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#41 Phineas_Carmichael

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Posted 28 February 2010 - 10:52 PM

I am reading The Spirit Molecule right now and got thinking about 'beings' that manifest themselves in trips.

The Spirit Molecule rocks my world every time I pick it up. Hooray for a scientific approach to the psychedelic experience!:headbang:

I wanted to see how many have had experience with beings (I know of quite a few from reading spice reports already) on ANY substance. I am even more interested in ones seen on mushrooms.
I also wondered what level of interaction people have had with them and whether the encounter had a purpose or obvious meaning?
I have not had one yet (never had DMT), but I would kind of like an encounter of my own.
Any takers? I thought it deserves its own thread.

Isn't it great how the Philosophy of Human Experience can hijack a thread? :eusa_clap for posing a question that ended up probing this deep into the Human Psyche!

I have seen the "alien hieroglyphs"
It scrolled across my vision..... I have no idea what it meant...

I also see "alien hieroglyphs" but my inner eye interprets them as advanced mathematical equations, the "Universal Language" as it were. I swear that if I had a PhD in Pure Mathematics I could "read" my visual hallucinations!

As far as entities go, I have only ever caught fleeting glimpses of "them", and only on DMT. Their purpose to me so far has been to say, "Hey! Look at this!" or "We're always here, waiting for you to return." Other psychedelics make me feel more connected with nature, people, and this physical universe, while DMT throws my consciousness into a completely different universe which is equally as real, whether it is chemically inspired or parallel to this one along a directional axis I don't understand! Just because it might be random electricity in the brain doesn't make it any less real; after all [as Irishlion hinted at] all perception, sober or otherwise, is merely brain electricity when you boil it down!

This guy highly recommends the 1884 book or 2007 film "Flatland" as a delicious analogy to the psychedelic experience. We are 3-dimensional creatures rocketed suddenly into a 4-dimensional perception IMHO.
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#42 Calaquendi

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Posted 01 March 2010 - 12:41 AM

almost nervous to post here lol


:lol: - mirabile dictu, don't you agree?

Edited by Calaquendi, 01 March 2010 - 12:46 AM.


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Posted 01 March 2010 - 01:15 AM

The Spirit Molecule rocks my world every time I pick it up. Hooray for a scientific approach to the psychedelic experience!:headbang:
Isn't it great how the Philosophy of Human Experience can hijack a thread? :eusa_clap for posing a question that ended up probing this deep into the Human Psyche!
I also see "alien hieroglyphs" but my inner eye interprets them as advanced mathematical equations, the "Universal Language" as it were. I swear that if I had a PhD in Pure Mathematics I could "read" my visual hallucinations!
As far as entities go, I have only ever caught fleeting glimpses of "them", and only on DMT.
Their purpose to me so far has been to say, "Hey! Look at this!" or "We're always here, waiting for you to return." Other psychedelics make me feel more connected with nature, people, and this physical universe, while DMT throws my consciousness into a completely different universe which is equally as real, whether it is chemically inspired or parallel to this one along a directional axis I don't understand! Just because it might be random electricity in the brain doesn't make it any less real; after all [as Irishlion hinted at] all perception, sober or otherwise, is merely brain electricity when you boil it down!
This guy highly recommends the 1884 book or 2007 film "Flatland" as a delicious analogy to the psychedelic experience. We are 3-dimensional creatures rocketed suddenly into a 4-dimensional perception IMHO.

dude i am watching something about advanced equations, check it out--cool documentary and i thought this (most advanced equation on earth) beautiful equation looked like DMT glyphs.

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Posted 01 March 2010 - 01:16 AM

forgot the link...sorry
THE ILLUSION OF REALITY
http://video.google....810&hl=en&emb=1

#45 koldj

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Posted 01 March 2010 - 04:23 PM

I have seen the "alien hieroglyphs"

It scrolled across my vision..... I have no idea what it meant...

Now that you said the word glyphs it reminded me that I saw them too.

Some 5 years ago when I was tripping hard on a large dose of Semilanceata. They just appeared on the wall like a huge slowly spinning mandala and I knew that it meant something.

