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Messing around with Pedro


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#1 Phineas_Carmichael

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Posted 15 July 2010 - 03:11 PM

My buddy Freddy is at it again.

http://mycotopia.net...=1&d=1279224058
100g dry San Pedro was combined with 25g of "Pickling Lime" (Calcium Hydroxide) and enough water to make a dough out of the material.

http://mycotopia.net...=1&d=1279224058
Previously dried xylene was added until it just covered the dough and allowed to sit for 1 hour with occasional mixing.

The xylene was recovered from the first pull and salted with ~75ml of dilute HCL,
http://mycotopia.net...=1&d=1279224058
Which evaporated to yield 186mg of yellow/tannish mescaline HCL.
http://mycotopia.net...=1&d=1279224058

Apologies for the quality of the photos. Freddy says he has more but has to sort through a bunch of stuff to find them.

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#2 Morgoth

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Posted 15 July 2010 - 03:25 PM

Great stuff phineas :eusa_clap

Never Tried a STB on any cacti

Currently reducing some iso alcohol that was soaking with 100g of pedro,100g of torch and about 4 inches of chopped up fresh bridgesii.

Plan to A/B the tar that results out of the IPA. Will share results.

I'v read your thread on A/B vs. STB for DMT. And I currently have some naphtha in the freezer from an A/B your results inspired. Which type of extraction do you feel is superior for mescaline?

#3 koldj

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Posted 15 July 2010 - 03:39 PM

Wow, that sounds easy but the yield seems to be low. Would a couple more pulls yield more material?

#4 Phineas_Carmichael

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Posted 15 July 2010 - 03:44 PM

Great stuff phineas :eusa_clap

Never Tried a STB on any cacti

Currently reducing some iso alcohol that was soaking with 100g of pedro,100g of torch and about 4 inches of chopped up fresh bridgesii.

Plan to A/B the tar that results out of the IPA. Will share results.

Thanks Morgoth, please do.

I'v read your thread on A/B vs. STB for DMT. And I currently have some naphtha in the freezer from an A/B your results inspired. Which type of extraction do you feel is superior for mescaline?

I'm glad there's another A/B convert out there. :D

As far as best mescaline extractions I have no idea, these pictures are the result of Freddy combing the vaults here for a week or so and looking at different teks. I'll paraphrase his theories...

This is technically an A/B extraction, just run in reverse. Maybe it should be called a B/A? :lol: For ultimate purity, it is possible that cactus could be treated like MHRB and made into acidic tea, deffatted with NP, then basified and extracted with NP again. That NP extract would have to be salted with an acid, as mescaline freebase is a caustic oil. It is equally possible however, that doing this would damage or pull out other cactus alkaloids in the defat and they would not end up in the final product. Just a thought...

The other tek for extraction in the vaults here is basically exactly the same as a DMT STB extraction in which the cactus is submerged in NaOH solution and pulled with xylene which is then salted with an acid. This tek appears inferior as horrendous emulsions seem to be a common result. The tek pictured in the OP does not have that problem as there is not enough water involved to form an emulsion.


Here is the tag search Freddy used to do his research.

#5 Phineas_Carmichael

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Posted 15 July 2010 - 03:47 PM

Wow, that sounds easy but the yield seems to be low. Would a couple more pulls yield more material?

Oh yeah, totally. That's just the result from the first pull, separated out, dried, and salted so Freddy could get the hang of the process. Optimistically, 186mg is only 1/3 of the total expected yield.

#6 McDozd

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Posted 15 July 2010 - 04:00 PM

Great work as usual Phin. I have been wanting to try that tek myself, I here there is much less stomach issues with the salted mesc.
Mc
:eusa_clap

#7 Morgoth

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Posted 15 July 2010 - 04:33 PM

This is technically an A/B extraction, just run in reverse. Maybe it should be called a B/A? :lol: For ultimate purity, it is possible that cactus could be treated like MHRB and made into acidic tea, deffatted with NP, then basified and extracted with NP again. That NP extract would have to be salted with an acid, as mescaline freebase is a caustic oil. It is equally possible however, that doing this would damage or pull out other cactus alkaloids in the defat and they would not end up in the final product. Just a thought...

