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Non toxic, food safe extraction of mescaline and related alkaloids


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#1 kcmoxtractor

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Posted 19 September 2009 - 03:57 PM

This idea was started by 69ron over at the DMTnexus. For original tek see here- [link]
I am also combining the mescaline salting using carbonated water (carbonic acid, mescaline carbonate) here- [link]

Materials-

1 gal milk jug to make carbonate salts in
1 one qt Mason jar to make acetate salts in
Evaporation dish
Funnel (I used 2L bottle neck.)
Coffee filters, 3 or so
Plastic milk jug or similar HDPE or PP5 container - not polystyrene
100 grams cactus powder (can be Achuma, pedro or torch)
25 grams calcium hydroxide
900mL d-limonene
300mL water
3L Carbonated water

It uses all food safe ingredients for the extraction and salting of the alkaloids. Calcium hydroxide can be bought at most W****** stores and d-limonene is sold as orange oil, might have to call around to find some.

I started with 200g powdered trich. bridgesii cactus.

pic 1.jpg


I added 50g calcium hydroxide and 1200mL water. (The tek only calls for 600mL h20, and this was kind of a stupid mistake on my part, it SAYS that your yield is reduced when you add too much water, but I have pulled 1.7% already I think it would be easier to work with if you only add 600 though.) When you add the 600mL of water to 200g of cactus it will seem wet, but not watery. Looks like bread dough or something. Mine does not illustrate this, but here is the picture I have.


pic 2.jpg



Pull One:


Add 600mL of d-limonene to cactus mixture and let it sit for about 6 hours. Decant the d-limonene from the top of the cactus and add 50mL of standard food grade 5% vinegar.


pic 3.jpg


Decanted limonene into separate 1g milk jug. At this point I evaporated the first vinegar salting to see what would be yielded and it was this-

pic 4.jpg


After this I salted the limonene with vinegar two more times, then added the carbonated water. Picture below. When you add the carbonated water, shake it several times, but be sure to release the pressure or the lid will shoot off. First pull yielded 2.1g of waxy crystalline substance.

pic 5.jpg


pic 6.jpg



Pull Two:


Add another 600 mL of limonene to the top of the cactus. You can remove this in several hours, but I let mine sit for several days, and a very wicked third layer formed.



I added 10g more base and put it in a hot water bath at this point and the layer seemed to become more well defined, allowing me to separate the second limonene pull.


Salted second pull with vinegar twice and carbonated water, then evaporated to yield 1.3 g waxy crystalline substance.



So far I have yielded 3.4g of acetate and carbonate salts, or 1.7% and that is just from the first two pulls.

My third pull is in the carbonate salting step right now, As soon as it is finished I will update this thread.



If you have any questions, Feel Free to ask!


Edited by Sidestreet, 10 September 2016 - 03:59 PM.
Fixed Pictures

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#2 wildburr

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Posted 19 September 2009 - 04:15 PM

Nice :eusa_clap, Gonna pull up a chair for this one.

#3 bbd2

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Posted 19 September 2009 - 05:35 PM

tst tsk tsk bad bad bad :naughty:

that achuma was used in a manner inconsistent with its labeling :naughty:

:lol:

nice work

love the pic of the acetate
random folks always claim its a goo
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#4 kcmoxtractor

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Posted 19 September 2009 - 08:15 PM

Well it kind of is a goo but when you scrape it up the first time it dries out more... it is like waxy crystals, that first picture looked like the second when I first scraped it up, but it easily rolls into little balls.

#5 theMallacht

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Posted 19 September 2009 - 10:03 PM

How does one know how much to take of this? Is there a way of compensating for the waxy substance that's in it and figuring about how many mg one is taking? Or perhaps one of you could share personal experience on this...?

#6 kcmoxtractor

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Posted 19 September 2009 - 10:10 PM

You start with your dosage in cacti. I started with 200g of cacti, two really good doses. I think I am just going to eat half of it at once and my girl is going to eat the other half.

This is not really a large scale extraction, more for a personal amount of product or for you and a couple of friends. They have their dosages on the original page. Apparently if you're not hardheaded about 300mg is a pretty psychedelic dose. A lot of people on there say that even 80mg is mildly active and long lasting.

#7 Fly on the Wall

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Posted 20 September 2009 - 11:11 AM

How does one know how much to take of this? Is there a way of compensating for the waxy substance that's in it and figuring about how many mg one is taking? Or perhaps one of you could share personal experience on this...?

The tek's creator recommends no more than 0.2g for a first-time experience. Supposedly that's enough to be reasonably psychedelic without 'jumping into the deep end', always a good strategy with a new drug that one may be unusually sensitive to.

Also, if one really wanted pure Mesc HCL instead of the waxy acetate, adding just enough 10% HCL to dissolve the acetate will turn it into Mesc HCL which can then be washed with acetone and IPA. A lot of interesting info is available here: http://wiki.dmt-nexu...line_Extraction

Much respect to kcmo for making the thread. This tek being food-safe makes it accessible to more people and could even save a life of someone who could have had an accident with solvents or strong bases.

#8 whatchamacallit

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Posted 20 September 2009 - 11:55 AM

SWIM will have to acquire some fumaric acid, d-limonene, some cactus powder and give the tek a try. He is not sure how only 300mgs is such a wild ride, perhaps it's the achuma cactus's extra alkaloids. Maybe they are pulled out as well, since the lower pH (when made basic, 10 or 11, instead of 14) in the extraction and alkaloids solubility in the d-limonene.

