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Salvia Trip:first time


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#21 TVCasualty

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Posted 23 June 2016 - 11:56 AM

any ill after effects?  coming down hard or felt heavily medicated after the 'thrill' wore off?

 

For me the after-effects were profoundly positive and lasted for weeks. It's currently being studied as a possible anti-depressant (the active molecule Salvinorin-A is, anyway). It's also the only known terpine-based hallucinogen and is active in microgram doses just like LSD.

 

Granted, as I mentioned in my trip reports I'm not sure if the therapeutic value of smoked Salvia comes from the experience itself or the fact that it ends! It can be that intense, and only Salvia and DMT have ever gotten me to the point where I could not tell if my eyes were open or not (even with the lights on...). My trips all lasted around 4-6 minutes (from blast-off to rediscovering I have something called a "body") but if someone had told me I'd been gone for 4-6 hours I would've believed them. The sheer volume of "content" that Salvia can pack into a 5 minute trip is truly astounding, and I have no trouble remembering everything I saw on those trips (which I also found surprising, considering "where" I went).

 

I should probably specify that the statements above only apply to smoking it. I've not yet tried the traditional method of chewing it yet, which is supposed to be a very different (and mellower, though longer) experience.

 

Incidentally, the people who've been using it as an entheogen for centuries in Mexico think people who smoke it are completely nuts for doing so. I also find it fascinating that (to my knowledge) no wild population of Salvia divinorum has been discovered (and people have been looking!). So far, it's only been found growing in gardens tended by shamans of local (Mesoamerican) tribes, which might be the only example of such on the planet.

 

 

For glow-sticks-and-glitter recreational party-trippers, Salvia is probably best avoided. For dedicated explorers of the outer reaches of inner space (or vice-versa, perhaps) who aren't averse to experiencing something that's potentially terrifying beyond words (e.g the Void) it's a very valuable tool to have in one's psychonautical toolbox.


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#22 niemandgeist

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Posted 23 June 2016 - 12:39 PM

For glow-sticks-and-glitter recreational party-trippers, Salvia is probably best avoided. For dedicated explorers of the outer reaches of inner space (or vice-versa, perhaps) who aren't averse to experiencing something that's potentially terrifying beyond words (e.g the Void) it's a very valuable tool to have in one's psychonautical toolbox.

 

 

 

I've tried chewing dried Salvia divinorum leaf in a big old quid, but it didn't seem to do anything at all for me. This was quite a long while back, though, likely 2005'ish. I tried a tincture and didn't have any luck with that, either.

 

The only truly other-worldly experiences I've had with Salvia divinorum came from smoking 6x extract out of a wooden pipe with a torch lighter. Using a torch lighter is pretty important, by the way; something to do with Salvinorin-A vaporizing at a much higher temperature.

 

It's pretty crazy that my first psychedelic/hallucinogenic experience ever was with Salvia divinorum and that I actually quite enjoyed it. I didn't try anything else for another year or so as far as true psychedelics go.

 

If you smoke Salvia extract you will absolutely be temporarily transported to a completely different place. One time I felt myself fall forward onto the floor of a wooden deck and I melded and began to become part of the wood from the deck. That experience was ruined by a friend watching me asking me "Are you feeling it?" over and over, despite the fact that I'd asked him to only interfere if I was going to do something to hurt myself somehow.

 

Another time the wooden fence in my backyard, along with all of the trees, began to dance around, waving left-to-right, alive and electric like neon cartoon outlines. My body also did the same thing while I walked around a bit before everything began to wear off.

 

Now that I am recalling some of these things, apart from that rhythmic jerking/pulling sensation, my pipe would always become a part of me. I'd try to take it out of my mouth after I exhaled and it really started to kick in, but it was as though it was attached to me somehow and I just couldn't remove it. I also felt the presence of many small entities that were chanting, and usually the chanting was some of the most ridiculously fucking crazy, hilarious (at the time, I could never remember what was said when I came out of it) stuff during the short-lived experience.

 

Now I sort of want to experience it again.


