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#21 Alder Logs

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Posted 29 March 2017 - 12:38 PM

Why I don't buy gold or silver:

 

https://www.ethicalj...our-philosophy/

 

 

The facts about mining Gold & Silver

 

Mining is a dirty business in anyone’s language, but Gold & silver mining is particularly so – using processes that are very damaging to the environment.

 

Cyanide and heavy metal (especially mercury) poisoning of mine sites is a by-product of conventional leach mining practices and damage to the local ecology is common place thanks to workplace accidents — some of the most notorious incidents include the Baia Mare spill in northern Romania in 2000 that polluted the Danube and Tsiza rivers, Placer Dome’s Misima mine in Papua New Guinea that, in 2004, spilled cyanide into the ocean killing local marine life and the Kalgoorlie Gold Mine spillage into local groundwater in 2004.

 

To economically extract ever-decreasing supplies of raw Gold & silver, mining companies use a process called leach mining. This basically involves saturating ground-up rock with cyanide. Heavy metals, like Gold & silver, attach to the cyanide solution and can later be separated.

 

And whilst most responsible mining companies go to considerable efforts to prevent environmental damage, inevitably accidents happen. Sadly there is a very long list of accidents relating to cyanide spillages, failures of tailings dams and other industrial accidents.

 

Importantly, cyanide is only part of the problem. Industry supporters will quickly point out that cyanide biodegrades very quickly, but it’s the other heavy metals (like lead and mercury) trapped in the tailings and slurries that cause lasting damage. Add that to the fact that a lot of the world’s remaining Gold & silver deposits are located in ecologically sensitive areas and you have a recipe for disaster.

 

It also seems that economic status and legislative controls make little difference to where the damage happens. Serious accidents have been reported in several locations in Australia, New Zealand, the United States, Romania, Hungary, China, Ghana, The Republic of Congo, Papua New Guinea and many others.

 

The problem is so significant that Oxfam America and EARTHWORKS launched their No Dirty Gold campaign in 2004 — its purpose being to educate retailers and the general public about the true social and environmental cost of gold.

 

In Australia, the concept of ‘dirty gold’ is almost unheard of — and it seems even on a global scale, ‘dirty silver’ doesn’t even rate a mention (even though it’s produced using essentially the same cyanide leaching process used in gold mining).

 

Platinum

 

Most platinum comes from South Africa, the United States, Russia, South America and Canada, with South Africa and Russia producing some 60% of the total. (It’s estimated that 90% of the world’s remaining supplies are in South Africa.)

 

Like Gold & silver, platinum is a dwindling resource — and is even more difficult to recover (hence its higher price). It’s actually more plentiful in the Earth’s crust than the other two precious metals, but production volumes are only around 10% of those of Gold & around 1% of silver volumes.

 

There are three factors that make platinum hard to recover:

  • The depth of deposits (for example, the Merensky Reef is South Africa is nearly 1.5km below ground)

  • Low concentration — most platinum metals are in fine granular form, widely dispersed in the ore (on average around 2 to 3 tonnes of ore must be processed to recover enough platinum for one wedding ring); and

  • Chemical bonding with other platinum group metals. Less than half of all platinum group metals mined wind up as true platinum — and it can take five times longer than gold to extract.

On the socio-political side, South Africa is the main ‘hot bed’. Some publications report widespread dislocation and oppression of local populations, including imprisonment of dissident leaders, violent quelling of protests, destruction of crops and intentional polluting of community water supplies.

 

On the other hand, other publications (like The Times) report a beneficial local economic boom — job creation, infrastructure development, real estate value increases and the like. Either way, unlike Gold & silver, platinum has significant uses outside of jewelery (it’s an irreplaceable component in car exhaust systems for example) — so the jewelery industry is not the major production driver.

 

When it comes to ‘dirty’ Gold & silver, unfortunately there is almost no public awareness of the issue in Australia. Even inside the industry, very few jewelers are aware of the damage conventional mining of Gold & silver does to the environment.