SWIM doubts everyone at the nexus are lightweights, so he'll have to see if the pure mesc HCl from both extractions (regular solvent and lye, or d-limonene and sodium carbonate), and then compare the extracts from the achuma cactus, and see the differences. With his pure mescaline HCl, a gram to a gram and a half of the crystals, gives him a powerful experience, however 500mgs is decent ride, just not super powerful.

Has anyone over at the nexus said their mesc HCl from this tek, is stronger than their mesc HCl from the teks with xylene and lye? Or is the hypothesis that it's the added alkaloids from the bridgesii (Achuma) that are pulled with the d-limonene and sodium carbonate?

#9 kcmoxtractor

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Posted 20 September 2009 - 01:37 PM

Mescaline Fumarate apparently isn't that active. They claim that the HCl isn't as active by weight as the acetate, even though they have a very similar molecular weight. 69ron talked about fumarate in one of the cactus threads, said that the come up took forever and the peak wasn't that strong. They also say that the acetate comes on fairly quickly compared to the HCl also. I would hypothesize that it has something to do with the water solubility and bio-availability. Might be why it seems stronger. The other alkaloids are apparently pulled out with the limonene and vinegar, they say in the original thread that the acuma extract feels very different than a torch extract. They say that the torch extract is also more white, where the acuma extracts all have that orangish tint.

When I took 600mg of the HCl salt I found it to be kind of disappointing, considering that is the heavy dosage range. I'm not very sensitive to MDMA either though, takes me about 250-300mg of chunky crystal to get a good roll, and I weigh only 160 lbs.

Be sure and get calcium hydroxide whatcha, and not sodium carbonate. Definitely only add 300mL of water per 100g cactus. The cactus being a doughy consistency means no extra water for the freebase to be dissolved in, so it increases the efficiency of the solvent.

When you work with limonene you will never want to work with anything again :lol: my house actually smells GOOD when I'm extracting! Not that solvent smell! Where I live in a city, I don't have to worry about neighbors smelling solvents and thinking something is going on either. Just smells like I have an orange grove in my kitchen! :)
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#10 whatchamacallit

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Posted 20 September 2009 - 02:17 PM

Oops, yeah SWIM was thinking of sodium carbonate in the DMT extraction. So are the only sources for the fumaric acid and the d-limonene the internet? Can't find those just anywhere, correct?

#11 kcmoxtractor

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Posted 20 September 2009 - 02:30 PM

I wouldn't go with fumaric acid, go with vinegar and carbonated water (weak carbonic acid solution) that way it keeps with the food grade aspect. :) After you do your vinegar salting 3x decant the limonene and evaporate the vinegar to get your acetate. Then pour carbonated water over your limonene, shake, release pressure, repeat x3. I would say that this makes it more efficient also since carbonic acid has a lower pKa than acetic acid you will react with a different group of alkaloids. Let it sit over night then decant the limonene from the carbonated water. My carbonate alkaloids were much lighter in color than my acetate alkaloids...
You can find d-limonene locally in larger areas, it is sold as orange oil. It is a degreaser usually. I paid $40 for a gallon, but it can be distilled and reused.

Since we don't have a sponsor that sells it, I got it from www.greenterpene.com.

#12 kcmoxtractor

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Posted 21 September 2009 - 04:59 PM

Third Pull yielded another 2 grams of waxiness.

That brings the total to 5.4g or 2.7%. I have to get some more vinegar and carbonated water then do another salting, I'm gonna pull until I see diminishing yield, 69ron said he got close to 7% from bridgesii.

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#13 Landogarner

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Posted 23 September 2009 - 04:19 PM

Very nice! Definitely giving this a try. Thanks for posting this! :rasta:
:heartbeat

#14 -Hg-

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Posted 23 September 2009 - 05:39 PM

Can anybody tell me if there would be a difference in yield if one were to use either pachanoi or peruviana. Thanks

#15 bbd2

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Posted 23 September 2009 - 06:01 PM

Can anybody tell me if there would be a difference in yield if one were to use either pachanoi or peruviana. Thanks


maybe
maybe not

its a plant, so individuals vary
a particular mutant from either species might be strongest

extraction tek skill is a better predictor of yield than species when dealing with trichs

focus on getting everything from whichever species you are working on

#16 kcmoxtractor

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Posted 23 September 2009 - 06:39 PM

You would probably have less alkaloids in the other cacti. Bridgesii are known to have a high alkaloid content.

#17 kcmoxtractor

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Posted 23 September 2009 - 07:55 PM

Fourth pull .6g acetate alone, carbonate has not fully evaporated yet. With this acetate weight added it is 6.1g, 3.05%.

#18 weeeeeee

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Posted 23 September 2009 - 08:32 PM

nice thread kc

#19 Fly on the Wall

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Posted 23 September 2009 - 09:14 PM

Hey KC, how do you evap your vinegar? Have you noticed whether heat-assisted evaporation does anything to potency?

#20 kcmoxtractor

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Posted 23 September 2009 - 09:28 PM

I just evaporate with a fan blowing on the surface. I have no idea whether heat would effect potency or what heat the degradation would begin. You could look over at the nexus, the original thread is about 35 pages long and filled with tons of information.




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