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#23 fungi2bwith

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Posted 23 June 2016 - 05:57 PM

I just wanted to throw this in here, I always considered salvia to be dmt's evil twin sister.....

 

I find it extremely fascinating that upon a single (good) hit, you are completely unaware that you have just consumed something. Like an instant, short lived memory wipe....


Edited by fungi2bwith, 23 June 2016 - 06:04 PM.

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#24 TVCasualty

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Posted 24 June 2016 - 11:17 AM

I just wanted to throw this in here, I always considered salvia to be dmt's evil twin sister.....

 

Once I'd experienced both I also thought of them as "related," too (in a kinship sense).

 

I don't see Salvia as "evil," though.

 

To me, DMT embodies the Universe, Light, and existence/life whereas Salvia embodies the Void, a lack of Light, and non-existence (which can be scary as hell, or even more so since "hell" is a construct that at least exists within the Universe and so is somewhat comprehensible). But "scary" doesn't automatically equate to "evil" even though most evil things tend to be frightening.

 

I refer to Salvia's darkness as a "lack of Light" to avoid conflating it with the kind of existential Darkness that can be found within the minds of entities that exist within the Universe. When Salvia shot me right out of this Universe and into the infinite Void where no-thing has Banged into yet, it was the utter lack of ANY point of reference to anything familiar at all (whether good, evil, or indifferent) that induced the existential anxiety (to put it mildly) I felt at those moments.

 

It was kind of like having a blindfold ripped off my face when I didn't even know I was wearing one, and it revealed that I was standing on the razor's edge of an unfathomable Abyss that a slight misstep could send me plummeting into, possibly forever and with no way to end it or die since I had no body to kill. It was rather intense to "realize" that I almost fell out of the Universe, but as utterly terrifying as the Abyss was to stare into, it was also apparent that it wasn't evil... it merely was. Or I guess I could say it merely was-not.

 

There would be no Universe without the Void within which it can exist. And there can be no Void without the existence of a Universe within it, which is what defines the Void (e.g. without a Universe in it, there would only "be" an infinite Void of no-thingness and so the concepts of "Universe" and "Void" would be undefined as there'd be no conscious entities around to conceive of them).

 

Or not. Heck if I know; just callin' it as I saw it...

 

 

 

And people wonder why I often refer to myself as "unsane," lol...


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#25 niemandgeist

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Posted 24 June 2016 - 09:32 PM

For me, especially since Salvia was my first true non-weed non-alcohol experience, the Salvia space was like, well...

 

It was as though I was in a place where I could see life and existence as a whole as a book, an old Tome of secret magic that I was gazing down upon. I was able to, through Salvia, to peer down onto the book and see where I was in life written out on one page, and then gently peel back a small corner of that page to peer into what was written on the next page.

 

Of course, doing this with any book wouldn't make much sense. Sure, you know what you've just been reading, but to peel back a slight corner to glance at two pages ahead, well, you can certainly tell there's a lot more there and that it's probably very interesting, but it doesn't make any damned sense.

 

At the same time, it made me really, REALLY want to find out how to TURN THE PAGE. I'd caught a glimpse of what I didn't even know existed before and that little taste didn't quite quench my thirst for knowledge.

 

So began my long and sometimes chaotic explorations into my own psyche and the nature of human existence.

 

I feel that I've mostly seen enough, given all of the various substances I've experienced over time. The mushrooms do help me to slowly come to understand some things, but nothing ever shoved it in my face in such a blatant manner as Salvia did, and she did it in a way that showed me everything, only to leave me confused, wondering what the fuck it was I just saw.

 

There was always that amnesic effect after every Salvia experience for me. I was shown so much, but it wasn't anything I could retain beyond fragments from a dream.


Edited by niemandgeist, 24 June 2016 - 09:34 PM.

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#26 TVCasualty

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Posted 25 June 2016 - 08:09 AM


There was always that amnesic effect after every Salvia experience for me. I was shown so much, but it wasn't anything I could retain beyond fragments from a dream.

 

That's interesting. When my first Salvia trip ended, I immediately began writing down as much of it as I could (as in before I was all the way back to baseline) out of a concern that I might forget some or all of it. I also drew some symbols that I saw, or rather symbols that were shown to me (how it felt anyway).