Tool has a great song about forgotten details on a trip ;D

Alrighty, then... picture this if you will.

10 to 2 AM, X, Yogi DMT, and a box of Krispy Kremes,
in my "need to know" pose, just outside of Area 51
Contemplating the whole "chosen people" thingy
when a flaming stealth banana split the sky
like one would hope but never really expect
to see in a place like this.
Cutting right angle donuts on a dime
and stopping right at my Birkenstocks,
and me yelping...

Holy fucking shit!

Then the X-Files being,
Looking like some kind of blue-green Jackie Chan
with Isabella Rossellini lips, and breath that reeked of
vanilla Chig Champa
Did a slow-mo Matrix descent
Outta the butt end of the banana vessel
And hovered above my bug-eyes, my gaping jaw,
and my sweaty L. Ron Hubbard upper lip,
and all I could think was:
"I hope Uncle Martin here doesn't notice
that I pissed my fuckin' pants."

So light in his way,
Like an apparition, [that]
He had me crying out,
"Fuck me
It's gotta be
the Deadhead Chemistry
The blotter got [right] on top of me
Got me seein' E-motherfuckin'-T!"

And after calming me down
with some orange slices
and some fetal spooning,
E.T. revealed to me his singular purpose.
He said, "You are the Chosen One,
the One who will deliver the message.
A message of hope for those who choose to hear it
and a warning for those who do not."
Me. The Chosen One?
They chose me!!!
And I didn't even graduate from fuckin' high school.

You'd better...
You'd better...
You'd better...
You'd better listen.

Then he looked right through me
With somniferous almond eyes
Don't even know what that means
Must remember to write it down
This is so real
Like the time Dave floated away
See, my heart is pounding
'Cause this shit never happens to me

I can't breathe right now!

It was so real,
Like I woke up in Wonderland.
All sorta terrifying
I don't wanna be all alone
While I tell this story.
And can anyone tell me why
Y'all sound like Peanuts parents?
Will I ever be coming down?
This is so real
Finally, it's my lucky day
See, my heart is racing
'Cause this shit never happens to me

I can't breathe right now!

You believe me, don't you?
Please believe what I've just said!
See the Dead ain't touring
And this wasn't all in my head.
See, they took me by the hand
And invited me right in.
Then they showed me something
I don't even know where to begin.

Strapped down [to] my bed
Feet cold [and] eyes red
I'm out of my head
Am I alive? Am I dead?
Can't remember what they said
God damn, shit the bed.

Hey ...

Overwhelmed as one would be, placed in my position.
Such a heavy burden now to be the One
Born to bear and bring to all the details of our ending,
To write it down for all the world to see.

But I forgot my pen
Shit the bed again ...
Typical.

Strapped down [to] my bed
Feet cold and eyes red
I'm out of my head
Am I alive? Am I dead?
Sunkist and Sudafed *
Gyroscopes and infrared
Won't help, I'm brain dead
Can't remember what they said
God damn, shit the bed

I can't remember what they said to me
Can't remember what they said to make me out to be the hero
Can't remember what they said
Bob help me!
Can't remember what they said

[We] don't know, [and we] won't know (x12)

God damn, shit the bed!



#46 DivineMomentsofTruth

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Posted 01 March 2010 - 06:20 PM

great song, i was JUST listening to this!

#47 Aqua and Red

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Posted 01 March 2010 - 07:05 PM

Reading this thread and trying to look at everyone's opinions in an open minded way...I've come up with this: Who really knows what is "real"?

I mean..no one here has taken their view point to the extreme on either end, but if you continue down a certain path for very long you "usually" end up on the far end of it.

I enjoyed IrishLions posts a lot because I feel like he understands that when it comes down to it, none of us really know everything...

But back to what I was saying about taking extremes (and it's important to understand that I'm not trying to put words in your mouth or say that anyone is going to the extreme in either way)... Let's just look at both forms of thinking and where they eventually might lead.

