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The asshole bush wants to replace ashcroft with


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#1 Guest_rodger_*

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Posted 27 January 2005 - 07:29 AM

The whole gay thing was just another way the republicans were pushing the buttons of the christian groups. Kerry didn't say jack shit about gay marriage unless pressed. It's a stupid non issue when we're at war. The republicans were just using it to drive a wedge between those who think of the issues and those who go to church and do as the preacher tells them to. It won this election, but it's going to lose them the war. I suspect dubya will be the last republican for a very long time. Can anyone name one single accomplishment the guy has made?

#2 Lefty

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Posted 27 January 2005 - 02:37 PM

Alienated the U.S. in the eyes of many, many other countries & massively increased national debt. Did you mean positive accomplishments? In that case, no.

#3 shamrox

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Posted 27 January 2005 - 03:15 PM

Even my dad, who is a stereotypical old white republican, admitted to me that dubya is a horrible president.

#4 Guest_hippie3_*

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Posted 28 January 2005 - 07:30 AM

and yet,
he won re-election.
i'm reminded that
actions speak louder than words.

#5 Guest_rodger_*

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Posted 28 January 2005 - 12:46 PM

<blockquote><hr size=0><!-quote-!><font size=1>quote:</font>

he won re-election.
i'm reminded that
actions speak louder than words.
<!-/quote-!><hr size=0></blockquote>
As did Hitler and Richard Nixon. Your point?

#6 Lefty

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Posted 28 January 2005 - 09:32 PM

Alot of things happen that really shouldn't.

#7 Lefty

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Posted 28 January 2005 - 09:44 PM

After WW II plans were found that showed if Hitler had listened to Rommel they would have won. Rommel wanted more troops at Normandy & a different configuration, but also, had his advice been heeded, would have succeeded in world domination. Scary shit, but the Desert Fox was a brilliant strategist.
In light of this, it was a problem alot larger than any one race or group & facetious as hell to not recognize that. Practically removed an entire generation of Russian men of a certain age group, among many others affected.

#8 nerve

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Posted 29 January 2005 - 01:37 AM

I don't know how accurate that hypothesis is Lefty.

What if the first nuclear bomb had been implemented against germany instead of Japan?

Just pointing out that following Rommel wouldn't have necissarily meant nazi world domination.

#9 Lefty

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Posted 29 January 2005 - 03:12 AM

Plans & what actually happens often differ. Don't want to get into speculative history or Hip will wear me out, and it's heading... Posted Image

#10 Lefty

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Posted 29 January 2005 - 03:15 AM

And just maybe in the wrong thread now that I look at it. Sorry.Posted Image

#11 Guest_hippie3_*

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Posted 29 January 2005 - 11:46 AM

<blockquote><hr size=0><!-quote-!><font size=1>quote:</font>

After WW II plans were found that showed if Hitler had listened to Rommel they would have won. Rommel wanted more troops at Normandy & a different configuration, but also, had his advice been heeded, would have succeeded in world domination<!-/quote-!><hr size=0></blockquote>
nonsense,
winning the battle of normandy
would not have saved germany,
the soviet army was already banging at the gates by the time the western allies got off their boats.

#12 Guest_hippie3_*

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Posted 29 January 2005 - 11:56 AM

<blockquote><hr size=0><!-quote-!><font size=1>quote:</font>

he won re-election.
i'm reminded that
actions speak louder than words.




As did Hitler and Richard Nixon. Your point?
<!-/quote-!><hr size=0></blockquote>

the point is obvious-
gw bush is president.
if it makes you feel better
to call that 'wrong'
then great, hope it helps.
but feeling better is all you'll get-
the fact will remain.
the sole purpose of a political party
is to win offices & weild political power.
a moral posture that leaves the voters
may be morally pleasing to the diehards
but spells death for the party.
until the Dems stop waiting
for america to come to
where they are
and instead move towards the values of the people who vote
then we'll juat keep getting
more men like bush.
i firmly belive that
the dems beat themselves in this last election,
they managed to snatch defeat
from the jaws of victory
because of their attitude.
that attitude irks alot of people, myself included, that smug superior know-it-all-far-better-than-you-ever-will attitude
that presumes superiority over others
but cannot deliver the goods.
this election
was far more a repudiation of the democratic candidate & platform
than it was any mandate for bush.
no one really wanted bush
but he was still judged to be
a better choice than what the dems offered.
put whatever spin on that you want
but the real failure
was not the voters or even gw bush-
the failure came from the dems.
they blew it big.



#13 Lefty

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Posted 29 January 2005 - 01:08 PM

<blockquote><hr size=0><!-quote-!><font size=1>quote:</font>

After WW II plans were found that showed if Hitler had listened to Rommel they would have won. Rommel wanted more troops at Normandy & a different configuration, but also, had his advice been heeded, would have succeeded in world domination




nonsense,
winning the battle of normandy
would not have saved germany,
the soviet army was already banging at the gates by the time the western allies got off their boats.
<!-/quote-!><hr size=0></blockquote>
You are correct there but Rommel offered unheeded advice long before Normandy. Would a master strategist spread out troops beyond supply lines? Even that late in the game he could have caused atleast a slightly different outcome, possibly even negotiations as opposed to complete surrender.
The Soviets would have learned to live an aquatic life had the U.S. not jumped in when we did. At some points they were using horses against tanks, and one must question the act of signing a non-aggression pact with Hitler. If he wasn't such a piece of shit that would be funny.