 

After a while I realized that I didn't have to do that since the experiences were burned into my memory so vividly that I'm sure I'll never forget them. That was one of the things that fascinated me about it since I have a much harder time recalling the details of strong DMT trips.

 

I wonder if that might be a function of the type of material consumed? I've only ever consumed straight leaf (1X) and my memories of it are clear and vivid. If those who have consumed concentrated extracts have a harder time recalling the experience, it may be due to the strength and for that matter it may be that such experiences are best not recalled too clearly (or at all) and the memory issue is a blessing (since inducing PTSD wouldn't be very therapeutic).

 

 

 

After rereading my earlier post about DMT vs. Salvia, it occurred to me that their relationship could be nicely summed up by a familiar symbol (and that's probably the most elegant symbol ever created anywhere in the Universe, and would be Universally recognizable and readily-understood by all self-aware entities who see it).

 

 

So instead of a bunch of text, I could've just posted this instead as a representation of the relationship between DMT and Salvia (as I see it, anyway): 

 

75px-Yin_and_Yang.svg.png

 

 

Incidentally, that's probably the symbol we should use to greet or make initial contact with any alien or otherwise-sentient, non-human entities we may encounter (whether they exist in the physical or ...somewhere else). If aliens show up and we say "hello" with that symbol, they might not simply exterminate us out of an abundance of caution.

 

I mention "other" entities because DMT and/or Salvia tend to reliably lead to the realization that any halfway-decent Cosmological model of reality must accommodate the existence of unfathomable numbers of sentient, non-human beings throughout the Universe (and on both sides of the Veil).


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#27 prof_it_e

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Posted 25 June 2016 - 12:06 PM

Interesting words getting spoken in here. When I went through a Salvia phase it made me feel like I could relate more to what Don Juan was trying to get Carlos Castaneda to experience, the sort of strangeness that is Salvia seemed to be consistent with the strangeness Carlos experienced when under the influence of what Don Juan called the 'little smoke', although, apparently it was made up of other ingredients and not of Salvia (although I wonder if that's relevant?). Anywhoo; thought I'd share the following from erowid (linked)...;

 

"BOOK REVIEW
Title: The Teachings of Don Juan, A Separate Reality, Journey to Ixtlan
Author: Carlos Castaneda
Source: Time Magazine
Date: 1973

 

..."'Did I take off like a bird?' "'You always ask me questions I cannot answer...What you want to know makes no sense. Birds fly like birds and a man who has taken the devil's weed flies as such.' "'Then I didn't really fly, Don Juan. I flew in my imagination. Where was my body?' " And so on.

By his account, the first phase of Castaneda's apprenticeship lasted from 1961 to 1965, when, terrified that he was losing his sense of reality - and by now possessing thousands of pages of notes - he broke away from Don Juan. In 1968, when The Teachings appeared, he went down to Mexico again to give the old man a copy. A second cycle of instruction then began. Gradually Castaneda realized that Don Juan's use of psychotropic plants was not an end in itself, and that the sorcerer's way could be traversed without drugs. 

But this entailed a perfect honing of the will. A man of knowledge, Don Juan insisted, could only develop by first becoming a "warrior" not literally a professional soldier, but a man wholly at one with his environment, agile, unencumbered by sentiment or "personal history". The warrior knows that each act may be his last. He is alone. Death is the root of his life, and in its constant presence he always performs "impeccably." This existential stoicism is a key idea in the books. The warrior's aim in becoming a "man of knowledge" and thus gaining membership as a sorcerer, is to "see." "Seeing," in Don Juan's system, means experiencing the world directly, grasping its essence, without interpreting it. Castaneda's second book, A Separate Reality, describes Don Juan's efforts to induce him to "see" with the aid of mushroom smoke. Journey to Ixtlan, though many of the desert experiences it recounts predate Castaneda's introduction to peyote, datura and mushrooms, deals with the second stage: "seeing" without drugs.
 