Since about the renaissance the western mind has generally taken a rational perspective on everything. Breaking things down into parts and understanding how each part relates to another. Experimenting with variables and confirming those conclusions over and over again until one can say with certainty that that's "how something is". But look at where that has lead! Take quantum physics for example. What is quantum physics? The study of the nature of matter. (which for me is the nature of reality). What had quantum physics found by breaking things down into smaller and smaller pieces? That that view of breaking every thing down into irreducible parts explodes in our face. It has shown us that those "superstitious" or mythogical forms of thought are correct according to science. The observer effects the observed. Things like...matter is mostly empty space.

This view of the world has shown us that even though we do exist physically, atoms are mostly empty space. And the particles that make us up pop in and out or existence...travelling back and forth through time.

If you get into the many worlds interpretation that completely opens up the possibility for other realms of existence or alternate realities that contain these spirits/entities.

Okay, enough about that version. Science has helped us advance as a species and given us a mutual understanding of reality. It works and that's why we use it. Just don't rely completely on it.

Looking at the other side of the coin doesn't need as much discussion IMO and yet it does.

Mythogical or "superstitious" forms of thinking open up possibilities for us. But at the same time, too many choices will just make us go crazy. Intuition is a valid realm of experience but it cannot be explained by science. And as far as I know neither can consciousness (yet). Science has looked and looked and we can't find an "observer" we can't find the wellspring consciousness flows from. But if we look at shamanistic thought they do have a "science of consciousness.". I don't know, this post is horribly imbalanced. By what I'm trying to say is don't put too much stock in either theory and keep an open mind.

And I realize there are probably multiple paradoxes held within my statements. But what is reality but a paradox?

It is all, yet it is nothing.

Thanks for letting me get my ideas out guys. That's what I love about Mycotopia.

Much love and respect to all of you.

Edited by Aqua and Red, 01 March 2010 - 09:55 PM.
Spelling and grammar errors.


#48 bbd2

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Posted 01 March 2010 - 07:24 PM

this would be a good time to mention set and setting

absolutely speaking, set and setting determine our state of mind, altered or not

whether or not you ever experience dmt, is determined by whether youve even heard of it, what you know about it, how to get it, how to smoke it right, or eat it right
and that just brings you to the door

the things that you are about, your reading, desires, fears etc.
these are what provide the language for the mind to represent what being on a certain drug means

its like they say "when the student is ready the teacher will come"

the getting ready is set and setting

reading strassman, mckenna, erowid etc. colors your trips in certain way
its like they taught their mental symbols to a whole bunch of people

if you read a lot of science fiction, your visons may have a very sciency feel
vs. a mythical fantasy feel; time and consciousness travel vs. love and cosmic unity
and for some others ppl its all bodybreath consciousness, deep euphoria and visual beauty

when your mind has the "energy to create"
it animates these symbols like a waking dream,
mixing and matching depending on your current state
for example, i breakthrough best in the evening, after eating, in a very warm room
with those conditions, i know that at some point it will come up whether i can possibly ever come down

point is you can chose where your trip goes/what you trip about
by studying the subject you want to trip about

and it is this learned nature of spirits and gnomes, fractals and glyphs
that makes me believe that whatever reality they have
its not like the reality my cat has

(havent seen anything i can call writing, ill be looking for some tho,
the sense of information must be f-ing overwhelming... "ALIEN WRITING" wowzer :headbang:)

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Posted 01 March 2010 - 08:46 PM

and it is this learned nature of spirits and gnomes, fractals and glyphs
that makes me believe that whatever reality they have
its not like the reality my cat has
(havent seen anything i can call writing, ill be looking for some tho,
the sense of information must be f-ing overwhelming... "ALIEN WRITING" wowzer :headbang:)



some believe dmt hyperspace is an actual realm that 'exists' on another plane of existance we have no access to besides through dmt or sometimes megadoses of psilocybin. fractals and shrooms are like bread and butter, just as glyphs and true dmt breakthroughs to the goddess are universal.

some people trip at synchronized times to hopefully meet eachother at a pre-determined point in hyperspace, usually its several hundred folks all synched up blasting off the same time, round the earth, then they compare trip reports soon as they come-to. this is how universal glyphs are with dmt.

i thought i had 'broken through' several times before actually going at the D pipe with all i had trying as hard as i could to take as many hits as i could with a full tenth of a gram on the weed, smokin up as much as possible in as short a time as possible before i dropped the pipe (which ive only done once, btw) this is when i truly broke through....you'll know. you WILL see glyphs, and you WILL relate to all the stories and understand why folks are so hyped up on hyperspace... then again, you are correct that we dont and cant know what others are thinking or even seeing in their trips. fact is, we dont know how others view the world or what hallucinations they have. so do not take my post as a blow at you, its not my intent.


