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THE Science Thread


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#121 Alder Logs

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Posted 08 May 2015 - 05:45 PM


 

The Einstein Myths— Of Space, Time, and Aether
by Eugene F. Mallove, Sc.D.

Originally Published July-August, 2001 In Infinite Energy Magazine, Issue #38

 

 

"I consider it quite possible that physics cannot be based on the field concept, i.e. on continuous structures. In that case, nothing remains of my entire castle in the air, gravitation theory included, and of the rest of modern physics."

~A. Einstein


Edited by Alder Logs, 08 May 2015 - 06:01 PM.


#122 Alder Logs

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Posted 09 May 2015 - 03:28 PM

 

 

More bits from the above linked paper by Dr. Mallove (I wish I had seen his stuff fifteen years ago and looked him up before he was murdered):

 

 

Even the famous E=mc2 formulation, supposedly one of Einstein's most original concepts, has alternative derivations, some of which were in an advanced state by the time SRT burst forth onto the scene. And, SRT's famous mass increase with velocity can be viewed quite differently. The infamous "twin paradox" can be abolished. Not only that, there is no reason why advanced space ships could not far exceed light velocity (see Dr. Cynthia Kolb Whitney's papers and conclusions, referenced and summarized on p. 65-66). She notes, ". . .long-distance space travel is seen to be not impossible in principle. We are now limited not by the speed of light, but rather by the speed of thought, which the present author submits is actually infinite when thought is liberated from dogma."

 

...and:

 

 

To speak of the aether these days only brings smiles of contempt from institutional physicists— they have already found something better: the intangible 'swarming of virtual particles'." So, will the aether return with a vengeance and an Aether Energy Age soon begin? We shall see.

Finally, what shall we take as the most important thing to be learned from the almost century-long Einstein hiatus in physical theory? As with cold fusion and LENR, which is for all practical purposes the return of alchemy— proved this time in scientific studies— is that even the most sacrosanct of ideas, Einsteinian Relativity, can be dead wrong. In fact, the late Richard Feynman may have said it best when he identified what he considered to be the most important implication of Relativity, though in the context in which he voiced this, he certainly did not mean that he thought Relativity itself was wrong!:

What then, are the philosophic influences of the theory of relativity? If we limit ourselves to influences in the sense of what kind of new ideas and suggestions are made to the physicist by the principle of relativity, we could describe some of them as follows. The first discovery is, essentially that even those ideas which have been held for a very long time and which have been very accurately verified might be wrong. . .we now have a much more humble point of view of our physical laws— everything can be wrong!26

As regards physics of the late twentieth century and early twenty-first, Feynman (a.k.a. "Genius," so-called by author James Gleick) was profoundly wrong about the "humble" part. But indeed, almost everything was wrong, and we must begin anew to correct it, with arduous experiment and new theory.

 

I hope I can connect with some of the folks who have surmised much of what I have, even as an uneducated person in these realms.  I think they would find value in my viewpoints and even some suggestions, as my critique goes to well before Einstein, but to Newton, whose shoulders he and so many others have been standing on.


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#123 Alder Logs

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Posted 10 May 2015 - 12:01 PM

One problem with the Science Thread getting put in the Twilight Zone is that it gets buried under the terrible music pick to click.


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#124 Skywatcher

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Posted 10 May 2015 - 11:23 PM

One problem with the Science Thread getting put in the Twilight Zone is that it gets buried under the terrible music pick to click.

Perhaps, but the Twilight Zone thread is a favorite haunt, for those of us who are open to possibility's not previously considered, Perhaps we should have a "Thinking Outside the Box" thread?


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#125 Alder Logs

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Posted 11 May 2015 - 06:37 AM

Thanks for that, Skye. 

 

Reading Mallove has been quite a shock for me.  I have felt so isolated in a world saturated with so much academic dogma.  To my shock, ideas that have become elevated because folks were dazzled by the brilliance of some really impressive, though probably errant, surmises, have actually been questioned by others, and others with credentials!