"The difficulty." says Castaneda, "is to learn to perceive with your whole body, not just with your eyes and reason. The world becomes a stream of tremendously rapid, unique events. So you must trim your body to make it a good receptor; the body is an awareness, and it must be treated impeccably." Easier said than done. Part of the training involved minutely, even piously attuning the senses to the desert, its animals and birds, its sounds and shadows, the shifts in its wind, and the places in which a shaman might confront its spirit entities: spots of power, holes of refuge. When Castaneda describes his education as a hunter and plant gatherer learning about the virtues of herbs, the trapping of rabbits, the narrative is absorbing. Don Juan and the desert enable him, sporadically and without drugs, to "see" or, as the Yaqui puts it "to stop the world." But such a state of interpretation free experience eludes description even for those who believe in Castaneda wholeheartedly..."


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#28 niemandgeist

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Posted 25 June 2016 - 12:52 PM

I can recall the brunt of my Salvia experiences, even though they occurred back in 2005 and 2006. What I'm unable to recall, however, is what the entities I felt present were chanting. I can remember in great detail every experience yet I can in no way recall what was chanted. I feel that a great part of the experience is lost because of this.

 

Salvia certainly awakened something in me and showed me what is possible within the vast reaches of the human mind. It forever changed me.


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#29 TVCasualty

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Posted 26 June 2016 - 11:40 AM

I'm kind of in the middle of the road when it comes to Castaneda's writings.

 

In an academic sense, I consider them to be purely works of fiction (which has been amply demonstrated by folks like Jonathan Ott, who really did his homework when it comes to his critique of Castaneda).

 

But I find the lexicon that Castaneda developed to express his psychedelic/spiritual ideas to be very useful since it's otherwise lacking in our rather materialist-based language and syntax. I guess someone needs to extract the useful terminology from Castaneda's books and present it in a context that's separate from the stories so as to promote broader acceptance of the terms (which is the only way for them to enter into common usage).

 

I suspect that our collective psychedelic evolution (which is distinct from a given individuals' personal psychedelic evolution) is largely dependent upon the creation of an appropriate vocabulary that we can use to talk about it.

 

Just as how a physicist from the 19th Century would not know what the heck you were talking about if you casually alluded to "nuclear fission" or any of the ~35 Elements on the Periodic Table that weren't discovered until after 1900, once such phenomena or Elements were named and described they became part of our reality and acted as evolutionary stepping stones to the next batch of currently-indescribable discoveries (and that subsequently required the creation of it's own specific lexicon and syntax to name and describe, e.g. Quantum Mechanics).

 

 

This isn't the case within one's own personal psychedelic evolution because words are only necessary to relate one's own experience to someone else and are not needed to do the actual exploring (and in fact tend to get in the way). So while an individual can explore far more deeply into Inner space than there are any words for, a common cultural understanding of such phenomena is constrained by we can talk about and describe to each other.


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#30 phlegmbae

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Posted 29 June 2016 - 01:06 PM