The other tek for extraction in the vaults here is basically exactly the same as a DMT STB extraction in which the cactus is submerged in NaOH solution and pulled with xylene which is then salted with an acid. This tek appears inferior as horrendous emulsions seem to be a common result. The tek pictured in the OP does not have that problem as there is not enough water involved to form an emulsion.

Here is the tag search Freddy used to do his research.



An A/B extract for mescaline starting with acidic tea sounds like a good idea if one is shooting for purity. As far as loosing some alks in the defat...im not sure how effective this would be but....

After extracting the alkaloids from MHRB with acidic water I put the solution in the fridge and lots of plant matter and fats crash to the bottom. This accomplishes what I like to think of as a "physical" defat, opposed to trying to get rid of fats and plant materials chemically using xylene or naphtha. Defatting "physically" seems to me like a more yield friendly procedure. Possibly this could be done with an acidic cactus solution aswell?

186mg did seem like a surprisingly low yield when I first read this, figured It was only the first pull based on the caliber of freddy's usual work:thumbup:

Just finishing up the A/B ran on MHRB the naphtha in the fridge is already super super cloudy and swirly after only an hour (thanks again phineas!) very excited for this one.

#8 McDozd

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Posted 15 July 2010 - 05:34 PM

Oh yeah, totally. That's just the result from the first pull, separated out, dried, and salted so Freddy could get the hang of the process. Optimistically, 186mg is only 1/3 of the total expected yield.

Yea I thought the yield on HCL from pedro should be around 1% give or take a tenth. Never tried I just heard that was the norm. What is the dosage on those salts?
:weedpoke:

#9 Phineas_Carmichael

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Posted 15 July 2010 - 05:45 PM

Yea I thought the yield on HCL from pedro should be around 1% give or take a tenth. Never tried I just heard that was the norm. What is the dosage on those salts?
:weedpoke:

Yep, Freddy's shooting for at least a 1% yield based on his vault-combing.

Dosage seems to be in this range for HCl.

50-75mg - Not psychedelic, but conversation is enhanced and flowing
100mg - Threshold for some
200mg - Decently psychedelic for most <Highest 1st time dosage recommendation>
300-500mg - Strong
500mg+ - The very idea frightens me! :shy:


The only calculations I've seen for dosage conversion were between mescaline HCl and mescaline acetate, as the acetate salt is heavier so the dosages are reduced.

#10 pharmer

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Posted 15 July 2010 - 08:16 PM

Dangit, I'd really like to see these dosage recommendations tied to body weight.

The same 500 mg dose would fry my 110 pound wife but leave my 205 pounds a little disappointed. Most people fall in the middle ground between the two weights.

Ya know what I mean?

#11 kocos

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Posted 16 July 2010 - 05:37 AM

Awesome stuff man! Thanks for sharing. I really need to give this a whirl soon!

#12 McDozd

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Posted 16 July 2010 - 09:02 AM

Yep, Freddy's shooting for at least a 1% yield based on his vault-combing.
Dosage seems to be in this range for HCl.

50-75mg - Not psychedelic, but conversation is enhanced and flowing
100mg - Threshold for some
200mg - Decently psychedelic for most <Highest 1st time dosage recommendation>
300-500mg - Strong
500mg+ - The very idea frightens me! :shy:

The only calculations I've seen for dosage conversion were between mescaline HCl and mescaline acetate, as the acetate salt is heavier so the dosages are reduced.

Thanks Phin. I am planning on an A/B soon using HCL as well. Just wanted to see what I was getting into money wise. ;)
Mc

#13 Phineas_Carmichael

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Posted 16 July 2010 - 12:07 PM

Collection from the 2nd & 3rd pulls yielded 409mg, bringing the total yield to 595mg.