 

`````````````````````````

 

When we buy these metals in any form, even from recyclers, we drive the market prices, and this drives more mining.  

 

Maybe it is smart, economically, but it's a big fuck you to the planet and its life.


Edited by Alder Logs, 29 March 2017 - 12:40 PM.

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#22 Heirloom

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Posted 29 March 2017 - 12:55 PM

Il19z8rn4li1 , thanks for getting back here . I understand being busy. I will watch the metals markets
especially silver. I am close to 60 yrs old so I'm not making plans for 50 yrs from now.

I really don't do any investing and know nothing about economics. My interest in Bitcoin is all about
how I can use it anonymously.

I got my wallet , went to Glidera to look into purchasing a small portion of a Bitcoin.
I stopped when they wanted my phone number and in the privacy policy they state they may collect my ssn
and other private information that I feel will strip me of the privacy I seek.

I might still fund my wallet but as of now I am in no hurry. I was told by a guy to

fund my account by insulating my self through others in who have great trust.

I have wondered if this was money laundering? I only want to buy a few seeds of my favorite plants.

I hope that is not illegal as I don't want to break the law but only keep my privacy and be anonymous.
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#23 Il19z8rn4li1

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Posted 29 March 2017 - 02:39 PM

Il19z8rn4li1 , thanks for getting back here . I understand being busy. I will watch the metals markets
especially silver. I am close to 60 yrs old so I'm not making plans for 50 yrs from now.

I really don't do any investing and know nothing about economics. My interest in Bitcoin is all about
how I can use it anonymously.

I got my wallet , went to Glidera to look into purchasing a small portion of a Bitcoin.
I stopped when they wanted my phone number and in the privacy policy they state they may collect my ssn
and other private information that I feel will strip me of the privacy I seek.

I might still fund my wallet but as of now I am in no hurry. I was told by a guy to

fund my account by insulating my self through others in who have great trust.

I have wondered if this was money laundering? I only want to buy a few seeds of my favorite plants.

I hope that is not illegal as I don't want to break the law but only keep my privacy and be anonymous.

 

 

Allow me to be a little more kind about my age comment.

My soul purpose of accruing silver and cryptos are as a retention of wealth, which metals have proven for thousands

of years to be exactly that, I doubt it will change in the next 100 yrs lol 

The cryptos are for similar purpose, but they are a little more unique and are of digital worlds with

many uses in that realm.   It can be used as a wealth holdings, which is risky business... or as just a

form of currency to purchase things.

 

When I recommend people buy silver or cryptos, im referring to long term holdings.

 

But surely, the cryptos can be used as a currency right now, which is an amazing thing and frankly..

will only strengthen that crypto because of its acceptance and use and conditions around it. 

 

currently.. in order to get into the crypto field... without having to use any of your information... is to use

a shady site to buy Bitcoins... which then can be traded into any other coin via an Exchange.

 

Coinbase is a very solid site.. US based and you can buy both Ether and Bitcoin from them... 

 

shit isnt user friendly like I said.. its EASY STUFF.. just kinda different then what I was used to. 

 

 

you can use blockchain.com and buy BTC... but youll have to give up all your information.

Me personally.. i gave up all that stuff long ago lol.. F it.

 

 

But that might be the only spot of entrance that ties you to that BITCOIN... if you swap it into a different coin...

that is private... well.. your anonymous now. 

 

 

me personally.. im not really concerned about that stuff really... PERSONALLY...

im heavily invested in these coins.. BECAUSE im banking on that fact that the gambling websites... and all

the criminals use these coins to hide their money.. which should increase the value of that coin...

thats exactly what happend with BITCOIN in the beginning when people thought it was private. 

 

Once a truly private coin comes out... you can bet your bottom dollar the bad guys will exploit it and ill

be sitting back just racking in gains... all the while happily going to the bank... and filling out my necessary forms...

pay my 30% tax.. and be like.. Boom.. no work required lol.  :P 

thats my vision... that will happen ;)


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#24 Heirloom

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Posted 29 March 2017 - 03:16 PM

Il19z8rn4li1, I think I will stick to mining metals verses bitcoins.

I now see cash as more anonymous than crypto currency and metals as safer
as they are " real ".

Metals can be mined even in an urban area through recycling.

Alder I missed your post before but like it I am reminded of the dangers of mining , anything.
I am somewhat aware of the mercury, Cyanide and other poisoning taking place in mining.

The mercury poisoning of the oceans is mainly from coal. I am disgusted that humans poisoned
the oceans.

I live in an area that has been mined for coal and strip mined, Non of us know if we living on top of an old coal mine tunnel's here.

I would still like to pan for gold in a river or stream on a camping trip.

I don't think bartering for goods is over but instead going to see a great revival. Food is worth more than gold.Solar panels worth more than a generator. Wood for cooking, building more than paper money.

Edited by Heirloom Spores, 29 March 2017 - 03:16 PM.