#14 yupster

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Posted 29 January 2005 - 05:31 PM

<blockquote><hr size=0><!-quote-!><font size=1>quote:</font>

Kerry was definitely not a proponate of Gay Marriage, but he said that he wanted it to be left up to States. <!-/quote-!><hr size=0></blockquote>

#1 Wednesday, Nov. 10, 2004 12:11 p.m. EST

Clinton: Gay Marriage Cost Kerry Election

Ex-president Bill Clinton singled out the issue of gay marriage last night as the leading cause of John Kerry's defeat in last Tuesday's election.

In a quote omitted from wire service coverage of Clinton's speech to Utica, N.Y.'s Hamilton College, the ex-president said: "Gay marriage was an overwhelming factor in the defeat of John Kerry."

In comments covered only by the Utica newspaper, the Observer Dispatch, Clinton blamed the Massachusetts Supreme Court for spotlighting the issue, telling the Hamilton audience:

"With one decision of one Supreme Court, all of a sudden we have a constitutional amendment designed, I think, to whip people up, to inflame them, make them stop thinking about other issues."

In the closing days of the presidential campaign, Clinton reportedly urged Kerry to voice support for at least a few of the 11 state proposals reaffirming the traditional marriage laws. But Kerry, who claimed to oppose gay marriage, rejected the idea out of hand.

The ex-president said the issue contributed to "an astonishing turnout among evangelical Christians who were voting on the basis of moral values."

But he insisted, "I do not believe either party has a monopoly on morality or truth."

Clinton said Democrats needed to reach out to conservative Christians and do better in explaining how they share the same values.

#1 The above from: http://newsmax.com/a...0/121553.s html


#2

Kerry refused to take Clinton's antigay advice

A new report from inside the John Kerry campaign suggests that in the final weeks of the campagin former president Bill Clinton advised Kerry to come out in favor of ballot measures that wrote antigay marriage discimination into the constitutions of 11 states. According to the latest issue of Newsweek, "Looking for a way to pick up swing voters in the red states, former president Bill Clinton, in a phone call with Kerry, urged the senator to back local bans on gay marriage. Kerry respectfully listened, then told his aides, 'I'm not going to ever do that.'"...

#2
The above from http://www.democrati...ress=102x959585

(Message edited by yupster on January 29, 2005)

#15 Guest_hippie3_*

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Posted 30 January 2005 - 07:27 AM

<blockquote><hr size=0><!-quote-!><font size=1>quote:</font>

The Soviets would have learned to live an aquatic life had the U.S. not jumped in when we did<!-/quote-!><hr size=0></blockquote>

eh ?
if we had not entered
the soviets would still have beaten germany,
they were already well on their way.
the horses of 1941 were lonbg gone by 1944,
by then the soviets had more tanks, planes
and artillery pieces, as well as soldiers
than any other country on earth
either then or even until now.
they had already stopped the german advance
and were steadily pushing the germans back,
some 80% of all german forces were deployed against the soviets,
leaving us to fight the leftovers.
rommel was a smart general, true,
but nevertheless
he was soundly beaten in africa long before normandy ever happened.

#16 Lefty

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Posted 31 January 2005 - 11:40 AM

<blockquote><hr size=0><!-quote-!><font size=1>quote:</font>

if we had not entered
the soviets would still have beaten germany
<!-/quote-!><hr size=0></blockquote>
Had we not entered the war, German troops certainly would have been concentrated elsewhere. Rommel did lose in Africa, but to the U.S., not Russia.

#17 life

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Posted 31 January 2005 - 02:31 PM

amazing how many arguments can be made on speculation of "woulda coulda shoulda"

i have no real stance on this issue one way or the other i see truth in what both sides are saying but i just wanted to point out none of us have ANY idea (NONE of us) what COULD have happend if things went differently. Chaos rules supreme in the world of "woulda coulda shoulda".

#18 Guest_hippie3_*

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Posted 01 February 2005 - 08:27 AM

<blockquote><hr size=0><!-quote-!><font size=1>quote:</font>

Had we not entered the war, German troops certainly would have been concentrated elsewhere.<!-/quote-!><hr size=0></blockquote>

apparently you suffer from a misunderstanding-
the vast majority of germany's armed forces were always deployed against russia [post 1941]
we never faced more than a small fraction of hitler's army,
the little they could spare from the russian front.
the tide of war was already turned against germany before any americans ever got off the normandy beach.
and rommel lost in africa
to the british,
not the americans.
the few american troops that did see action in africa
[operation torch- the invasion of tunisia]
got their asses soundly whipped by rommel.

(Message edited by admin on February 02, 2005)

#19 Lefty

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Posted 01 February 2005 - 11:15 AM

Doh. Been distracted lately.

#20 Lefty

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Posted 01 February 2005 - 02:58 PM

Ah hah, I wondered about the Morocco thing. (Secret squirrel is a great show, up there with Hong Kong Phooey) Rommel may have lost to the Brits due to the distraction of having to soundly stomp the U.S. but I will concede on that point.
Your a rather informed fellow Hippie. This is great, actual intelligent discussion with no derogatory comments or distractions. You did have to knock some of the rough edges off my style there awhile ago, thank you. You & all the mods run a great site, and again Happy Birthday to Mycotopia!!!!!!!!!!!




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