Speaking of cats, science has recently discovered a way to record dreams, thoughts, etc. i saw a documentary the other night where they showed the view of the world through the eyes of a cat that was hooked up to some new technology. despite all the fuzz and pixels (they call this 'noise') you can see that the cat sees human faces as cat-like. its fucking bizzare shit man. they freeze framed it and it showed the person the cat was looking at to have a cat face......whiskers, ears, etc. very distorted, almost what people look like when on dmt sometimes when you come off a strong trip.
on that note, from some of the trip reports i have read, and some ayahuasca inspired art i have viewed and discussed with the artists, there seems to be a fairly common vision of people as hairy "horselike" or otherwise animal like, much like this pic shows--

Ara0500_Whelan.jpg

i personally feel all humans see the world more or less the same way, some being more tuned in then others, but what about other species???

Edited by Irishlion, 01 March 2010 - 09:50 PM.
Uploaded and attached pic for optimal post viewing.


#50 Aqua and Red

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Posted 01 March 2010 - 10:10 PM

Speaking of cats, science has recently discovered a way to record dreams, thoughts, etc. i saw a documentary the other night where they showed the view of the world through the eyes of a cat that was hooked up to some new technology. despite all the fuzz and pixels (they call this 'noise') you can see that the cat sees human faces as cat-like. its fucking bizzare shit man. they freeze framed it and it showed the person the cat was looking at to have a cat face......whiskers, ears, etc. very distorted, almost what people look like when on dmt sometimes when you come off a strong trip.


Is this true? Seriously? I'm not calling you a liar, I'm just awestruck. That's crazy! Does that mean my giant plated lizard sees me as some kind of reptilian? Do you have any sites that talk about this or an info at all on it? Pm me if you do. Thanks.

If I'm jacking your thread OP just let me know. I'll stop.

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Posted 01 March 2010 - 10:15 PM

Is this true? Seriously? I'm not calling you a liar, I'm just awestruck. That's crazy! Does that mean my giant plated lizard sees me as some kind of reptilian? Do you have any sites that talk about this or an info at all on it? Pm me if you do. Thanks.
If I'm jacking your thread OP just let me know. I'll stop.

it was a BBC documentary i watched so many this week i dont know which it is; might be the one i linked earlier in this thread, but, yes, im totally serious. the host stops the footage and says "i cant help but notice this mans face appears very cat like" :lol: thing is, our technology isnt high enough yet to know for sure because of all the noise in the footage they can view..the noise can either be simple distortion, like, from turning a brain function into video, or, could be naturally the way cats see, or could just be other brain activity causing the distortion in the footage. they aren't sure. this may not be that recent a docu but i think it is pretty recent. ill look for it when i have more time.

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Posted 01 March 2010 - 10:22 PM

here's the stills of the footage...where they freeze framed in the documentary it was much clearer and larger than this set of pics is, but gives you the info you asked for.
http://news.bbc.co.u...ture/471786.stm
hope this helps

PS: this is 11 years old, i bet if you do some digging you could find more recent experiments and their results.

#53 riseabovethought

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Posted 02 March 2010 - 12:44 AM

I appreciate your faith in science Freq. But "Beuler... Beuler..." - OK, I wont say its boring but all Im saying is its not as exciting when you describe it with radio- isotopes coding receptors and neurotransmitters communicating through bio-electrical synapses into mental impulses...

Its just a bit boring to break down a rainbow into its individual photons, quarks, and electrons making up the particular frequencies, but if you dig it, 2 each his own brother! I love science too and your ideas are tempting I'll admit, but they make a better back- up date to the prom than your first choice, you know?