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#25 Alder Logs

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Posted 29 March 2017 - 03:50 PM

 

I would still like to pan for gold in a river or stream on a camping trip.

 

That's the way to do it, all right. 

 

I have nothing but a savings account and will probably take a bath when the dollar fails.  I don't know how to invest.  I thought about buying copper at one point, but I have seen the open pit at Morenci, AZ.  As far as silver and gold go, I have traveled the Rocky Mountains and seen creeks just like this:

 

Rio_tinto_river_CarolStoker_NASA_Ames_Re

 

Doesn't make you want to camp and pan there, does it.  This is what happens when mine shafts fill with water and that water finds its way to the surface. 


Edited by Alder Logs, 29 March 2017 - 03:52 PM.

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#26 Spooner

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Posted 29 March 2017 - 05:37 PM

Recommended reading "Extraordinary Popular Delusions and the Madness of Crowds" for anyone interested in high return high risk, rapid appreciation investments.  The Housing Bubble and Dot.Com bubble are the closest bubbles for most to remember, but bubbles happen all throughout history, and are as funny as they are instructional.  The best $5 ebay investment you cans make, is  this book first published in 1841.

 

https://www.youtube....h?v=diEVmQZ1QfM

 

Link is an animated retelling of the chapter on the Mississippi Bubble and is very instructive as to crashes caused by printing too many Federal Reserve Notes.  The system must fail like any Ponzi scheme.

Bubbles are Ponzi schemes, but fiat currency is also just a Government controlled Ponzi scheme.  Both must fail because the foundation is mathematically unsound.  

 

Educate yourself.


Edited by Spooner, 29 March 2017 - 05:53 PM.

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#27 Heirloom

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Posted 29 March 2017 - 05:56 PM

Thanks Alder I like being educated.

I heard about mine pollution but never seen it, now I get a better understanding.


As I think about investing in the future I know what I want clean air, water, food and good friends.
Some nice tunes would be great with my homegrown.

I could quite honestly be happy to live in a cave.

I went to a store today using dollars and was not asked for a photo id, ssn, phone number or anything.

We do need some money system, I can't go to the airport and buy a ticket to Washington state
with a few cattle, some chickens and a milk goat.

What if I decided to run for political office buying off people and buying a wife would present problems. I mean if it was found out I bought a wife for a few chickens and a sheep?

I value my cannabis more than the dollar is worth, same with every thing I grow.
I value a tomato more than a dollar.

Edited by Heirloom Spores, 29 March 2017 - 06:01 PM.


#28 darci

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Posted 29 March 2017 - 06:41 PM

This seems very much like a pyramid or ponzi scheme.

 

Yeah, it looks like a great deal but eventually the whole thing collapses and goes bust.

 

If you made money in it, I would advise you to get out while you're ahead.  You never know exactly when such a thing is going to explode.



#29 Alder Logs

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Posted 29 March 2017 - 07:54 PM

Bitcoin is as secure as the electronic infrastructure, which is as secure as the NSA wants it to be at any given moment, barring a well aimed solar mass ejection, or a sky burst nuke. 


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#30 Spooner

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Posted 29 March 2017 - 08:01 PM

This seems very much like a pyramid or ponzi scheme.

 

Yeah, it looks like a great deal but eventually the whole thing collapses and goes bust.

 

If you made money in it, I would advise you to get out while you're ahead.  You never know exactly when such a thing is going to explode.

 

Exactly Darci, if you get in early and out before it crashes you can profit handsomely, but it is musical chairs or a chain letter where the real winners are the originators.  Similarly, Federal Reserve Notes are backed by nothing but have totally replaced Dollars which were once backed by gold and silver.  The only winners in this scheme are the bankers, the rest of us are screwed unless we have some hard assets like gold, silver, land, bullets, tractors, weed, or other useful tangible assets.



#31 Il19z8rn4li1

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Posted 30 March 2017 - 01:04 AM

get yourself some skills.  Never rely on an investment unless its an investment in yourself.

 

:) 


Edited by Il19z8rn4li1, 30 March 2017 - 01:04 AM.

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#32 Il19z8rn4li1

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Posted 04 May 2017 - 12:52 PM

Cryptos are doing amazing :)

 

1600 BTC

92 Ether

 

 

:)   Ive tripled my money already.   Going to still hold onto it.

 

 I anticipate 10x my initial investment :D :D :D



#33 Heirloom

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Posted 04 May 2017 - 01:33 PM

I still haven't got any bit coin, I wish I had gotten into it years ago though.

#34 papa_legba

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Posted 16 May 2017 - 02:41 PM

Il19z8rn4li1 id love someone to help teach me bitcoin. shot you a pm. thanks.

#35 CatsAndBats

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Posted 16 May 2017 - 03:11 PM

Il19z8rn4li1 id love someone to help teach me bitcoin. shot you a pm. thanks.

 

 

Look what the cat dragged in! Hey man! (i was catattack until a couple of weeks ago)

 

 

@ROT, sorry for the hijack.  :tongue:






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