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No Amount of Alcohol is Safe


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#21 riseabovethought

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Posted 20 June 2014 - 02:00 PM

I think the reason the article was called, 'NO AMOUNT OF ALCOHOL IS SAFE' is because its directed at Oncologists and its in regards to patient care, so yes its a blanket statement but it isnt an article meant for the main stream public, so isnt really trying to deceive anyone with commercialism.

 

I think its hard to imagine how bad it really is, as long as we hold onto these cultural traditions that mostly do a lot of harm while masquerading as something good. 

 

I agree that we need to be objective and honest when we look at data like this, and mostly its a test of self- discipline, which makes it very personal. 


Edited by riseabovethought, 20 June 2014 - 03:09 PM.


#22 Spooner

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Posted 20 June 2014 - 02:51 PM

Rock on dude. and educate yourself, but some of this is just foolish drivel, whether it is meant for you, me or an Oncologist.

For example, this tautology, "For the cancers that have been identified as being causally linked with alcohol, we are absolutely certain that alcohol causes these cancers," says Dr. Rehm.

 

If A is causally linked to B, then A causes B.

Can you really get any useful knowledge from such a sentence?  

 

I am not suggesting that you drink, merely that hyperbole and rhetorical tricks are counter productive to gaining accurate and useful knowledge.


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#23 MrGumball

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Posted 20 June 2014 - 03:07 PM

 


 

"Responsible drinking" has become a 21st-century mantra for how most people view alcohol consumption. But when it comes to cancer, no amount of alcohol is safe.[1] That is the conclusion of the 2014 World Cancer Report (WCR), issued by the World Health Organization's International Agency for Research on Cancer (IARC).

 

 

Critique 134: Comments on “Section 2.3, Alcohol Consumption,” from the “World Cancer Report 2014” issued by the World Health Organization – 11 February 2014

 

The following is a critique by Members of the International Scientific Forum on Alcohol Research of the section on alcohol consumption (Section 2.3) included in the “World Cancer Report 2014,”(1) released on 3 February 2014 by the World Health Organization.

 

From reading this report, it is clear that the conclusion of the authors is that all alcohol consumption is harmful, regardless of the amount consumed, the type of beverage, or the pattern of drinking.  Indeed, epidemiological data clearly show that heavy alcohol consumption and “binge” drinking are associated with many adverse effects (and would never be advised by responsible agencies).  However, the WHO seriously undermines its credibility by publishing a report that seems to deliberately ignore overwhelming scientific evidence showing that light-to-moderate consumption of alcohol not only reduces overall mortality but is usually not associated with an increased risk of cancer.  The casual reader of this report would assume that “alcohol” (not just heavy drinking) is the leading cause of death throughout the world, although the authors do state that malignant neoplasms attributable to alcohol represent less than 1% of all deaths (0.4% of all deaths of women and 0.8% of all deaths of men).

 

Research cited in the WHO report:  It appears that the authors have been very selective in choosing the data upon which they base their conclusions, often citing their own work and ignoring thousands of scientific articles relating alcohol consumption to cancer rates and mortality.  For example, while the authors of the WHO report cite alcohol as a factor for colorectal cancer, a recent analysis from the very large Women’s Health Study/Health Professional’s Study on alcohol and colorectal cancer(2) showed that after 1998, when dietary folate was increased in the USA, there has been no significant relation between alcohol and colorectal cancer.  While the authors of the WHO report state that “Alcohol consumption is related to more than 200 ICD 10 code diseases . . . including diabetes and cardiovascular diseases,” they do not indicate that essentially all epidemiologic studies show a decrease in the incidence of Type 2 diabetes and essentially every type of vascular disease among moderate drinkers. 

When references are given in the WHO report related to cancers for which the risk is decreased by alcohol (e.g., renal, lymphoid malignancies), the authors state: “These apparently protective observed effects should be interpreted with caution since the biological mechanisms are not understood and confounding and/or misclassification of abstainers may be responsible for the observations that have been made.”  They do not indicate that similar caution may be warranted for epidemiologic studies showing adverse effects of alcohol.

