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The drugs don't work: a modern medical scandal


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#1 Tusk Bilasimo

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Posted 25 September 2012 - 02:01 PM

This is so alarming it will give bald people a hair raising experience. :reb:


The doctors prescribing the drugs don't know they don't do what they're meant to. Nor do their patients. The manufacturers know full well, but they're not telling.

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Drugs are tested by the people who manufacture them, in poorly designed trials, on hopelessly small numbers of weird, unrepresentative patients, and analysed using techniques that are flawed by design, in such a way that they exaggerate the benefits of treatments. Unsurprisingly, these trials tend to produce results that favour the manufacturer. When trials throw up results that companies don't like, they are perfectly entitled to hide them from doctors and patients, so we only ever see a distorted picture of any drug's true effects

http://www.guardian....al-ben-goldacre
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#2 riseabovethought

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Posted 25 September 2012 - 02:49 PM

So sad. You mean theres no place left to put my blind trust these days??

#3 LilBear

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Posted 25 September 2012 - 02:55 PM

were'nt boomer prescribed as anti-depressants back before they were banned?

why is it that mother nature always does it best,

yet we constantly attempt to find better ways?

must be curiosity haha

#4 darkeyesabove

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Posted 25 September 2012 - 03:41 PM

You know its funny because what you said about companies burying negative results isn't actually true. Many times they simply take the outcome data from their trials, rearrange and reorganize it, and find a way to represent it that is either to difficult to understand to really be effective, or makes it appear to be a lot less dangerous than it really is. And of course the bureaucracy that they call the FDA will put a stamp on any medication produced by big pharma as long as it can be proven to not cause instantaneous death more than 50% of the time. I kid but considering the drugs that have been approved by them in the past the standard must be unbelievably low.

were'nt boomer prescribed as anti-depressants back before they were banned?


Yes they were used to treat depression, PTSD, anxiety disorders and even addiction in studies performed before they were outlawed in the 70's. Psilocybin, THC, DMT and their parent plants all have very well known medicinal usages that go back to the neolithic age, however our friends in the FDA and big pharma think they know better what chemicals we should put in our bodies, and if you happen to take something that makes your hair fall out, your skin turn purple, renders you sterile and causes 12 kinds of cancer, well then they'll recall it and you might be able to get someone to pay your medical bills after you sue them, if you live that long.

Yay capitalist privately insured america!!! :thumbup:

#5 dead_diver

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Posted 25 September 2012 - 04:37 PM

An old hippie once told me that all the medicines anyone needs are supplied by nature. I believe he was right but they haven't all been discovered yet.
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#6 eatyualive

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Posted 25 September 2012 - 05:27 PM

i read something similar recently. i wouldn't be surprised. these days, big pharma push products and every commercial shows a guy and a family smiling because hes happy and then in small fine print you see the multiple side effects that seem to outnumber the true reason the drug was created. to cure, or was it for profit?


hm.... lets all sit back and think about that one for a minute.



i love the antidepressant commercials. they say something like this" this is antidepressant to take if your on antidepressants and you are feeling depressed or suicidal".

so what your fucking telling me is your addicted to anti depression medication because some asshole pill pusher doctor said you had something wrong with yourself. so now that that did not work, you need anti-anti depressant drugs?

come the fuck on. big pharma is an industry and most if not everything is corrupted by profit? who can you trust these days?''

shit really pisses me off, my wife gets horrible pms, she asks if she should take antidepressants. Im like your out of your fucking mind. ill tolerate the craziness over being addicted to meds.

fuck big pharma.
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#7 eatyualive

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Posted 25 September 2012 - 05:29 PM

were'nt boomer prescribed as anti-depressants back before they were banned?

why is it that mother nature always does it best,

yet we constantly attempt to find better ways?

must be curiosity haha



addiction pays. better ways? maybe just more profitable ways..

#8 LilBear

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Posted 25 September 2012 - 05:42 PM

its pretty much one of the worst evils capitalism created (big pharm)

you all know about the poppy farms in afghanistan?

the CIA coke smuggling ring?

the acres and acres big pharm has in the green triangle?

americas become just one big scam

and big pharms one of the main pushers

(id find the links for you guys, but im pretty sure you all already know haha)

#9 MycoDani

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Posted 25 September 2012 - 05:49 PM

Addiction definitely pays especially when your meds cost thousands of dollars. I used to be on a brand name pain med before I got off and it was thousands it was sickening! Not only was it sickening when I was taking them but to get off you have to pay to get off. Sad thing they don't want you to get off.

I remember saying to my Doc why can't I just take a short acting med? No, you have to be on a long acting one too. WTF I think I know what's good for my body. Nowadays though there is a pill for everything and I was guilty for believing it a long time ago. Today I have come to my senses and hope others do as well. It's a nasty game there playing with human lives.

When they test it's always on men mostly too white about 150lbs non significant medical history. Now how the heck is that going to tell you how a drug works?!?!? And don't even get me started on modeling it's sick and should be done away with because IT'S STUPID!!! There are better ways to test a drugs efficacy but we don't do that now do we. Our policy as well as other countries some have a worse policy than the U.S. and it's sickening to see all around!

#10 Alder Logs

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Posted 26 September 2012 - 11:20 AM

Gosh, I wonder why they call him (the former head of Eli Lilly, not to mention the CIA) "Poppy" Bush?