 

People have built anomalous machines and not even understood why they did what they did, because there was no science available to explain it.  Try to patent an over unity device and you'll likely have your patent denied because it violates a law of thermodynamics.  The no-æther universe of modern materialist science is a make-work program for mathematicians and physicists.

 

I hope I haven't been the only one to be reading this stuff, and the 12 part interview of Dr. Mallove, two months before his murder, that I posted at https://mycotopia.ne...-3#entry1227123  was some important stuff, if one has the ears to hear. 

 

I know that if one is invested in all the great Sci-Fi adventures to black holes (thank you, Neil deGrasse Tyson), all generated by the math built upon the Universal Law of Gravitation, learning it could all be wrong has to be a disappointment.  Isn't there anyone with an adventurous spirit wanting to build a cosmology, cosmogony, and physics that could set us free to really explore creation, released from the bonds of relativity? 


Edited by Alder Logs, 11 May 2015 - 06:41 AM.

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#126 Skywatcher

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Posted 21 May 2015 - 10:18 PM

I may have to point you at some excellent science fiction Alder, works that focus more on alternate states of perception, the human nature, and not so much on the "science". Ursala LeGuin comes to mind for starters.

 

I felt obsessively compelled to write a small reply here, with more to come later, mostly so I did not have to see "Vampire" thread linger any longer as the front thread. (No offence to you Niemand, just really not my cup of tea)


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#127 Alder Logs

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Posted 21 May 2015 - 10:26 PM

While I avoid SciFi like the plague, I did once read, The Word For World Is Forest.  As a life long tree hugger, that was right up my alley.  Still, I read less now than ever, since I learned at 20 years old.  I just started, Worlds in Collision for the sixth time.  The first time I saw that book in someone's hands, I told them I never read science fiction.  He said, "this ain't science fiction."  When I read it, I believed him.  Dr. Velikovsky really got the shaft for his original thinking and splendid scholarship.


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#128 niemandgeist

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Posted 26 May 2015 - 12:56 PM

Ah, well, I haven't seen it done yet so here I go:

 

[Direct Link]

 

ICP (Insane Clown Posse) - Miracles

 

Apparently we don't know how magnets work.

 

Magnets.. how the fuck do they work?

 

Caterpillars turning into butterflies?

 

(/Comedy Relief)


Edited by niemandgeist, 26 May 2015 - 12:57 PM.


#129 Alder Logs

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Posted 30 May 2015 - 10:46 AM

 

Apparently we don't know how magnets work.

 

Magnets.. how the fuck do they work?

 

So true.

 

The physical forces (or force -- mathematics has no number but One for Unity) are only known by their manifestations.

 

Would a device which could read these forces inside the atom be called a nanometer?  I doubt this would be small enough. 

 

Action at distance will continue to baffle minds.  Something holds things together while simultaneously holding them apart. 

 

Far fucking out!


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#130 Heirloom Spores

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Posted 30 May 2015 - 11:09 AM

"no number but 1 for unity"  awesome  , gave me understanding.

 thank you all who posted here.

 I got an understanding that I am trying to put into words.

 I got a high from all this. you know .... nutter

please go on as if I were not here , I am unable to contribute at this time.

 



#131 Alder Logs

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Posted 30 May 2015 - 03:06 PM

Trying to understand finite creation using an equation with a factor or product of infinity is pissin' into the wind.  I have a hard time seeing why so many scientists and mathematicians seem to miss this.  Black Holes and Big Bangs are what we get from extrapolation of mathematics, but these are only held as belief.  The belief is so strong that an idea like the Big Bang can make sense in the believer.  As Terence McKenna said, speaking of the Big Bang, "Science says, allow us just this one miracle, and we'll fill in the rest." 