Freddy suspects there is more to be wazzled out of the xylene. He promises to keep us updated and get better pictures if he does this again.

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#14 kcmoxtractor

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Posted 16 July 2010 - 12:23 PM

Just a heads up, I don't find that dosage listed above to be very accurate. I need well over a gram (1.3g+) to have much of an experience. 700mg I find to be very similar to 70-100mg of mdma, but more long lasting.
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#15 surf.shaman

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Posted 16 July 2010 - 01:45 PM

1.3g of pure mescaline-hcl?
or of mixed alkaloids?

#16 Ferretious

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Posted 17 July 2010 - 02:40 AM

I also need over a gram of salted extract to get my proverbial rocks off.
Salted extract for us "Ametures" is very hard to get 100% pure.
The absolute pure, like Sasha Shulgins synthetic mesc would definately require the smaller dose:headbang:!

#17 Phineas_Carmichael

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Posted 03 September 2010 - 05:19 PM

I've been sitting on these pics from Freddy for a while, and now I'm killing time so I'll post them. They are the results from a 400g san pedro extraction carried out in the same manner as above. The yield was around 0.8% for a total weight of 3.2g

Here's the crude product:
DSCN1370 [Desktop Resolution].JPG .JPG]

Placed in a ramekin:
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A minimum of freezer cold anhydrous acetone was added, just enough to cover. The mixture was pestled under acetone for about 2 minutes before being filtered with vacuum and scraped off the filter paper:
DSCN1379 [Desktop Resolution].JPG .JPG]

After drying completely it weighed to ~3g and the acetone was a nasty brown color.
Posted Image

Freddy gave me a bit to sample, and I found 250mg with a hit of great acid to be just wonderful. A stray dog sort of changed how I see the world.

500mg by itself :weedpoke: was very subtle, but more active than I expected; clouds moved in unexpected ways, play-doh held my attention for far too long, and I slept the sleep of the dead with vivid dreams that night.

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#18 Morgoth

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Posted 04 September 2010 - 01:01 AM

Freddy gave me a bit to sample, and I found 250mg with a hit of great acid to be just wonderful. A stray dog sort of changed how I see the world.

500mg by itself :weedpoke: was very subtle, but more active than I expected; clouds moved in unexpected ways, play-doh held my attention for far too long, and I slept the sleep of the dead with vivid dreams that night.


Aint Lucy and mescalito quite the combo Phin? The visions are top notch.

500 sounds like a good ride too. I like the looks of the cleaned product... Freddy makes me wanna go get me some cactus incense.
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#19 Shadowlord

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Posted 04 September 2010 - 01:55 AM

I agree about the combo completely.
Only thing better than Mescaline is some LSD and Mescaline.
I often like to take a little LSD with extracted Mescaline as it usually takes 3 hrs for the M to come on.
The LSD comes on first and is fun and is manageable by the time the mesc comes on. You get a while where they are both merged and then you get to end the night w/ the rest of the mescaline experience.
Makes for a long but enjoyable day/night.
:cacti:

#20 Phineas_Carmichael

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Posted 04 September 2010 - 09:27 AM

I agree about the combo completely.
Only thing better than Mescaline is some LSD and Mescaline.
I often like to take a little LSD with extracted Mescaline as it usually takes 3 hrs for the M to come on.
The LSD comes on first and is fun and is manageable by the time the mesc comes on. You get a while where they are both merged and then you get to end the night w/ the rest of the mescaline experience.
Makes for a long but enjoyable day/night.
:cacti:

You said it! :eusa_clap The combination is very synergistic.

Took the acid while sipping on coffee spiked with mesc. By the time the coffee was gone I was well on the way to LSD-land. Spent the rest of the evening an an acid haze until it was time to go home. Halfway through the 15 minute drive (through the rural midwest, didn't see another car the whole time) I had a somewhat frightening realization: "The Acid is long gone, but the Mescaline is still going strong." :lol:

Made for a great drive home and several hours of alternately deep and silly conversations. Great stuff, these cactus alkaloids... :thumbup:




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