Im considering your ideas and beginning to get more interested. Am I old school then? Me and the shamen are old news you think? Sweet! Ok, I can take the criticism. You're teaching me something bro, maybe I'll learn by considering your ideas.

Thanks IL. Excellent advice.

Its really often just describing and labeling things as opposed to actually understanding the deeper nature of things. That's not best done in the laboratory, its best done directly with nature, sitting under a tree or on a large boulder under the sun.

They wont come up with a cure for cancer any sooner than they'll cure greediness or gluttony. Dont fool yourself that science will save us from everything. If science were the final word (and perhaps it should be), Tesla would have saved us ages ago.

Tesla's greatest inventions will probably be kept secret our whole lifetime for sure while those that did get out were some of the greatest works of genius ever gifted us... and we'll never even know the level of scientific greatness he actually achieved because greed still trumps science and his best stuff is probably hidden away from our common eyes forever, sadly, save a few select eyes.

Thanks Cap for the link- That F#$%ing rocks! Emptiness isnt empty afterall.

If we only use ten percent of our brain, some even less, if the void is really now full of energy, anti-matter is now a major player, dark energy makes up most of the universe, matter is mostly empty space, if we're mostly energy, and energy can never be created or destroyed, but only changes in form, then we are invariably and quite scientifically eternal patterns of energy outside the realm of 'common sense science.'

But I can respect when a man gets interested in his work and chooses to identify and dissect parts of mechanisms in a scientific method of deduction possibly propelling psychedelics forward on par with medical marijuana so we understand it more comprehensively and thoroughly, and can more safely enjoy the effects, etc.

I get your enthusiasm brother and I meant no harm or disrespect. I see you dig it and I applaud you for following your heart like so many never do. It may just be something I'll investigate more in the future. You really got me interested.

And IrishLion, thanks bro for the best damn cactus tea in my life... my world has never been the same!! I see mescalito has endowed you with great wisdom.

I like your UMPH Freq! Point taken bro. But I'll stay in the clouds outside the box as long as I can. Formulas with boundaries and limits never did much for me and will never explain thoughts IMHO, let alone psychedelic thoughts... but challenges like that are generally met with great vigor and proven otherwise so part of me hopes you're right, and the mystery keeps spiraling ever onward into the unknown.

Edited by riseabovethought, 02 March 2010 - 12:56 AM.

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#54 koldj

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Posted 02 March 2010 - 04:37 PM

some people trip at synchronized times to hopefully meet eachother at a pre-determined point in hyperspace, usually its several hundred folks all synched up blasting off the same time, round the earth, then they compare trip reports soon as they come-to. this is how universal glyphs are with dmt.

Any links to their reports?

#55 5-hydroxytryptamine

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Posted 02 March 2010 - 06:06 PM

great thread. I side with science. ie, if I see my grandma in a trip I know its not really her. but...

Having seen (in my mind's eye) many a strange creature/glyph fractal pattern, I scientifically ponder what is it that shapes these images and codes?

what if the entities (glyphs, fractals) are 'real' in the sense that they are informational holograms stored in our DNA. If Psychs are organic computer programs that unlock brain filters of perception, then perhaps the fractals and entities and glyphs are realtime information streams encoded within our physical hardware. that faces and morphologies appear within the information stream is obvious because reality is a fractal (self repeating pattern).

perhaps the information stream is malleable and our minds are able to conjure from it brief manifestations of artificial intelligence that will interact with us for a short time...

is that real? or is it a hologram?.. with a cheshire cat face repeated a trillion times telling you secrets of the universe in a soothing alien language..

who knows.

super interesting.
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#56 Calaquendi

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Posted 02 March 2010 - 10:30 PM

what if the entities (glyphs, fractals) are 'real' in the sense that they are informational holograms stored in our DNA.



Ahhh...

I think about this too. This is neeto :

[Direct Link]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1H7szhBgyVA

#57 claykrys

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Posted 02 March 2010 - 11:33 PM

We should pick a date and time and do our own synchronized study. I just think it would be interesting to see what, if any, common thread we would find in our trips. We could come up with a plan as far as meditation and focus leading up to blast off and just discuss our experience in the following days. I dont know how productive it would be but it would be very interesting to hear about everyone else experience and compare them to your own.