Ahh.... Ska de la Maria Pastura!(Salvia Divinorum) By far the most potent naturally occurring psychedelic drug known to man at this time. I've done a lot of research on it, and with it too. It's an odd looking plant, with square hollow stems, with fins on each corner. I've grown her in the past. The only place it's indigenous to in the whole world is in a very limited area of the Mazateca valley. No shit! As if it was put there by aliens. It's been taken, and grown in other places in the world such as Hawaii, but it is not indigenous anywhere but the Mazateca valley. The shaman in that area have used it for a very long time to address problems with the dead, and their loved ones. Yes, I said the dead! And imho, I can say at first it does indeed seem like you're entering the kingdom of the dead. Very startling at first, and most people find it too frightening, & profound, to ever do again. Me on the other hand, am a gluten for dark experiences just like I found with Sally D in my early explorations. Believe it or not, after you've got your Salvia legs, you can control your trips with your mind, unlike  shrooms, or LSD. Meaning if you get into a dark place you don't like, you can pull yourself out of it, and go somewhere incredibly beautiful. It does take a lot of exploration to get to this point. The reason our memories are so fleeting on the green goddess is because when you come out of it, it works on the same level as dreams. Most of us will not remember dreams unless we relate them to ourselves, or someone else as soon as we awaken. Same mechanism with Salvia. Any loud noises, like your babysitter laughing, or talking to you will pull you out of a trip also. You'll definitely get the most bang for your buck in total silence, in total darkness. Quiet urging by your babysitter will let you remain in your Salvia induced microcosm. It's a good idea to have a sitter so you don't wander somewhere that you could inadvertently get hurt. There are some commonalities to experiences on her that I've heard time and again. As I read this post, which is very interesting btw, I feel compelled to mention that most users will feel a definite female presence, taste purple, and experience vortexes, or tornados, in their psychedelic Salvia microcosm. Along with the feeling that your trip, if you remember it, was a very profound experience, and emanates from some unknown deity. Salvia is not a party drug, that's a given. The people in and around the Mazateca valley, didn't have psychotherapy, or todays anti-depressants, & other drugs our society use to treat mental illnesses. The only thing the shaman had at his/her disposal were potent mind altering naturally occurring substances, like mushrooms, & salvia divinorum to treat their constituents. It worked for them, and they've used them for millennia. They had a very high reverence for these substances, and certainly never used them for recreational purposes. Sorry for the long rant, and I'll stop here, but I could go on forever on this subject. Salvia has made me fearless when it comes to heroic doses of any other psychedelic drug, because they all pale in comparison to her.


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#31 Alder Logs

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Posted 29 June 2016 - 03:10 PM

Don't mind the long rants.  Do mind the long paragraphs though. 

 

Do feel free to tell us more, with lots of paragraph breaks. of course.


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#32 SteampunkScientist

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Posted 29 June 2016 - 05:58 PM

Phlegmbae, excellent post! You described many of the experiences I had, especially the purple and the female, almost motherly presence! Cool.

#33 AwolMind

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Posted 14 August 2016 - 07:44 AM

This substance obviously demands a huge amount of respect. I'm curious about whether anyone has ever taken a puff of it while on mushrooms or anything else though. I'm pretty sure Terence McKenna used to recommend smoking Syrian Rue while a low dose of cubes, has anyone tried this but with salvia?

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#34 gatekeeper

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Posted 17 August 2016 - 12:39 AM

 

This substance obviously demands a huge amount of respect. I'm curious about whether anyone has ever taken a puff of it while on mushrooms or anything else though. I'm pretty sure Terence McKenna used to recommend smoking Syrian Rue while a low dose of cubes, has anyone tried this but with salvia?

 

Salvia was the first psychoactive anything I ever tried, got plenty of stories lol. Never tried it with shrooms, but I once mixed 10x salvia, wild dagga and some incense (fake bake, synthetic marijuana, whatever name it goes by now) a few years back. Very intense, eventually my vision was narrowed down to a tiny viewhole and everything else was roaring colors. My friends kept asking if I was OK, but as I couldn't see them I just heard there voices coming out of no where so I assumed it was my unconscious trying to tell me to sober up so I just stood up and took of running which needless to say is a terrible idea if you can barely see in front of you. In any case, if you mix it with anything be prepared.

 

Personally I don't touch the stuff anymore, mainly because someone handed me a bowl of it once and told me it was weed which was an interesting surprise. You just never know where it will take you. I've seen people have a lot of fun with it, and I've seen people freak out on it. Once had to drag in a friend of mine who ran out of his dorm room after smoking some. Very awkward, he thought we were demons dragging him to hell and kept trying to grab all the grass in the yard when we were just trying to get him back in doors, luckily no one in the dorm was up to see the spectacle which i'm sure was pretty funny from an outside perspective.


Edited by gatekeeper, 17 August 2016 - 12:44 AM.


#35 TVCasualty

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Posted 17 August 2016 - 07:18 AM

 

 

This substance obviously demands a huge amount of respect. I'm curious about whether anyone has ever taken a puff of it while on mushrooms or anything else though. I'm pretty sure Terence McKenna used to recommend smoking Syrian Rue while a low dose of cubes, has anyone tried this but with salvia?

 

 so I just stood up and took of running which needless to say is a terrible idea if you can barely see in front of you.