#11 LilBear

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Posted 26 September 2012 - 12:29 PM

Additionally, of course all medicine comes from nature btw

we can't create matter.

its merely a matter of scale, on one end there's the all-mother in her purity, on the other, there's us, and the more our fingers dig in, in dirty fashion, the dirtier the outcome.

#12 darkeyesabove

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Posted 26 September 2012 - 12:35 PM

You say that we cannot create matter, and in this you are correct, however we can create synthetic substances in laboratories from basic chemical building blocks that are technically not in any way derived from nature. Most of the medicines they prescribe these days are made this way, including many popular opiate narcotics. this is because they can modify the chemical structures in such a way that changes the overall effect of the drug, such as in synthetic opiates, lessening the pleasure center euphoric effects, and increasing the pain receptor binding effect.

basically they're designer drugs, designed for a specific purpose and are in no way derived from, or in fact found in any form in nature, so I personally would call them completely unnatural.

stick with what grows from the ground, you'll live a lot longer, lol.
peace

#13 LilBear

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Posted 26 September 2012 - 12:41 PM

yeah of course your right haha

again, matter of scale/perspective on the debate of whether or not to include individual molecules and particles and such in the concept of "natural"

I would say those such molecules created by man would be the extreme of the man side of the scale (most opposite of nature, but still technically coming from nature, my opinion/perspective thats all haha)

I fully concur with sticking to what comes out of the ground, with maybe some basic purifying processes/extractions allowed (easier to ship, basically nothing that changes the nature of the beast)

but I thought heroin was just an extraction of poppy, like all opiates? just most pure? uneducated here so excuse my ignorance, please haha :rasta:

or something like, the core material the heroin process starts out with is entirely natural, and we just manipulate it to suit our needs.. sorry, wants haha

its actually kind of a really interesting and intricate topic, the definition of natural ( i get off on thinking about this stuff, so forgive me if i accidentally derail the thread hahaha)

#14 darkeyesabove

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Posted 26 September 2012 - 12:51 PM

heroin is an extraction from refined opium and is actually a very highly processed chemical. This is much more closely derived from nature than many chemicals doctors push on people, and having used it a very long time ago I can tell you that although it is probably the 3rd worst recreational drug you could ever use, I would do it again before I would ever touch some of the pills they have on the market now a days. These lawsuits and recalls are getting more and more common because the drugs are becoming more and more specialized and synthetic, and they are doing less and less testing, meaning that they have specialized engineered compounds that they do not know the long term effects of usage and they dont really care, because the purpose of the product is to generate revenue, not improve lives.

And the differentiation of man made vs. natural boils down to this, does it appear in that form in nature? If not doesn't then it is man-made doesn't matter if what it is made from comes from nature, the end result is unnatural and in the case of chemicals, this usually means it is bad... usually.

Dont-Panic-Its-Organic.jpg

Feeling depressed? fuck antidepressants and painkillers and alcohol, just go roll a fatty. :rasta:
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#15 MungoFungo

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Posted 26 September 2012 - 01:35 PM

I don't even take aspirin. If i didn' t make it. I ain't eating it..

#16 LilBear

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Posted 26 September 2012 - 01:39 PM

You have beautifully proved the wonderful belief that everything in life, including life itself, is as simple or as complicated as you wish to make it

which you have reminded me of, thank you :lol::hippie:


It's all in the definition haha

either way, we agree that the more human intervention is required in the creation of object A the less natural it is, typically resulting in a far less perfect/balanced substance than what mother nature already gives us haha

lez smoke our anti-depressants and ADD medications


same shit mung haha

#17 darkeyesabove

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Posted 26 September 2012 - 02:02 PM

You have beautifully proved the wonderful belief that everything in life, including life itself, is as simple or as complicated as you wish to make it

which you have reminded me of, thank you :lol::hippie:


It's all in the definition haha

either way, we agree that the more human intervention is required in the creation of object A the less natural it is, typically resulting in a far less perfect/balanced substance than what mother nature already gives us haha

lez smoke our anti-depressants and ADD medications


same shit mung haha


I personally believe that all things in life are both ridiculously simple and extremely complicated simultaneously and IMHO that is a very beautiful thing.

Mother nature has taken care of us from the start, and until governments started making regulations and restricting out ability to rely on her, the earth was all we needed.

The fruits of the earth are all we need, hopefully people will someday realize this again.

#18 dead_diver

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Posted 26 September 2012 - 02:06 PM

I get a kick out of the disclaimers on pharm commercials. The side effects from the cure always sound worse than the disease. Some day I'm going to turn on the TV and hear something like..."Fukitol may cause side effects such as explosive diarrhea followed immediatly with sudden death. If you experience these symptoms call your coroner as soon as possible"

#19 dead_diver

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Posted 26 September 2012 - 02:10 PM

"...I personally believe that all things in life are both ridiculously simple and extremely complicated simultaneously..."

That reminded me of a Dr. Seuss quote... “Sometimes the questions are complicated and the answers are simple.”

#20 darkeyesabove

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Posted 26 September 2012 - 02:21 PM

That reminded me of a Dr. Seuss quote... “Sometimes the questions are complicated and the answers are simple.”


He was an undeniable genius and a personal hero of mine. thank you :D




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