No mention is made in the WHO report of beverage-specific differences, although epidemiologic studies for many decades [e.g., Klatsky et al(3); Grønbæk et al(4)] have shown that cardiovascular disease risk is lower among consumers of wine than of other beverages.  Further, Grønbæk et al(5) and others have shown lower cancer mortality for wine consumers than for other drinkers.  Hundreds of experimental studies[e.g., (6,7)]  have demonstrated anti-cancer activity of the polyphenols in wine, adding plausibility to the epidemiologic results.

 

Effects of alcohol on mortality:  The authors of the WHO report present little discussion of the relation of alcohol to mortality, either cancer related or all-cause mortality.  In addition to the study by Grønbæk et al,(5) a recent report on more than 50,000 cancer deaths(8) showed no increase in the risk of cancer death for “moderate” drinkers (those reporting 1-3 drinks/day) when compared with non-drinkers, and significantly decreased risk of all-cause mortality.  Indeed, almost all prospective studies have shown that non-drinkers, even lifetime abstainers, die at an earlier age than do moderate drinkers.

It is also surprising that the authors fail to mention another recent paper, co-authored by Rehm (the first author of the new WHO report), that presented data showing that the lowest total mortality risk over 12 years in the very large European Prospective Investigation into Cancer and Nutrition (EPIC) study was found among men and women who consumed moderate amounts of alcohol.(9)  Further, in a recent study of women with invasive breast cancer, those who consumed alcohol after developing their cancer had no increased risk of dying of breast cancer, and a significantly lower risk of all-cause mortality;(10) the editorial accompanying this paper concluded: “Based on the best available evidence, including [the present report(10)], it appears that modest alcohol consumption after breast cancer diagnosis, up to approximately one drink per day on average, may be associated with optimal overall survival, without compromising breast cancer-specific survival.”(11)     

 

Need for a balanced message on alcohol and health:  Excessive and binge drinking in young people is a growing scourge in many parts of the world, and alcohol consumption (especially in conjunction with smoking) clearly increases the risk of upper aero-digestive cancers; further, even moderate consumption is associated with a slight increase in the risk of breast cancer in women.  However, the scare tactics condemning all alcohol consumption in the WHO report tend to obscure those important messages.  A more scientific and balanced opinion on the topic was recently published by Banks:(12); instead of focusing so completely on warning about the adverse health effects of abusive drinking, Banks presented a scientifically valid and balanced view that concluded: “The evidence . . . indicates that, in later life, on average and bearing in mind the priorities and risks of specific individuals, drinking at least some alcohol, but not too much, is likely to minimize the overall risk of death.(12)” 

It is the opinion of our Forum that WHO, in the alcohol section of its new publication World Cancer Report 2014, has not provided an objective and balanced report on alcohol and cancer based on scientific data.  Instead, it has issued paternalistic blanket condemnations against alcohol, and recommends approaches for reducing availability of alcohol to the general population rather than  those that focus on binge drinkers and others who misuse alcohol.  By doing so, WHO has lost credibility and, more importantly, has missed a key opportunity to convey important messages about alcohol and cancer that could lead to appropriate recommendations to help improve the health of the public.

 