#58 raveneye

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Posted 03 March 2010 - 12:37 AM

We should pick a date and time and do our own synchronized study.

This has to and will happen sometime.
Has anyone read "Wizard of the Upper Amazon".
There are some very intriguing accounts in that book of group Aya trips where they all are viewing the same thing simultaneously.
We can all plug into our mind machines with proper agreed upon audio vibes and meet in/on another vibratory level. As long as we all agree on where to meet and how to travel we can slowly build a critical mass for this new place.

#59 shroom_seeker

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Posted 03 March 2010 - 01:19 AM

Raveneye i've read Wizard of the Upper Amazon and enjoyed it very much (ending is a shocker but i won't give away). I've heard that iboga ceremonies among the African people are also known to produce group visions. The Eleusinian Mysteries come to mind, too. I like the idea of a remote group trip, lots of room for remembering there. Another good read on the group experience is Land Without Evil by Matt Pallamary.

Great thread btw, love this subject. If anyone is in the mood for a decent audio clip on the topic of entities check out podcast #s 69 and 70 at the Psychedelic Salon: http://www.matrixmasters.com/podcasts/
:hippie:

Edited by shroom_seeker, 03 March 2010 - 01:30 AM.


#60 mullugh

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Posted 03 March 2010 - 04:16 PM

I appreciate your faith in science Freq. But "Beuler... Beuler..." - OK, I wont say its boring but all Im saying is its not as exciting when you describe it with radio- isotopes coding receptors and neurotransmitters communicating through bio-electrical synapses into mental impulses...

Its just a bit boring to break down a rainbow into its individual photons, quarks, and electrons making up the particular frequencies, but if you dig it, 2 each his own brother! I love science too and your ideas are tempting I'll admit, but they make a better back- up date to the prom than your first choice, you know?

Im considering your ideas and beginning to get more interested. Am I old school then? Me and the shamen are old news you think? Sweet! Ok, I can take the criticism. You're teaching me something bro, maybe I'll learn by considering your ideas.

Thanks IL. Excellent advice.

Its really often just describing and labeling things as opposed to actually understanding the deeper nature of things. That's not best done in the laboratory, its best done directly with nature, sitting under a tree or on a large boulder under the sun.

They wont come up with a cure for cancer any sooner than they'll cure greediness or gluttony. Dont fool yourself that science will save us from everything. If science were the final word (and perhaps it should be), Tesla would have saved us ages ago.

Tesla's greatest inventions will probably be kept secret our whole lifetime for sure while those that did get out were some of the greatest works of genius ever gifted us... and we'll never even know the level of scientific greatness he actually achieved because greed still trumps science and his best stuff is probably hidden away from our common eyes forever, sadly, save a few select eyes.

Thanks Cap for the link- That F#$%ing rocks! Emptiness isnt empty afterall.

If we only use ten percent of our brain, some even less, if the void is really now full of energy, anti-matter is now a major player, dark energy makes up most of the universe, matter is mostly empty space, if we're mostly energy, and energy can never be created or destroyed, but only changes in form, then we are invariably and quite scientifically eternal patterns of energy outside the realm of 'common sense science.'

But I can respect when a man gets interested in his work and chooses to identify and dissect parts of mechanisms in a scientific method of deduction possibly propelling psychedelics forward on par with medical marijuana so we understand it more comprehensively and thoroughly, and can more safely enjoy the effects, etc.

I get your enthusiasm brother and I meant no harm or disrespect. I see you dig it and I applaud you for following your heart like so many never do. It may just be something I'll investigate more in the future. You really got me interested.

And IrishLion, thanks bro for the best damn cactus tea in my life... my world has never been the same!! I see mescalito has endowed you with great wisdom.

I like your UMPH Freq! Point taken bro. But I'll stay in the clouds outside the box as long as I can. Formulas with boundaries and limits never did much for me and will never explain thoughts IMHO, let alone psychedelic thoughts... but challenges like that are generally met with great vigor and proven otherwise so part of me hopes you're right, and the mystery keeps spiraling ever onward into the unknown.


My sentiments exactly!
:eusa_clap




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