 

I go on and on about the Universal Law of Gravitation's flawed basis.  It is the math which radiates out of that equation which has given us theoretical black holes, dark energy, dark matter, the strong and weak nuclear forces, as well as the miracle of the Big Bang.  The Law has been believed to such a level as the believers are seeing what they believe in every direction, at every scale, while they keep wondering what will unify the physical forces.  Not seeing gravity as electric force, but an assumed mass force, prevents seeing it operate in the microcosm.  Seeing electric force operate in the microcosm, where so little mass is present, won't transfer to the macrocosm while this equation is Law: F G m1 m2 / d squared. 

 

 

F (force of gravity) equals G (a numeric factor created as a means to factor distance versus mass) times m1 (one physical object) times m2 (a second physical object) divided by the square of the distance between the centers of the two masses. 

 

The empirical research which rendered this equation was Newton's observations of cannonball trajectories.   In this research, m1 was the planet Earth, and m2 was a cannonball.  The two widely unquestioned assumptions that glare in my vision are:

 

What is massively characteristic of cannonballs (or anything with any mass) is massively characteristic of planet Earth (and all gravitors), and what is dynamically true of planet Earth (and all gravitors) are the actual dynamics of a cannonball (or anything with any mass). 

 

And so: By weighing an object, we gauge its mass.  When we see a gravitating body, such as a star or planet, we use what we observe and that Law to calculate its mass.  We measure Earth's force of gravity, and we calculate its mass using the same Law.  We don't know the actuality of Earth's mass, while we assume the force of gravity in any small mass, which of course isn't enough to bother with in most of our calculations.  The gravity of any cannonball is assumed, not measured, while the electric charge of Earth isn't measurable, but it's assumed not anything of any consequence that we should for any reason consider.  

 

The reach of this Law's assumptions is to the most distant galaxy and back down to the tiniest so-called particle.  If the math is faulty, the picture of the believed in conditions at the ends of this scale will get crazier, the farther one ventures.  Is this not what we see in our wonderfully complete sciences?  Only a few details left to fill in.  Or, just where we've been since Newton wrote the Law.  The big trouble is, we see farther in each direction, up and down the scale, and see a Big Bang and one end, and a God Particle at the other. 

 

Mysteriouser and mysteriouser.

 

 

================================

 

I heard this said on the radio one night a while back:

 

"Science should investigate the unexplained, not explain the uninvestigated."


Edited by Alder Logs, 30 May 2015 - 03:39 PM.

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#132 Alder Logs

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Posted 30 May 2015 - 03:50 PM

Okay, this is just for fun:  

 

 

GRAVITATION, n.

 

The tendency of all bodies to approach one another with a strength proportional to the quantity of matter they contain -- the quantity of matter they contain being ascertained by the strength of their tendency to approach one another. This is a lovely and edifying illustration of how science, having made A the proof of B, makes B the proof of A.

 

 

NEWTONIAN, adj.

 

a philosophy of the universe invented by Newton, who discovered that an apple will fall to the ground, but was unable to say why. His successors and disciples have advanced so far as to be able to say when.

 

from The Devil's Dictionary, c 1911, by Ambrose Bierce

 

 

 

When science reached Newton, science came up against that extraordinary Englishman...As an Englishman he postulated a rectilinear universe because the English always used the word "square" to denote honesty, truthfulness: in short, rectitude. Newton knew that the universe consisted of heavenly bodies that were in motion and that none of them moved in straight lines, nor ever could. Mere fact will never stop an Englishman. Newton invented a straight line, and that was the "law of gravitation," and when he had invented this, he had created a universe which is wonderful in itself, a complete British universe, and established it as a religion which was devoutly believed for 300 years.

~George Bernard Shaw, 1930


Edited by Alder Logs, 30 May 2015 - 09:35 PM.

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#133 TVCasualty

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Posted 31 May 2015 - 11:49 AM

Crazy thought of the day: What if the physical laws by which our known Universe operates are evolving and changing in parallel to the evolution of our consciousness? 