References for these comments

  1. Rehm J, Shield K.  Section 2.3, Alcohol Consumption, from World Cancer Report 2014, pp. 97-106, released 3 February 2014 by IARC (International Agency for Research on Cancer), of the World Health Organization, available at https://www.dropbox....d04p/1rJYaiL1Kw.
  2. Nan H, Lee JE,  Rimm EB, Fuchs CS, et al.  Prospective study of alcohol consumption and the risk of colorectal cancer before and after folic acid fortification in the United States.  Annals of Epidemiology 2013;23:558-563.
  3. Klatsky AL, Armsttrong MA.  Alcohol beverage choice and risk of coronary artery disease mortality: do red wine drinkers fare best?  Am J Cardiol 1993;71:467-469.
  4. Grønbæk M, Deis A, Sørensen TL, et al.  Mortality associated with moderate intake of wine, beer, or spirits.  BMJ 1995;l310:1165-1169.  
  5. Grønbæk M, Becker U, Johansen D, et al.  Type of alcohol consumed and mortality from all causes, coronary heart disease, and cancer.  Ann Intern Med 2000;133:411-419.
  6. Clifford AJ, S.E. Ebeler SE. EbelerJD, et al.  1996. Delayed tumor onset in transgenic mice fed an amino-acid diet supplemented with red wine solids.  Am J Clin Nutr 1996;64:748-756.
  7. Barron CC, Moore J, Tsakiridis T, et al,  Inhibition of human lung cancer cell proliferation and survival by wine, Cancer Cell International 2014;14:6; doi:10.1186/1475-2867-14-6.
  8. Jin M, Cai S, Guo J, Zhu Y, et al.  Alcohol drinking and all cancer mortality: a meta-analysis. Ann Oncol 2013;24:807-816. doi: 10.1093/annonc/mds508.
  9. Bergmann MM, Rehm J, Klipstein-Grobusch K, et al (38 authors).  The association of pattern of lifetime alcohol use and cause of death in the European Prospective Investigation into Cancer and Nutrition (EPIC) study.  Int J Epidemiol 2013;42:1772-1790.
  10. Newcomb PA, Kampman E, Trentham-Dietz A, et al.  Alcohol consumption before and after breast cancer diagnosis: Associations with survival from breast cancer, cardiovascular disease, and other causes.  J Clin Oncol 2013; jco.ascopubs.org/cgi/doi/10.1200/JCO.2012.46.5765.
  11. Demark-Wahnefried W.  To your health: How does the latest research on alcohol and breast cancer inform clinical practice?  J Clin Oncol 2013;  jco.ascopubs.org/cgi/doi/10.1200/JCO.2013.490466.
  12. Banks E.  Commentary: Lifetime alcohol consumption and mortality: have some, but not too much. Int J Epidemiol 2013;42:1790–1792; doi:10.1093/ije/dyt218

Forum Summary

A recently released report by IARC (International Agency for Research on Cancer) of the World Health Organization, entitled World Cancer Report 2014,” includes a section on alcohol consumption as a factor in the etiology of cancer.  From reading this report, it is clear that the conclusion of the authors is that all alcohol consumption is harmful, regardless of the amount consumed, the type of beverage, or the pattern of drinking.  The members of the International Scientific Forum on Alcohol Research (the Forum) have real concerns about the WHO report. 

 

It appears that the authors have been very selective in choosing the data upon which they base their conclusions, often citing their own work and ignoring thousands of scientific articles relating alcohol consumption to cancer rates and mortality.  The report fails to discuss potential lower risks of cancer associated with polyphenols in wine and some other beverages.   It ignores the consistent finding in almost all prospective epidemiologic studies over many decades that total mortality rates are lower among light-to-moderate alcohol consumers (and recent evidence suggests that this may even be true among people with cancer).  

 

Members of the Forum strongly agree that heavy alcohol consumption and “binge” drinking are associated with many adverse effects (and would never be advised by responsible agencies).  However, the WHO report seriously undermines its credibility by publishing a report that seems to deliberately ignore overwhelming scientific evidence showing that light-to-moderate consumption of alcohol not only reduces overall mortality but is usually not associated with an increased risk of cancer. 

 

Excessive and binge drinking in young people is a growing scourge in many parts of the world, and alcohol consumption (especially in conjunction with smoking) clearly increases the risk of upper aero-digestive cancers; further, even moderate consumption is associated with a slight increase in the risk of breast cancer in women.  However, the scare tactics condemning all alcohol consumption in the WHO report tend to obscure those important messages. 

 

It is the opinion of our Forum that WHO, in the alcohol section of its new publication World Cancer Report 2014, has not provided an objective statement on alcohol and cancer based on current scientific data.  By doing so, WHO has lost credibility and, more importantly, has missed a key opportunity to convey important focused messages about alcohol and cancer that would be more likely to improve the health of the public.