 

I could see the potential for taking a nice long walk (or run) in the dissociated state that a full Salvia breakthrough tends to manifest, which is why I decided to only smoke it indoors in total darkness.

 

I figured if whatever part of me that was still aware enough of my physical surroundings to allow standing/walking could not perceive any external physical surroundings then I'd have a much lower chance of taking a walk. So far that seems to have worked, and while I've come "back" to find myself completely turned-around on my bed (e.g. my feet were on my pillow one time, which left me a bit puzzled) and utterly astonished to find that I was still in my house at all, I've always ended up on the same bed I departed from.

 

If you can't make it completely dark, put some small wedges into your bedroom door (and maybe your exterior doors as well, just to be sure) so that you can't open it without removing them, which becomes really difficult to do while in a dissociative state (unlike turning the knob to open the door, which is deeply ingrained in our 'muscle memory' and so requires no abstract reasoning skills).

 

 

Incidentally, a couple of small hardwood wedges stuck between the door jamb and the door are a great security measure when staying in a hotel (or anywhere else where you don't trust the locks, or can't be sure that no one else has a key). Keep some stashed in your luggage or whatever you normally travel with and you'll always have 'em handy. And always stay on the second (or higher) floor in high-crime areas... And don't do Salvia in hotel rooms! (whew, back on topic!)


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#36 SteampunkScientist

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Posted 17 August 2016 - 02:10 PM

Incidentally, a couple of small hardwood wedges stuck between the door jamb and the door are a great security measure when staying in a hotel (or anywhere else where you don't trust the locks, or can't be sure that no one else has a key). Keep some stashed in your luggage or whatever you normally travel with and you'll always have 'em handy. And always stay on the second (or higher) floor in high-crime areas... And don't do Salvia in hotel rooms! (whew, back on topic!)

 

Yup, you just need those extra few milliseconds to pull out the Glock.



#37 AwolMind

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Posted 17 August 2016 - 09:11 PM

Those are some interesting stories for sure, Gatekeeper.

 

I like the door stop idea because I prefer tripping alone, no matter the substance, and whenever I have someone around to keep me from leaving it always distracts me too much and completely messes up the trip.

I won't be getting my hands on any salvia anytime soon, which is alright with me because mushrooms definitely do the job! 



#38 BecomeTheOther

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Posted 17 September 2016 - 03:02 PM

Love salvia, and encourage all to grow it. The difference between cultivating a plant lovingly and developing a relationship with it as apposed to store bought salvia, is a huge difference. I can understand the experiences much better now and salvia has become one of my foremost companions

#39 Pan1

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Posted 19 September 2016 - 05:55 AM

Love salvia, and encourage all to grow it. The difference between cultivating a plant lovingly and developing a relationship with it as apposed to store bought salvia, is a huge difference. I can understand the experiences much better now and salvia has become one of my foremost companions

 

Hate to high jack steampunks post. But will it work with just regular leaf? I only had it work once and it was 10X 20X extract or whatever. Salvia is now illegal in my country, but i may be able to get a cutting or seeds, just curious if your using raw leaf or extracting?


Edited by Pan1, 19 September 2016 - 06:18 AM.

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#40 TVCasualty

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Posted 23 September 2016 - 05:37 PM

 


 

Hate to high jack steampunks post. But will it work with just regular leaf? I only had it work once and it was 10X 20X extract or whatever. Salvia is now illegal in my country, but i may be able to get a cutting or seeds, just curious if your using raw leaf or extracting?

 

 

I've only ever used straight leaf, and that was PLENTY (for my first time, I smoked a gram of it with a butane torch since high-heat works better, unlike with cannabis). Also, there's a weird reverse-tolerance effect with it so it took 2/3 as much to get to the same place on later trips, even when the trips were years apart (from the same stash!). Next time it might only take a half-gram, but it's only been 3 years since my last trip so it might be a while until my next one (once every 5-8 years seems to be quite enough).

 

So maybe try smoking more straight leaf, and use a torch instead of a lighter.


Edited by TVCasualty, 23 September 2016 - 05:37 PM.

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