 

 

It's an untestable hypothesis, but one with fascinating implications (and not necessarily impossible; is reality "all in our head," or ain't it?).



#134 happy4nic8r

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Posted 31 May 2015 - 12:55 PM

So as we think, so is our consciousness altered, and as our consciousness is altered, so our thinking changes......

 

food for thought, and fun is where the fair is at;;;;;;;;.



#135 TVCasualty

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Posted 31 May 2015 - 02:01 PM

So as we think, so is our consciousness altered, and as our consciousness is altered, so our thinking changes......

 

I'm going so far as to suggest that as our consciousness evolves, so does the "actual" Universe. That is, perhaps the Higgs Boson did not exist until some of us "found" it inside of our imaginations? And when we finally built a machine to look for it, we found it... just as we'd imagined. 

 

But the Universe has an imperceptible set of external boundary conditions that limit our co-evolution to incremental steps (if we were able to perceive the limit of what we believe is possible, we would then be able to imagine exceeding it thereby instantly eliminating all boundaries. That would make the Universe really bizarre instead of just inscrutably-weird). Here, "external" means "currently beyond our ability to imagine." 

 

So... the current physical laws and limits of the known Universe may well be synonymous with the current boundary of our semi-collective imagination. A single person with sufficiently-empowered Intent might be all that's needed to imagine a novel conception of reality vividly enough to make it "real." After that it's just a matter of telling everyone else about it so as to inoculate their imaginations.

 

Once the necessary "critical mass" of individuals imagining the same thing is achieved then the imagined reality becomes real for everyone, more or less (sort of like the 'Hundredth Monkey' hypothesis applied to physics). I also imagine that there's a lot of dynamic tension involved between competing/opposing daydreams since there are a lot of imaginations running around on just this planet alone.

 

Einstein is a good example; at first, Relativity was just a concept he literally just imagined, and many of his contemporaries with less-developed imaginations thought it was preposterous. Now it's as accepted and mundane as Newton's Laws were a couple hundred years ago. So did Relativity exist before Einstein? Are you sure?

 

This crazy take on Cosmology is going to be rife with contradictions and paradoxes, but those are just artifacts of language and reveal the limits of speech rather than the limits of... anything else. I can't argue with Mooji when he says (as quoted by Alder Logs) "Argue for your limitations, and sure enough, they're yours." (See? I'm paying attention!)

 

The troubling part of this idea is that is does not preclude the possibility of devolution, i.e. an imaginal Dark Age that shrinks the Universe and contracts the boundaries of the possible by forcefully-suppressing people's imaginations, much like how the "Dark Ages" of Medieval Europe came about (and which seems to be the primary M.O. of how organized religions in general enforce and maintain their cultural hegemony).


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#136 Alder Logs

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Posted 31 May 2015 - 04:02 PM

Geez, Teev, fucking pay attention.  I was not quoting Mooji there, it was Richard Bach's short novel, Illusions: the Adventures of a Reluctant Messiah, specifically, the book within that book called, The Messiah's Handbook. (Great book, BTW.) 

 

Could it be that Newton and Einstein were only correct when everyone thought they were, and only will become incorrect when we get tired of this model that has us trapped in ignorance about the dynamics of gravity and the other physical forces?

 

I don't think this is the case.  I think they have been wrong all along.  But, even with incorrect bases, we have impressed the shit our of ourselves with the stupid human tricks we could do even while in error about how shit works.  Newton was spot on in that we could, if given enough impetus, put a cannonball in orbit around a planet.  This never proved that the cannonball was generating gravity in proportion to its mass.  Its gravity was calculated to be infinitesimally weak and not to be bothered with for that reason. 

 

Cavendish, and others, set up experiments that seemed to show some force in chunks of matter, but I challenge their laboratory conditions, as these experiments were carried out at a full G of Earth's field.  Like magnetism, any magnetizable material in an extraneous magnetic field becomes more magnetic.  Would it be a surprise to learn that matter exhibits an induced force when within an extraneous gravity field? 