 

From:  http://www.bu.edu/al...-february-2014/


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#24 riseabovethought

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Posted 20 June 2014 - 03:16 PM

I stand corrected.  I will now enjoy my drink.  Thank you :cool:


Edited by riseabovethought, 20 June 2014 - 03:20 PM.


#25 Spooner

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Posted 20 June 2014 - 03:24 PM

Thanks MrGumball. my sense of balance has returned.


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#26 1967FordTitus

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Posted 20 June 2014 - 03:33 PM

I don't drink, but barkeep, this rounds on me!
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#27 Ricky Bobby

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Posted 20 June 2014 - 05:57 PM

Everything in moderation folks.
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#28 Blueringer

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Posted 20 June 2014 - 06:30 PM

I dont drink, I turn drinks away all the time. Someone has to get these drunks home safe!!


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#29 nomadicAI

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Posted 21 June 2014 - 07:34 AM

Thanks for the rebuttal MrGumball!

 

Personally, I can still stand to benefit from some moderation though.

 

I easily pack away more than 3 drinks in an evening. Less than 3 hardly even gives me a buzz... :tongue:

 

My expanding waistline says it all really. :blush:


Edited by nomadicAI, 21 June 2014 - 07:39 AM.

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#30 August West

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Posted 21 June 2014 - 04:43 PM

I would like to point out that, though nobody has explicitly said it, there seems to be some alluding to the idea that the most recent study or critique of a study is the end-all. Clearly, that's not how that works. There are many ways and reasons for an organization to come to a certain conclusion, regardless of what scientific fundamentalists would have you believe.
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#31 Heirloom

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Posted 29 June 2014 - 09:48 PM

good read. I need to quit drinking.



#32 torn2bits

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Posted 30 June 2014 - 10:58 AM

Alcohol is just yeast piss, so I am not particularly a fan of consuming it.

I was raised to know my family has a genetic predisposition for alcoholism,so ny mother taught me this from a young age....

So I never drank much at all....I just was taught not to, but I taught myself to fall in love with Marijuana....

True story...TORN2BITS
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#33 warriorsoul

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Posted 30 June 2014 - 11:25 AM

"The report fails to discuss potential lower risks of cancer associated with polyphenols in wine and some other beverages.   It ignores the consistent finding in almost all prospective epidemiologic studies over many decades that total mortality rates are lower among light-to-moderate alcohol consumers (and recent evidence suggests that this may even be true among people with cancer)."

 

That may be true, however, to imply that it is the alcohol giving the benifits is also wrong. The alcohol could be reducing stress which contributes to the health of other bodily systems. Many times stress is the real killer, however, there are more effective ways to deal with stress long term than consuming alcohol. The subject is not quite as black and white as some people would like to think. If you're looking for a reason to have that next drink, don't kid yourself.


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#34 riseabovethought

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Posted 14 August 2014 - 12:04 PM

Alcohol slows down brain activity.  Thats all I keep thinking, in disgust.  What a kick in the nuts to be addicted to something that slows down brain activity.  Fuck that!  I bet it was a primary factor in Robin Williams' suicide.  I bet its a primary factor in most suicide.  I mean depression kind of is the definition of restricting brain activity, isnt it?  If you wanted to create depression, you'd use alcohol over a steady period of time.

 

 Ibogaine convinced me that I always have the choice to buy it and drink it or not.  Plus you stink when you drink.  And alcoholic beverages contain many poisons like arsenic, benzene, cadmium, ethanol, formaldehyde, lead, and most harmful of all - Acetaldehyde.  Why are we drinking these poisons regularly, cheersing, and celebrating with a toxic central nervous system depressant? 

 

-So, I gave it up.  Cannabis is so much better without alcohol interfering. 

 

I wish Robin Williams would have gave up drinking instead of ending his life.  Tragically, even he in the end, fell for the ol' trap of taking life too seriously.  Then again, some things are serious, and to a genius, maybe slowing down brain activity is the most painful thing on Earth... enough to really want all sensation to end, at any cost.


