



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Posted 01 January 2006 - 11:16 AM

i use spawn bags all the time for sawdust blocks. i seal before i pc. it takes quite a long time for bags to cool off. by having it sealed, it's clean and safe.the filter patch does not allow much air to pass thru. you want to get most of the air out of the bag before you do need to pc longer with heavy bags. mine are over 5 lbs. each. if i do 3 at a time, i pc for 2 hours.even 1 at a time, i would pc for 1.5 hours. i experimented with 3 at a time. 1 hour turned green. 1.5 hour didn't, so i go 2 hours to be safe.for sealing, it's easy. try it on the top of a bag. depends on the bags and the sealer. test the seal by squeezing the bag with air in it if it doesn't leak, ok. raise the temp till it melts thru the bag, then turn it down a bit. on mine, it seals good at 3.5. i only double seal if it looks like i didn't get it nice on first try.bags get kind of brittle after being used. not worth trying to use them again. they're cheap enough. i use sawdust spawn to innoc, but i have done lc without injection ports. inject and tape worked fine. try bags. good luck.

#40 TVCasualty


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Posted 01 January 2006 - 02:21 PM

Cheapest Impulse sealer I have found:

I got the FS300, only 50 bucks. Works great.

Don't forget to have clear packaging tape handy to patch any holes quickly and easily.

I also found stainless steel stockpots that fit nearly perfectly into my AA 941. (I had to bend the handles up to slide it in) I pack about 5 spawn bags into it, PC for 2 hours, lift out basket in front of laminar flow hood, easy! No water saturating lower bag, blowouts contained, etc.


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