 

The idea that static mass has gravity as a dynamic drove us to things like space-time as just one workaround necessitated by standing on Newton's shoulders. 

 

This is why I quoted myself as my signature line with this:

 

 

The no-æther universe of modern materialist science is a make-work program for mathematicians and physicists.

 

When we finally see that gravity is electrostatic force, and not mass force, as was calculated by observed cannonball actions in Earth's field, we can begin again, not knowing the mass of Earth, and forget our calculations of celestial mechanics based on other bodies calculated masses.   When all the make-work workarounds that say things like nothing can move faster than light in a vacuum fall, our ignorance will no longer keep homowildassguesser stuck in any particular galaxy.  

 

While some doubt has fallen on the "Hundredth Monkey" effect, better work around Sheldrake's  "morphogenic fields" is out there.   I don't think there is any Hundredth Scientist effect in operation.  Max Planck is credited with this: "Truth never triumphs—its opponents just die out—science advances one funeral at a time."


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#137 TVCasualty

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Posted 01 June 2015 - 10:34 AM

Geez, Teev, fucking pay attention.  I was not quoting Mooji there, it was Richard Bach's short novel, Illusions: the Adventures of a Reluctant Messiah, specifically, the book within that book called, The Messiah's Handbook. (Great book, BTW.)

 

Well damn, guess that's a sign that I'm getting spread too thin lately. When I think I'm paying attention but am apparently not then it's time for a change in my time-management and priorities. Frankly, it's a bit past time for a change in those areas but I guess I wasn't paying close enough attention (getting the attribution of a quote wrong isn't a big deal by itself, but it is symptomatic of an issue that is). 

 

I'll return when I get my shit back together. Hopefully it'll be a matter of weeks, not months.


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#138 Alder Logs

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Posted 01 June 2015 - 11:07 AM

Is it those warehouses full of shit?  I, as a hopeless hoarder, would be fucked.  I would probably go all Scrooge McDuck like it was gold coins. 

 

Take an hour for yourself and read Illusions.  You will like it, I know.  It's a fun read that's not a waste of time on any level. 

 

 

gallery_131808_1351_29927.jpg


Edited by Alder Logs, 01 June 2015 - 11:12 AM.


#139 Alder Logs

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Posted 01 June 2015 - 01:01 PM

Teever, though I'm certain it is not the case, I just want to say that my kidding around is just that, and not being misunderstood.  Your presence here is a particular bright spot for me. I really value your posts. 

 

==========================

 

While I am in a transition from a personally identified being, to just being, there remains a history with a body of thought and reason, still connected to the whole of me in some way.  While I still have an interest in ideas of physics, at least as far as a self-educated, and to a good degree uneducated in the scientific line, goes, the personal investment in being right or wrong has waned.  I still think it would be cool beans for folks to have flying saucers to zip around in. I know I haven't the width of vision to know if the time is right for such a thing.  

 

I am reminded of Billy Pilgrim and Elliot Rosewater, a couple Vonnegut characters who would haunt porno shops to read the science fiction of Kilgore Trout, which was only being printed in the girlie mags as filler between the nudie pics.  And just so, this new physics is here in The Twilight Zone of Mycotopia.net for a psychedelicized sliver of the world's minds to find. 

 

I have no more investment in the ultimate correctness or success of my hypothesis, but the thinker in me likes the play.  If Plank was correct, it will be an awful lot of funerals before we can advance to a truly space-faring people, especially since to be an official scientist, one must invest in Newton and his down-line, pick up and carry that old cannonball through the years in university. 


Edited by Alder Logs, 01 June 2015 - 01:19 PM.

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#140 Alder Logs

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Posted 08 November 2016 - 05:09 PM

and yet more bumping






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