Edited by riseabovethought, 14 August 2014 - 12:19 PM.


#35 SilvrHairDevil

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Posted 14 August 2014 - 02:18 PM

Today's news says that Robin had Parkinson's.


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#36 MycoDani

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Posted 15 August 2014 - 08:05 AM

I'm a fan of the Golden Mean all things in moderation is how I roll......usually ;)

Drinking though I just have never been a fan. I have so many alcoholics in my family it's not even funny. We can all say long term use can cause damage it's a reality.

In moderation not so much. Hey they just said people who consume 3000-6000 mgs of sodium a day is now healthy. Before it was keep your intake at about 1500mgs. So I take it all as a grain of salt;)

~Dani
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#37 cujoloki

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Posted 15 August 2014 - 03:19 PM

 These last two weeks ive been having a mixed drink every other night. A local distellery sells a 154 proof rum that i enjoy and which helps me

 

go to sleep. I only add oneshot (give or take) to a glass of fruit juice or monster (Monster probably isnt good either actually im sure it isnt). For

 

the sake of brevity and explaining all my actionswhich im sure yall wouldnt appreciate, my addition to this is thank you for the information RISE.

 

It is definately an eye opener and im sure is Completely logical and factualin every sense. Given your awesome and impecable sources. Ive

 

grown to know my limits and never imbibe to the point of alcohol poisoning unless it socially calls for it,as you have pointed out in meeting new

 

people and such. So i will take into account that every time i partake im increasing my risks of cancer. I also smoke flavored pipetobacco every

 

day... religously even.

 

      So the question i surmise to you is: being severly interllectual (which i admire in the fullest respect) would you agree that taking

 

cancer fighting agents (such as turkey tails and reishi extractions) as well as knowing and understanding quantum physics (knowing and

 

understandin how our bio-mindand Bio-body have relationships with everything and can change drastically any effects put upon such a entity

 

through use of the sensorium in its most ancientdefinition) would have any effect on these findings you have brought to our attention? Thank

 

you and sorry if i seem lime a nut. Probably am.
 


Edited by cujoloki, 15 August 2014 - 03:20 PM.

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#38 SilvrHairDevil

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Posted 16 August 2014 - 04:58 PM

At the risk of sounding platitudinous, Living Leads to Dying. Humankind has been using alcohol at least 12,000 years, almost as long as we've been using pot or mushrooms.

 

We all know people who should not drink, smoke, use drugs, etc. because they overdo it. We are hardwired to seek pleasure and it's difficult sometimes to stop at the place where Enough becomes Too Much because it's a blurry line.

 

However, the opposite of Too Much is not None.

 

Enjoy your sins. Enjoy your hedonism. We are here for a good time, not for a long time. Eat the sandwich.

 

You're a long time dead.


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#39 TastyBeverage

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Posted 07 September 2014 - 06:58 AM

Cancer aside, alcohol is an extremely pervasive behavioral modifier. People who drink a lot have a completely different behavioral profile as they do when abstinent. That is fact.

 

Unfortunately, as with any other drug, people tend to self medicate with it at stressful times. Funny, TR is watching something on TV and i just heard, '...people will make up all kinds of excuses to justify their behavior and their addictions...' too true.


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#40 polly_sacharride

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Posted 07 September 2014 - 11:07 AM

Years ago I barely survived a serious motorcycle accident. I was a young kid just out of high school at the time and in great health, in an instant that changed and I've never been the same since. While recovering in the hospital over the next several months I had a realization. That realization was that most of us have no idea when our time is going to be up. I could eat healthy, exercise, avoid smoking and alcohol consumption and still die at pretty much any time from an accident or something unforeseen. I decided that if there is something I enjoy doing I might as well do it while I can. I'm not trying to justify doing anything to excess though. Doing anything to excess could take away from my enjoyment of life and other things so it's not good either. Life's just too short to live in a constant state of worry over what might happen from everything we do or don't do, enjoy it while you can.






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